How are people still watch horse racing/going to the races?

[savedbyanalien]

Utterly barbaric 🤮

All this talk about the Grand National this morning.

Watching people ride these beautiful animals for sport, and if the poor beast were to fall, that's it... straight to the vets to be euthanised.

Dressing up and going to the races is gross. And I say this as someone who enjoyed doing this in my early 20s. I'm embarrassed.

Anyone else agree with me or AIBU?

People generally are too lazy to think about the consequences of things and just don't give a shit.

@deadlanguage

Where did I say she was wrong?

as if as if as if

Just in case you missed it,

as if.

You didn't explicitly say she was wrong, you posted as if she was wrong. That's generally how argumentative discussion works, one person makes a point, and then someone makes a counterpoint as if they were wrong.

Somebody else brought people's competing in events to the discussion. They said that six human fatalities in a decade would mean that an event would be cancelled. They even went as far as to use as broad an event as the 100m. Newuser82 pointed out that this was not true because if that were the case marathons would now be banned.

Horses not consenting to being raced is a completely separate point and in no way contradicts Newuser82's point.

I just curious I do accept the chances are small but if you did end up in hospital because you didn’t have your vaccine because of your stance?

Then it would no longer be possible or practical for me to not have treatment. But if there was a treatment not tested on animals, I’d choose that one.

I genuinely don’t get people’s issues with people that want to minimise cruelty to animals.

@latriciamcneal

Same reason they still eat meat and dairy; comfortable denial of the horror they cause for animals in favour of personal enjoyment, convenience or habit.

Oh yay a preachy vegan 🥱. Yet every supermarket you shop in funds these industries. Just saying🤷‍♀️.

Again, the supermarkets comment really isn’t the gotcha moment that you think it is.

I’ve been round animals all my life I’ve no problems with eating meat or horses racing but it’s the way it’s managed is what that bothers me. If we didn’t eat meat then we wouldnt have cows sheep pigs etc we would stop breeding them and as species they would die out. I find this unacceptable where I live native cattle and been used to improve the environment bringing back species of plants birds and invertebrates that have not been seen for many years. The grazing of chalk meadows in a low input low output farming has encouraged many species of plant including rare orchids to return. It is possible to get a balance the same is true for race horses.
There is nothing wrong with humanely euthanising a cow sheep pig or horse and indeed eating all four if you want but it’s the quality of the life that they lead before that needs to improved.

@toastfiend

Most fallers aren't "sent straight to the vet to be euthanised" - most are a bit stiff for a few days and then are fine. 6 horses have died in the Grand National since 2011, of course that's very sad, but it's not the massacre you're portraying it to be.

I support the racing industry. It's a big source of employment in lots of areas, it does a lot for the equestrian world as a whole (the veterinary facilities in Newmarket are breathtaking in what they can do, developed specifically for the racing industry but available to regular horse owners as well, and I'm so grateful for that after having a horse with a complex neurological issue referred to them) and the horses are treated like kings whilst in training. Having had multiple ex-racers, I am saddened that some ex-racehorses aren't offered any guarantees of responsible rehoming after their careers by more unscrupulous trainers and owners, but more and more is being done to combat this and they are finally being recognised as extremely useful and able horses outside of racing, achieving sensible prices on the market so they can't just be bought by people who wanted a cheap horse but don't have the money, or knowledge, to keep them.

I have far, far more of a problem with aspects of the leisure riding and private horse ownership industry, where people who know nothing about horse ownership and appropriate care buy ponies they don't know how to look after and keep them in miserable conditions, enormously overweight people ride horses they're too heavy for and then wonder why they've got back problems, idiots who over rug and over feed in the name of "love" and riding school horses who plod around the same arena for 4 hours a day having their mouths pulled, backs bounced on and ribs booted by people who don't know any better. Of course everyone has to learn, but life in a riding school is hard and boring for horses and ponies and it can go on for decades, at least racing is a relatively short career. Those things are far more prevalent and far more damaging overall, but no one ever says anything about them.

Excellent post

There was a panorama called 'the dark side of racing' a few years ago. Poor horses getting shipped over from Ireland to British abattoirs and all they did to deserve it was not be very good at racing.

The image of that fat bastard Gordon Elliott sat on a dead horse that died on his gallops should be printed on every ticket so these people can see what industry they're supporting.

The image of that fat bastard Gordon Elliott sat on a dead horse that died on his gallops should be printed on every ticket so these people can see what industry they're supporting.

It's insulting to suggest that Gordon Elliott is in any way representative of the industry. There was no greater disgust in reaction to his behaviour than from the people I know from within the racing industry.

@BadLad I’m not sure what the issue is. I added a related point to what she was saying. Conversation also works by expanding on points raised by others.

@Sixlegsfoward88

The image of that fat bastard Gordon Elliott sat on a dead horse that died on his gallops should be printed on every ticket so these people can see what industry they're supporting.

It's insulting to suggest that Gordon Elliott is in any way representative of the industry. There was no greater disgust in reaction to his behaviour than from the people I know from within the racing industry.

The industry banned him for 6 bloody months. A slap on the wrist from the authorities shows to me they do not care.

Lots still go including me

Racing yes, but not the Grand National, which seems uniquely cruel.

