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AIBU?

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Original poster

Am I too available at work?

80 replies

JanetPluchinsky · 21/04/2022 11:16

Prompted by DH asking why I’m answering emails in bed this morning.

I am a manager in a hospitality setting. It’s a full on job, often 50-60hr weeks. I love my job. I work alongside another manager but we have specific roles each and don’t really get involved in the other’s unless absolutely necessary.

I have work emails, booking system, WhatsApp etc on my phone and laptop. Invariably, things will crop up that need my attention while I’m at home. I get phone calls/messages from the team when I’m not there with queries that I can’t just ignore. Or emails from customers that are time critical.

DH works in a completely different sector earning 4x what I do and when he’s not at work (9-5) he doesn’t think about work at all.

I think it’s just a totally different world and comes with the job. I sometimes have to message my own manager when they’re not actually working and they will always reply.

I did leave my phone at home at DHs request over Christmas when we were horrendously short staffed and I was under a lot of stress, it was my first day off for 12 days and we went out for a family dinner but tbh I spent the whole time panicking that they needed me and I did get home to several messages (and yes, it had all gone to shit unnecessarily which I could have sorted).

I am working on building up the team to be more self sufficient but it’s hell out there in hospitality land and I have a very young team who aren’t always confident to make decisions without me.

How available are other people outside their working hours? It’s pretty normal in a lot of sectors I’d have thought?

OP posts:
LadyDanburysHat · 21/04/2022 13:47

In a lot of ways hospitality isn’t like any other job. And I don’t mind that.

My DH has worked in hospitality in senior roles for over 20 years, and has never had the amount of outside hours expectations you have.

PomPomChatton · 21/04/2022 14:04

A few things/thoughts that worked for me...

Genuine "emergencies" do not come via email. If everyone is told to filter queries via the opposite manager, and then that person is the only one allowed to WhatsApp you. Then you don't have to read through emails, as you'll get distracted by the non-emergency stuff. And it gives the other manager a chance to problem solve before it gets to you.

Being on-call 24-7 is addictive. You'll have to work hard to break your own, and your team's, habits. What are you teaching your young team? That they always need to be available too?

You say it's just easier to deal with quick things than pass them on. That's the thing about being a manager, of course it's easier to do it yourself but that's not a long term solution. Eventually you will burn out and then what will your team do?

Maybe start with a small habit you can stick to e.g. no reading emails in bed 😃and work up from there...

HP87 · 21/04/2022 14:13

My dh is like you and it pisses me right off! He's like it in his personal life too and that also drives me mad. He does admit that he gets anxious if he feels like people can't contact him when they want to. We have now banned phones at the weekend during the day because it was driving me that mad!

He doesn't (well didn't until I pointed out how rude it is) get that he can be busy spending time with me and the kids. He thought he always had to be available to other people and not realise me and the kids are here too!

He always answers his phone as well, if I ring him during the day he's quite quick to say I'm really busy can you keep it quick....if you're busy don't answer and I will ring and ring and ring if it's urgent!

sillysmiles · 21/04/2022 14:27

It is getting better but I don’t see a time when I can ever be completely switched off when I’m not there as no one is really.

The more you type the more I think it you not the role. That you like being in control and knowing where everything is. For the level of mental load you are carrying for this job you should be better paid. Or you need a new job that requires this level of contact and control - but pays you for it.

Original poster
JanetPluchinsky · 21/04/2022 15:16

Well I’ve just arrived at work to find absolutely no one has actioned the time critical email I ignored earlier, which means the business has lost money.

I really wanted to message to make sure it had been seen but refrained. 🤦🏻‍♀️

OP posts:
OctopusSay · 21/04/2022 15:20

JanetPluchinsky · 21/04/2022 15:16

Well I’ve just arrived at work to find absolutely no one has actioned the time critical email I ignored earlier, which means the business has lost money.

I really wanted to message to make sure it had been seen but refrained. 🤦🏻‍♀️

The business needs to alter it's working practices so time critical things are seen by someone who's working.

fairylightsandwaxmelts · 21/04/2022 15:32

JanetPluchinsky · 21/04/2022 15:16

Well I’ve just arrived at work to find absolutely no one has actioned the time critical email I ignored earlier, which means the business has lost money.

I really wanted to message to make sure it had been seen but refrained. 🤦🏻‍♀️

As a manager, surely it's your job to deputise someone to action these things on your behalf, though?

So - who is that person and why didn't they do it? If you don't have a person you can deputise to, why on earth not?!

Itshonestlynotthathard · 21/04/2022 15:46

JanetPluchinsky · 21/04/2022 15:16

Well I’ve just arrived at work to find absolutely no one has actioned the time critical email I ignored earlier, which means the business has lost money.

I really wanted to message to make sure it had been seen but refrained. 🤦🏻‍♀️

So… as a manager, how are you now going to address this?

Itshonestlynotthathard · 21/04/2022 15:47

Op

habe you been on any management training courses that may assist you?

Jalepenojello · 21/04/2022 15:50

What is the usual process there OP? Was is assigned to anyone specific? If they are used to you always chasing them and being on call, were your team not waiting for your instructions? You need to take a step back but you actually need to manage your team first, confirm processes, assign x person a day for urgent queries in your absence and raise with that individual if they don’t follow through.

Switching up your expectations after months of being on call and telling no one isn’t going to work…..

Original poster
JanetPluchinsky · 21/04/2022 15:54

I don’t manage my colleague, he is my equal. We both report to the same LM. I have asked that emails be checked first thing and then before we open as a priority. This shouldn’t have happened.

