RURAL RACISM

[findingthepremise]

So, I live in a predominately white area, an affluent area also. It has become apparent to me that even after decades have passed, the mixed or otherwise non white minority has never developed. I ask myself why? I find that in many rural areas this is the case and I cant understand why. Is having a housing stipulation under the council that requests that only people with family ties to the area can apply to put their name forward for the housing association schemes? is that possibly an undercurrent of racism?

I live in the cotswolds, and we do have ethnic minorities happily living here and everyone is made welcome and treated with kindness, that is a given.

I very much doubt that everyone is made welcome and treated with kindness by everyone all the time. You sound a little deluded. Sorry but some people in the Cotswolds will be racist and unwelcoming - THAT is a given.

Many years ago I worked for an LA that did remove/ lessen its local link criteria and it did lead to a more diverse range of applicants. But this was a market town on a line to London not rural rural.

carefully Thank you, but I have lived here for thirty years and never ever seen or heard of a single racist incident. It would be unthinkable. Do you live here? Can you confirm where? I suspect not.

Its kind of self-perpetuating. I'm mixed race but very visibly - I don't look White. In cities I don't stand out in the slightest. For two years I lived in rural North Wales for a job. For the first time in my life, I really stood out. I was the only non-White employee in my department. Do I think I was treated badly? No. But its not quite comfortable either. Particularly when we had the mandated diversity day and suddenly I'm expected to be some kind of....representative? You what now? I don't know what to say! I wasn't even in any kind of senior position. So yeah. I was glad to get back to the city for many reasons but lack of diversity is one major reason I won't live properly rural again. If you aren't White, its not comfortable.

Social housing isn't free

@LegMeChicken I am actually singaporean so the countryside is even more alien! In Singapore, my childhood home was a house in a suburb that wasn't within walking distance of a tube station (this changed 2 years ago, but when I was growing up, you had to get a bus to the tube station). So its like the equivalent of living in Muswell Hill or certain parts of south london (where you need a bus to get to the train station). The bus stop was a 5 minute walk and it came every 15 minutes! My friends always claimed that this house was very ulu (remote) and a pain to get to. It took an hour by public transport door to door to get to the central business district, and this is considered a MAJOR commute in singapore.

@Blinkingbatshit I think the high fuel/travel costs associated with the countryside do make it a less attractive option for poorer/cost-conscious incomers with the exception of pensioners who may not travel that much. It is cheaper for me to get a bigger mortgage on a flat in London than to move to a rural location as my mortgage is fixed for 5 years at £1k per month. You can't fix fuel or travel costs, it can rise at a scary amount. I have five years to overpay my mortgage. In London, I don't have a car. My 2 bed flat is on the top floor so I benefit from the heating in the unit downstairs. The only big cost is the mortgage. There are some people who can't get a bigger mortgage but there are also cheaper areas in London and smaller flats. There are also cheaper cities like Birmingham and Manchester which have jobs. Unless you already have a connection to the area, the only other reason to move to the countryside would be because you really love it and you are willing to pay a premium for that.

Interesting reading the varying views.

I've always lived in predominantly white areas since birth as my mum never had the option (council house). We never got involved with the east Asian communities either (not sure why) so have spent a life of having only white friends/neighbours.

Only in later life have I made friends with other minorities, through work though, as I still live in a predominantly white area.

I'm now married to a white woman, which makes it a lot easier I guess but my personal experience means that I'd never consider my race being a boundary for where to live. But can appreciate why some here wouldn't.

Thing is, I'm a minority and by virtue don't expect to live alongside other minorities. I appreciate cities and other places in the UK have higher densities but I would personally prefer to integrate more. I've been living in a white affluent area for the last 10 years as the only minority on the estate. Only just now has a black family moved next door. Have to say that it's nice to have some diversity for a change!

Re: racism though, I don't think I've experienced much but east Asians can be quite fortunate in this respect. Covid has obviously been a nightmare for getting randomly beaten up by idiots but otherwise it tends to be low level crap.