@Carpy88999

There was a panorama called 'the dark side of racing' a few years ago. Poor horses getting shipped over from Ireland to British abattoirs and all they did to deserve it was not be very good at racing.

The image of that fat bastard Gordon Elliott sat on a dead horse that died on his gallops should be printed on every ticket so these people can see what industry they're supporting.

Gordon Elliot is a disgrace and I, and many others I know in the industry hate the fact he has been allowed to return. The fact is he is licensed in Ireland and his fitness to be a trainer is judged by the Irish racing authorities.

That programme was awful but to me it was more indicative of problems in abattoir practices than in the racing industry - all the TBs shown had been shipped from Ireland and were not connected to the British racing industry where the guidance is that TBs be humanely euthanised by a vet at home and not sent to slaughter.

The industry banned him for 6 bloody months. A slap on the wrist from the authorities shows to me they do not care.

Actually the industry suspended him for 12 months, with half of that sentence suspended, and he was ordered to pay costs of €15,000 with the IHRB stating the punishment reflected “the seriousness of the offence and the damage to the Irish racing industry”.

Many people wanted him to serve more but just as many people are disappointed by sentences handed out in criminal courts, similar sentencing rules and considerations apply here. It was thought that his staff, mainly young stable lads and lasses on low wages would suffer most from a longer ban.

Horses have been reared to be used by humans for centuries.

Can it be less than humane? Absolutely - just like every aspect of humanity/Earth.

My grandparents raced and raised greyhounds and my goodness were those dogs treated like kings/queens.

One was poorly and my Grandad slept in his special kennel with him all night - they certainly were cared for.

Unlike us animals don't live a structural life where they have set goals before they die and must achieve a certain education level to do X.

Should all effort be made to prevent cruelty? Absolutely there's no need to be deliberately cruel.

I adore animals of all kinds and personally don't kill bugs/insects/spiders/rats.

Only the exceeding naive or gullible would believe that there are not some seriously bad practices in horse racing Gordon Elliott being a high profile example, I’ve owned ex race horses who been clearly abused by those looking after them. But this does not mean we should ban all racing it means that the Jockey Club and everyone else in the racing industry need to really step up to the plate and make significant and all round improvements.

@TurningUpMyStereotype

Again, the supermarkets comment really isn’t the gotcha moment that you think it is.

I'm not trying for a "gotcha" moment (Though it actually is a good one as clearly you have no respnse for it). I'm trying to point out that preachy vegans are being hypocritical. We get it. You don't eat meat or dairy and that's your choice. Shaming, oh sorry, I mean insulting people for making a choice to eat meat is just being that stereotypical, "I'm better than you", judgemental vegan that everyone rolls their eyes at.

I'm not trying for a "gotcha" moment (Though it actually is a good one as clearly you have no respnse for it). I'm trying to point out that preachy vegans are being hypocritical.
We get it. You don't eat meat or dairy and that's your choice. Shaming, oh sorry, I mean insulting people for making a choice to eat meat is just being that stereotypical, "I'm better than you", judgemental vegan that everyone rolls their eyes at.

I don’t think it’s a good one at all. There aren’t many vegan food shops to use, they’re certainly not within a reasonable distance to everyone so again not possible or practical. And there’s also the thinking that by buying vegan products from supermarkets, it creates demand and therefore they will increase their range and sell less animal products.

I haven’t shamed or insulted anyone for their food choices so I’m not sure where that has come from.

@TurningUpMyStereotype

I'm not trying for a "gotcha" moment (Though it actually is a good one as clearly you have no respnse for it). I'm trying to point out that preachy vegans are being hypocritical. We get it. You don't eat meat or dairy and that's your choice. Shaming, oh sorry, I mean insulting people for making a choice to eat meat is just being that stereotypical, "I'm better than you", judgemental vegan that everyone rolls their eyes at.

I don’t think it’s a good one at all. There aren’t many vegan food shops to use, they’re certainly not within a reasonable distance to everyone so again not possible or practical. And there’s also the thinking that by buying vegan products from supermarkets, it creates demand and therefore they will increase their range and sell less animal products.

I haven’t shamed or insulted anyone for their food choices so I’m not sure where that has come from.

In reguards to the food choice shaming comment that was aimed at @latriciamcneal for this comment

Same reason they still eat meat and dairy; comfortable denial of the horror they cause for animals in favour of personal enjoyment, convenience or habit.

This is extremely judgemental. Just pure insults that people who eat meat are cruel.

This. Please stop spoiling everything all the time. Yes safety could be improved- why not work on making things better instead of destroying?

@Discountclaimed

This. Please stop spoiling everything all the time. Yes safety could be improved- why not work on making things better instead of destroying?

Do you apply this to lame horses also?

@ForTheLoveOfSleep That's not the implication at all. I was not cruel when I ate meat and dairy, I was unaware of the inherent cruelty.

@Agrudge

As a matched better I'm very excited for the grand national

How does this work with horses then?

@breakdown19 matched betting works with any sports betting. A lot of bookies have special offers on for the Grand National meeting, Bet365 is the best as you can usually guarantee at least £80 in profit.

I used to be a matched bettor, but over time all my accounts got restricted and it became more time consuming so I stopped. Made £20k over about 3 years though.