I will raise it at our next manager meeting as well in general terms.

I’ve had pretty much constant management training due to the studying I’m doing alongside my job. But I have only been a manager for less than a year and I am still learning.

OP posts:
Original poster
JanetPluchinsky · 21/04/2022 15:56

My colleague doesn’t have emails on his phone so doesn’t see them in real time, he has to physically be at the office pc.

usual process is whoever the duty manager is should have read the email and done the (30 second) action.

My instinct was to message him and make sure he’d seen it but I was trying to take a step back. Ultimately this doesn’t blow back on me, it’s not my responsibility, but I’m pushed off it’s lost us actual money.

OP posts:
Robin233 · 21/04/2022 15:58

You sound like me Op.
your company is lucky to have you.
And if you love your job , which I think you do - you're very lucky too.

SleeplessInEngland · 21/04/2022 15:58

It's good you like your job because 60 hours a week for under 30k seems absurd to me. I think your DH has a point if it's demanding that much time from you.

falloutcheer · 21/04/2022 15:59

So your direct equal can only check emails when in the office?

sounds sensible

LookItsMeAgain · 21/04/2022 16:14

I was just about to type this when I saw that @falloutcheer did - your direct equal manager doesn't have email on their phone so can't check emails in the same way you do?
Do you see what we're driving at here??

You are more available.

What is shocking to read is that the General Manager defers to you (but I'm guessing you're not the CEO/owner/director of the company, which would be, in my opinion the only level or role that would top being a GM). They shouldn't be doing that. They are the GM. They should be taking on the queries about sick leave cover etc. but because they know you will do it, they couldn't be arsed in learning to do it in good time.

You clearly don't value your own time very much because you've been effectively gifting that time for no compensation (i.e. no overtime wages) to your company/employer.

Value your time more.

fairylightsandwaxmelts · 21/04/2022 16:17

JanetPluchinsky · 21/04/2022 15:56

My colleague doesn’t have emails on his phone so doesn’t see them in real time, he has to physically be at the office pc.

usual process is whoever the duty manager is should have read the email and done the (30 second) action.

My instinct was to message him and make sure he’d seen it but I was trying to take a step back. Ultimately this doesn’t blow back on me, it’s not my responsibility, but I’m pushed off it’s lost us actual money.

So why didn't the duty manager check the e-mails and respond appropriately?

balalake · 21/04/2022 17:27

You should have set boundaries a long time ago. Not just out of consideration for your family.

Things should not need your attention whilst at home.

I don't know if he went through with it, but Monsieur Macron proposed a legal right not to have to answer emails or other messages outside working hours. An idea I 100% supported.

Thebestwaytoscareatory · 21/04/2022 18:00

OP you are being taken advantage of big time.

Additional responsibilities, sole gatekeeper of vital processes and procedures, chief decision maker, and always on call all for no additional pay or benefits (not even the basic equipment needed to do the job).

You've said it yourself hospitality businesses are struggling to recruit and it's an employees market.

If I were you I'd be reevaluating my worth and asking for a pay rise or, more likely, looking for a new role as your current company clearly do not value you enough.

Etinoxaurus · 21/04/2022 18:04

You must get a work phone.
Read this book.
Turn the Ship Around!
A True Story of Turning Followers into Leaders
Flowers

Puzzledandpissedoff · 21/04/2022 19:13

My colleague doesn’t have emails on his phone

So if he's "your equal" and yet doesn't have email on his phone, why do you?

Unless he's avoiding having the facility because that means you'll do it instead, in which case I'd suggest you've brought this on yourself

thecatsthecats · 21/04/2022 19:27

I was young and inexperienced once. In a team of similar people.

And we learned fuck all except to rely on our manager because he was a micromanager.

Funnily enough years later, I ended up managing the whole team, and said manager phoned me to ask if he should order loo paper because they were running out. My silence spoke volumes, and he said, "I should just get some, shouldn't I?".

ImBurtMacklin · 21/04/2022 19:38

I’m pushed off it’s lost us actual money.

I bet you don’t see a penny of this money yourself do you?

Original poster
JanetPluchinsky · 21/04/2022 22:19

ImBurtMacklin · 21/04/2022 19:38

I’m pushed off it’s lost us actual money.

I bet you don’t see a penny of this money yourself do you?

My bonus is dependant on sales.

I promise I’m not a micromanager either, it’s not like I’m breathing down their necks and not delegating, just that I’ve been put in the position of being the perceived font of all knowledge and don’t like to leave messages unanswered.

My opposite colleague isn’t bothered about promotion or even a long term career so he gives far fewer fucks about things than me, tbh. It’s not ideal.

OP posts:
Iliketeaagain · 21/04/2022 22:33

I manage a big team and do more overtime than I should (NHS). But when I'm off, I'm off. The only reason I check email if I'm on leave is the night before i'm back at work, just so I can delete all the rubbish as it saves me time my first morning back.

Plenty of people have my personal number and can call me if there is something that can't wait that I haven't handed over BUT they rarely do - I think maybe once in the last 2 years, even in the midst of the covid chaos.

You are far too available. If they need someone at your level or above always on call to make decisions, then they should have an on-call system, not rely on you answering your phone or queries when you are frequently not at work. Also, people should be respecting your time off unless it's a major emergency - even then, we ask people if they are happy to be contacted when not at work in case of crisis (E.g contact to ask if they will work if a whole team was off with covid for example) and if the answer was no, then that's made clear in our emergency folder.