If people are racist then they do it behind a smile, so isn't possible to tell at face value. So the worst of it for me has been the old, "where are you from?" or "what are you?", despite my having a well spoken southern accent 😂

My area of Derbyshire is redneck af. No sane minded person of ethnic descent would move here and I feel really sorry for the handful of dark skinned folk who live in these towns and villages.
When a cafe owned by a lady of ethnic origin had it's windows smashed in an allegedly racist attack in a village in our area the locals launched an anti racism campaign, which consisted of posters for windows and a trestle table set up on the High Street with several well meaning white middle class locals 'raising awareness of racism'. It was utterly cringe and so patronising and an entirely self congratulatory exercise and the following week they were all back to moaning about non-locals clogging up their roads with parked cars as visitors came to walk up the big hill there.

Thank you that message lunar that is really inspiring and encouraging. I had a close friend at school that told me later in secondary school, we were at primary school together from reception that she was not even aware of skin colour at all until around 13 years of age, because it was never brought to her attention, and why should it? That is exactly how it should be.

I hope others have had similar experiences. I am not minimising racism, at all, it is heartening to hear that many families having a very positive life in villages, and do not see barriers to living anywhere in the UK. If there are no halal shops etc set one up, everyone is very welcome to move here.

Regarding housing association houses in rural villages, there is a reason why there are rules about who can have them.

First of all, the housing associations have to find land in areas where new building is often not permitted. Exceptions are made for housing local people. They also purchase the land at agricultural values.. Very much below what a commercial valuation for development would be. The landowner doesn’t have to sell but is trying to help local people.

The allocation of homes process is therefore tightly controlled. Rural housing association homes are very different from estates built in towns and cities with an allocation for social housing. That land is purchased at a commercial price and developers have obligations regarding infrastructure. However even in larger towns.HA houses tend to go to local waiting list folk. Therefore areas replicate what they look like. It’s not racism in my view. It’s housing people where they wish to be.,

It’s for a mixture of reasons.

Personal preference. Some of the Syrian refugees didn’t like the quietness and lack of facilities in a small village so when possible they moved to cities. Others stayed precisely because they loved nature and the peaceful setting.

Occupancy restrictions. Social housing where I live has an occupancy restriction limiting it to people with a local connection.

Fear of racism. Some places would be fine, but it’s harder to identify them if you don’t already live there. I once lived in a large, lib dem voting village, a fairly liberal mix of people. There were a few ethnic minorities living there quite happily but if few others live in a village, it’s natural to wonder why and easy to give the place a swerve if you’re house hunting.

Racism. Some places really have a racist undercurrent. I had a lodger from Japan and the locals in my rather naice village were nice to her face but said some horrible things to me behind her back. Luckily I moved away to a place with friendlier locals.

Yes, you can put a pin in the map and apply for a new build HA house when you’ve got no ties. I know, because I’ve done this within the last 5 years.

I now live very rurally and despite being predominantly white - there are immigrants of all colours. One of the local “big families” has mixed race relatives.

not everyone with a nice view from the windows is a Neanderthal prick.

We live rurally and the vast majority of the population are white. My 2 sons doubled the number of black children in their primary school! Senior school had a wider catchment so I'd say maybe a dozen kids in the whole school that weren't white.

Population is made up mostly of people who've lived in the same village for generations. Lots of farms that get passed down. There really isn't a lot of diversity.
The people are perfectly nice and friendly, no complaints there at all.

I live in a small very white village of 500 people. I have a friend here from Japan, actually from Japan not Britain with Japanese family or anything. I remember we used to wonder if she was the first person from Japan to ever visit our small village, like some sort of intrepid explorer. Anyway couple of years later another Japanese people moved here, again, actually from Japan and with no connections to my friend. My friends was a bit put out (in a jokey way) to no longer be the only one in the village.

@Swayingpalmtrees

TBH I spend most of my life being unaware of my skin, until something happens to remind me that I'm clearly not. I've lived in quite a few different places in the UK and have remained relatively unscathed. However, what I will say is that intersectionality is a huge issue and not all minorities are treated equally (equally unequal that is). Generally speaking (and I stand corrected if anyone has an alternate view) the darker the skin, the more sinister it is. Therefore, it's possible my new black neighbours may face more issues than I have. I sincerely hope not though.

Yes or have been here since childhood. My husband came to England as a baby, when he retired we moved to Devon. It has been horrible, we love the beach and being out and about but our neighbours have varied over the years from downright unpleasant to just not very friendly.

I want to move back to a city but he is disabled and doesn't want the upheaval and he isn't out much so doesn't get the "frosty" treatment I do so he is less affected which is funny as I'm the white one.

