What’s the general MN verdict on donor eggs?

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The general critical re-examination of surrogacy is quite evident, and I have my own views on that, which I’ll keep quiet for the purposes of this thread.

Now I find myself chewing over other fertility treatment. I’ve had fertility treatment myself and so have family members. So I have a sense of how private clinics put you on a conveyor belt and normalise things.

What is the general view on donor eggs & embryos (implanted into the birth mother and gestated by her)?

Im trying really hard not to bias the result so have tossed a coin to assign YABU/YANBU to viewpoints. Don’t read into that.

YANBU = Donor gametes are ethically fine.
YABU = Donor gametes are problematic.

So basically all women who want children need to be in a loving heterosexual relationship to have children?

That's extraordinary homophobic.

Homophobic! It's extraordinarily homophobic.

Good god when is mn going to sort out this quoting issue

I have long term infertility and have done a lot of research into the views of donor conceived adults in case it’s a route we go down in the future.

I’ve wrestled with whether it’s fair on the children but having done the research I feel pretty comfortable now that donor conception is not harmful in itself, though certain aspects of it are. Namely secrecy and finding out late, and having a totally anonymous donor. Those who have known their whole life and have info or a relationship with the donor seem well adjusted about it. I’ve even come across donor conceived adults who used a donor themselves to conceive their children.

What is also is harmful is the stigma around it, and to be honest I think threads like this just perpetuate that. You are inviting people to be judgemental about a very sensitive topic. It’s not a binary ‘AIBU’ or not.

Oops. There's an update. Apologies

I had some fertility problems but the one thing i always knew was that i didn't want donor eggs unless they came from my sister. I needed a connection. I didn't want a baby, I wanted mine. I concluded that I would rather be a brilliant, involved auntie to my siblings kids than go down the donor route.

Maybe I would have felt differently if I didnt already have a niece and nephew I loved, maybe I wouldnt have felt the same 10 years later and still childless (as it happened, I did conceive).

I completely respect everyone else's feelings choices though, as long as they are choices and not poor people exploited for money.

The policy was very much considered though, certainly in the uk. The HFEA was founded in 1990 - surely that was recognition that it was mainstream.

I remember that thread - I wonder what the outcome was? I really felt for the sister who had done a wonderful thing but only expected one child to come the process.

I don’t think so. I think a parent should know both of their biological parents. Ideally people in same sex relationships would find a donor who also wanted to be a parent and make it work.

I know one person conceived by sperm donor to a mum who is a lesbian. She had him quite late in life - 42/43 I think - so she’s his entire family. She’s also… not the most caring mum shall we say, I think she has had a very problematic life. I really worry for him. I remember her refusing to seek medical attention for him when he clearly needed it as a toddler, i won’t say why as outing but not all people who use donors are lovely caring parents.

The egg retrieval process (from what I’ve read) is pretty nasty, as is the recovery. My issue is that it’s mainly poor young women who are preyed upon to believe this is a quick and easy way to make money. It‘s. eerily reminiscent of The Handmaid’s Tale. It must be even worse if you donate your eggs to someone you know. It might be really freaky and heartbreaking to see someone raising your doppelgänger. Also, you’ll be birthing a dc that isn’t genetically yours. Kind of like adoption but with the childbirth experience. I’m struggling with my fertility issues (despite being in my 20s) and I wouldn’t choose egg donation for all the above reasons.

TheKeatingFive · 17/05/2022 17:41

What one woman chooses to take out of her body and another put into her body is their business and not yours

Not if there's an unequal power dynamic open to exploitation

would you make that comment about organs?

I wasn't trying to approve of exploitation. I suppose that is why I used the word 'chooses' rather than 'forced'.

I was trying to make the point that this is about body autonomy and people should stop trying to control women's bodies and their reproductive functions (not sure function is the right word - sorry).

An egg is not an organ. Organs are usually needed to continue life, eggs are needed to create a new one.

Donor eggs weren’t a mainstream treatment in 1990. Were they even available. The availability of IVF, which has only been clinically/commercially available for a decade then, was the main impetus for the formation of the HFEA, surely?

I wasn't trying to approve of exploitation. I suppose that is why I used the word 'chooses' rather than 'forced'.

'choices' aren't always freely made though. Which we need to be on the alert for. And there can be emotional manipulation also.

Organs are usually needed to continue life, eggs are needed to create a new one.

Its not nothing to retrieve an egg. There can be considerable stresses on the body and very occasionally outcomes like stroke. We do need to acknowledge that.

The donors are often young women in university in Eastern European countries. I wonder how many of them feel now, ten years later and having their own babies, knowing that that baby has a sibling

It’s exploitation of young women. None of those women would go through it if it weren’t for financial reasons

The idea it isn't discussed is worse, it should be openly debated taking into consideration of children born of these donations.

If it makes you feel uncomfortable perhaps it's because it holds some truth? Why open the thread if you feel that way?

Anyway what I wonder is about the poor child and adult later on in life. What about that child's identity... where do they come from as in background? A whole side of the family missing? Looking from this angle I think it's wrong. I would be interested why the men would want to give their sperm away to multiple people..not even one! I mean you have created a child and then just gone about your day to day life and bases upon that POV it's sickening that a man can do that.

Given the law on anonymity was only changed in 2005 and was fully in force from April 2006, there just isn’t enough evidence to ascertain the implication for donor conceived children and adults. This is something that will emerge in time.

I have a dear friend going through donor conception in the U.K.. Being able to give information on background and identity is a huge factor in helping donor conceived individuals. Going abroad is problematic for the potential child. I know some people use these clinics due to cost and availability. I have some concerns over the ethics of a minority of parents who are actively consciously choosing to deny their child this information. Knowing your biological background is a fundamental right IMO.

Orwellwasright - that's an odd name choice for someone telling people not to talk about things.

I guess the crux of the issue is that people with donor conceived children don't believe that genetics are a particularly important part of family/identity. And they could fairly reasonably assume that if their children hear that mantra from birth, then they will also grow up believing the same, and all will be good.

I suspect that for some people, however, genetics will always form a huge part of their identity, however they have been raised. It's a huge assumption that this just won't affect your child, no matter how fantastic a parent you are.

But, of course, we all know that children born to totally conventional families can have shitty parents and shitry childhoods.

I think it's the most outrageously selfish act anyone can do to be honest.

I don't care if it's a same sex couple doing it or a single woman or man. So no homophobia there. It should be banned. It's a mental health crisis waiting to happen

If they’re not important why do they desire to conceive and carry and give birth to a child? Why do you need that biological ‘connection’, why not adopt?

And in the case of using a sperm donor, the same thing goes - obviously they have preferred to create a child using their own egg and a donor’s sperm rather than adopt because they want that genetic connection.

but when queried about whether donor gametes are ethical they suddenly say biology and genetics don’t matter?

@Organictangerine - there are millions of shit parents. Most of them are straight and in heterosexual relationships with children conceived through PIV sex . Not sure what your point is?

Why didn't you adopt @Organictangerine?

Just countering the notion that people conceiving using donor gametes are somehow inherently better parents that put more thought into it…

Because I wanted my own genetic child. But I’m not then depriving her of knowing her biological dad by saying ‘well genetics matter when it’s me wanting a child, but not you wanting to know your father’