AIBU to think that not all Conservative MP's are a total disaster when it comes to biological reality?

[AnotherDayAnotherView]

Good evening all,

Today I joined Mumsnet as it has been featured in the news for various reasons, most noticeably that it allows a free flow of views and opinions with regard to todays most "controversial" hot topics. I have on occasion dipped into some of the conversations (as a non-participant observer), such as the threads on Ukraine and some within the feminist forum, however I have not felt the need to join the forum until today.

The reason I joined today is due to a response I received from my local Conservative MP which I would like to share with you.

Over the last few months in particular I have noticed a disturbing theme from some politicians with regard to what constitutes a man or a woman, in light of this I wrote to my MP to ask his definition of a woman and if he thought that women could have a penis as this notion seems to be pushed within the media.

For some time now I have been watching various news items with regard to the new trend of " transgenderism" - I place this word advisedly in inverted commas as there seems to be some dissent as to what this word actually means. In my world view, there used to be transsexuals and transvestites, these words seem to have been combined into an overarching definition which seems to confuse the issue.

Anyhow suffice to say this new trend has caused me some concern particularly when it comes to the apparent safeguarding issues with regard to children and young adults. I attach the response from my MP

AIBU to think that not all Conservative politicians are a total disaster when it comes to biological reality?

Sex is nether a continuum, nor indeed a spectrum. Some people are born with DSDs. This may mean that (for example) their genitals failed to develop properly. Modern medicine can use ultrasounds and chromosomal analysis to establish the sex of the individual in question. A male with Klinefelter syndrome is still a man, a female with Turner syndrome is still a woman. Ovotesticular disorder (so-called "true hermaphroditism") is so incredibly rare that there are less than 500 recorded cases in world medical history. Less than 500 people in a population of 7 billion is not cause to claim that sex is a "continuum".

My Tory MP would write a load of bollocks if they thought it would make me vote for them.

Why else are you invoking people with DSDs for use as whataboutery ammunition?

Cats have four legs. That is a simple, factual statement. It's pretty clear cut, isn't it?

No one ever feels the need to qualify it with "well some cats only have three legs". In fact, a family friend has a rescue cat with three legs, and I'm sure that even the cat himself would not object to being described as a "quadruped", because he know that he is a rare exception and doesn't disprove the rule.

They are telling you what they want you to hear, not what they necessarily feel or how they would act.

It may not affect your life but it does affect vulnerable people or others who may need you to speak up for them:

The Tory party has made the lives of vulnerable people more difficult, including their GRA reform that started from a place of TWAW. The only thing they've done for the vulnerable in the UK is increase their numbers.

Meanwhile the other parties are telling us that men can be women. That's fine, lie away, respect my sex if you want my X... so I'll vote Tory.

YANBU This part of Mumsnet is always brutal. Come over to the Feminism section where the importance of these issues is fully appreciated and where it is a given that only the Tories are in a position to roll back the Stonewall overreach, given that Labour/LibDem/SNP/Green tell voters who enquire that they do not want their votes unless they believe in Gender Identity Ideology which is 100% unscientific nonsense.

Come over to our echo chamber where youll feel comfortable, as a Tory youll be able to appreciate our want to not extend rights to vulnerable people, we also avoid any need to listen to black voices over there in our white middle class feminist bubble, please make sure your views are entrenched though

It's shocking how women can chuck women's sport under the bandwagon . Seems only men in various forms should win races.
Obviously we should never have left the kitchen sink.

OK, I'm sorry, it's just that that sentence is the sort of garbled meaningless-but-sounds-impressive thing an mp's office would come up with. Let's unpick it though.

If "they" did not care then why does my MP bother to give a voice to some of the most marginalised disabled people in the local and national community?

Specifically, who are the most marginalised disabled people? Did you mean something specific by that? Your MP reckons some disabled people are more marginalised than others? Eg people with paranoid schizophrenia as opposed to someone in a wheelchair...?