We live in a cul de sac of 10 houses, on VE days 2020 9 houses had a party on our neighbours drive. We weren't invited. We;ve lived here for 25 years, we take in parcels, don't cause any bother but are completely excluded.

DH and the DC are Muslim. It’s Ramadan right now and so they go to the mosque in the evening. That’s easy if the mosque is 5-10 mins away but a pain if you live in a Cotswold village 30mins or more away. We are in London and there are churches, mosques, synagogues, gurdwara and temples within a 20 min walk of where we live. It becomes self fulfilling communities live in an area and create facilities then stay because of the facilities.

I think that is a good way to describe it, "If you aren't white, its not comfortable."

My neighbours don't smash our windows, don't spit at us in the street but it isn't comfortable and I definitely don't feel welcome. There are two houses in the cul de sac where white families moved in after us and they were made very welcome and if you came here you would assume we are the newcomers.

In your predominantly white, affluent area there is likely to be very little council housing. I am not sure why you assume 'the non-white minority' which has 'never developed' would require council housing as a housing option. There are plenty of other options, including buying property or renting privately or other social housing.
Affluent rural areas, of which the Cotswolds would certainly, in parts, be one, are often very racist in indirect ways- excluding people from social invitations, lack of warmth in shops and from businesses, well-off white British residents given priority by businesses, social groups like mums, Bridge clubs, tennis clubs etc only welcoming people like them (white). They are also often class dependent too- the same exclusions will apply to those poor white people who 'don't fit' socially.
It happens everywhere but in cities there is a bigger population, wider social and ethnic mix and more shops/businesses/social groups.
Education and wealth overcome some of these barriers to an extent- money and status always appeal to money and status. Drs, dentists, wealthy business owners who buy expensive properties will find themselves more welcome by the same kind of people.

OP you have not stated your ethnicity or why specifically you are finding this apparent situation problematic for you.

Also, your post seems to imply that it should be the expectation that all areas in a nation that has a very high white majority are -by default- at some point going to become mixed after decades have passed. Why do you believe this? Can you elaborate?

Also, would you care to say why you have chosen the Cotswolds (of all places) as your area of residence?

Having grown up in a very small rural village in the north, there is a serious issue with local young people not being able to continue to afford to live with in close proximity to their families and the places they grew-up due to rising house prices and houses in these areas being bought up by more wealthy people often for weekend homes or holiday homes, especially from the south.

So councils often do put president on new low cost housing to locals who happen to come from white backgrounds what else would you expect them to be?

As in most villages, from personal experience you are expected to fit into the community not the other way round and for a while no matter what your colour you are an outsider and it takes time to fit in. Coming into an area like that and demanding for the community to fit it to your personal and/or cultural expectations is obviously going to get peoples back ups, especially if you barge in claiming every one is racist or they are not culturally diverse enough for you. When I go aboard I expect to respect there lives and I am expected to fit into there culture not the other way around, this is no different.

Forcing multi culturalism does not work, it only works when every one has the mind set to want it to work and accept they have to fit in and not force change on others. Just look at a large number of northern towns, weather you like it or not most have predominant areas that house singular groups of people, who tend not to mix and those do not like mote to other areas less diverse than their own.

Blaming and tying to squeeze every single issue on racism has now become a lazy norm to stifle debate and its now becoming the boy who cried wolf. This is at the detriment of genuine racism.

A lot of people of any race stay where they were born, they prefer to be close to relatives and just where they’re comfortable. Lots of immigrants ended up in big towns and cities because that’s where the mills and factories were so their families are still there. I’d argue that a lot of people who live rurally have always lived there or in similar places and that just so happens to be predominantly white middle class people.

@profilehopper you see I have always lived in large multicultural cities so this kind of environment is not one that I would want to live in! Which is handy. I live in London, I fit in the sense that I work with people of every conceivable race and background, I don't feel like there is any barrier towards interacting with anyone.

But I don't celebrate Christmas, I don't drink alcohol and in London, this is completely normal. I posted a thread last Christmas where my DH (despite living in London all his life) went out on Christmas morning to buy a coffee from Caffe Nero as Christmas was so off the radar for him! i can't think that would go down very well in a rural village.

There was a cafe that was open , not the best cafe but DH got his coffee :) Beauty of London, i suppose.