When you say, "give a voice to" them, has your MP gathered their opinions somehow and then made a speech in parliament on their behalf? Or just in general by being their MP he "gives them a voice" because he speaks for them??

By local and national community, do you mean just national (because that includes local) or do you mean he has separately made speeches on behalf of those specific "most marginalised" disabled people a) in his local area and then separately b) nationally??

Don't you see that that sentence conveys no information at all and is parroted from tory propo??

You say, quite passively aggressively, that my comment is putting you off mumsnet. I love mumsnet passionately. One of the reasons is because it's full of really insightful women (and some men I guess) who don't talk waffle, and engage in meaningful debate rather than slogans

Sometimes I hate to be cynical.....

But

Here we have a first time poster, mentioning that not all Conservatives are bad (to be fair - some aren't), on a topic specifically that some posters have highlighted as a potential issue that causes them to align their vote... JUST before the local elections.

Hoping I am just being over sensitive and totally cynical... and yet....

Don't be ridiculous. Many of us are extremely GC yet absolutely refuse to vote for the Tories. Whilst the destruction if the definition of what it is to be a woman, and the threat to safe spaces for women is one of the main issues faces women it is by no means the only issue. The Tories are the worst party for most of the other issues affecting women. We are most hit by the broken economy. The policies of the Tories disproportionately stigmatise single parents (the majority of whom are women), victims of rape and domestic violence, refugees, women of colour, not rich women, disabled women, those who need the services of the NHS and hence need the NHS to not be shredded and privatised. Women that have children in nursery etc etc.
please don't use this issue to try and win votes for the party that has a mysogynistic as it's leader it's vile to do this.

In a recent yougov poll, ‘the trans debate’ wasn’t even in the top 15 of voter concerns. It’s a niche topic that happens to be prevalent on this forum.

Not to say that people aren’t allowed to care about it, but I think some on here get inflated ideas about how much it occupies the rest of the population’s consciousness.

Not really a high bar though is it? If you’re taken in by this for one second you’re either brain dead or a liar. My husband was. Turned out to be the latter thank goodness. I was about to end it. He said he was just trying to be nice. There politicians aren’t stupid they’re being political

Conspiracy theorist

Transparent as a plate glass window. Just the writing style gives it away. It’s actually pretty insulting that OP makes so little effort to be credible.

is so incredibly rare that there are less than 500 recorded cases in world medical history.

And as far as is known, zero producing both sets of gametes.

The conservatives must be worried about the May elections if they are sending folk to start threads like this on mn.

Biology is not nuanced. Mammals are either male or female. On the rare occasion they are born with ambiguous genitalia, they unfortunately have a birth defect/congenital anomaly.

I am a teacher. Should I teach my class that males have a penis but sometimes not, and females have a uterus but sometimes not - because of rare birth defects?

I know two little boys, both born with one arm. I don’t teach my class that the anatomy of a human being includes two arms, but sometimes one, to be inclusive of those birth defects. They are anomalies - not the standard biological definition of a human. If we included all birth defects in our definition of the anatomy of a human being - where would this end? Why are we so obsessed with blurring the definition of sex, but perfectly happy to accept that other defects/anomalies are just that.

Are we allowed to know who this saint among Tories is? Or would that be too "outing", given that no MP in this country has more than 5 constituents....

I'll go first. My MP is Iain Stewart. See if you can work out which of his 135,000 constituents I am!

(Also, sex is binary. Trans people do not change sex. Leave the people with DSDs out of this).

Only 3 weeks? You are honoured. I have been waiting over 6 months.

@Ereshkigalangcleg

Good to see some sense in amongst the confusion, obfuscation and errors. Thank you.

How has he voted in Parliament on issues affecting all vulnerable and disadvantaged people?

Never mind. I imagine you're a Conservative voter and intend to give your vote to him next time regardless of his telling you what you want to hear.

I bet he didn't vote against the Party whip to give them a "voice"