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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To wonder who funds a teacher's school trip

482 replies

iwasjustwonderingreally · 06/04/2022 10:41

My daughter went skiing with her school in February half term.

Four teachers accompanied them.

Do teachers pay for themselves, or a contribution, (I appreciate they are working though), or is the cost to the pupil inflated to cover the cost of the teachers?

OP posts:
Blanketpolicy · 06/04/2022 11:50

It has been raised as a complaint and, before I decide whether or not I want to put my name to any complaint, I want to find out if it's been paid for by parents or not!

So it is a teacher pile on?

Do you have a complaint of your own without being incited to get involved in a group one?

If you expect the/a teacher(s) to be stone cold sober do you think your expectations are too high? I get tipsy in charge of my teen, is that a problem? As long as there was one or two not too "tipsy" to deal with it then what is actual the problem?

How will you prove that there was no teacher capable of dealing with the problem?

If the concern is safety, then who pays for it is completely irrelevant and will make your complaint look petty and embarrassing.

Shinyandnew1 · 06/04/2022 11:50

This has nothing at all to do with who pays for teacher trips really has it, OP?

There are a lot of posts about teachers on here this morning…

Gardeninspring · 06/04/2022 11:50

Back in the 90s when I was at school we went on a cruise around for a week. Can't remember how much my parents paid for it but it was around £800 (this was 26 years ago). The teachers had a tough job keeping us all safe and in line so my parents were perfectly happy to have paid towards their trip too as it was in no way leisurely or relaxing for them. Lots of early starts, different excursions, hassle with teenagers etc. I remember our flight out to Athens was delayed at Gatwick and we were all tired and moody at the airport all night. The teachers had a right game trying to sort everything out whilst being shattered themselves.

Wardrobes123 · 06/04/2022 11:51

As a parent I’d happily pay extra to give the teachers a little extra thanks! I often bought wine or chocs as an additional thank you anyway.

Teachers organise the trips, send letters, chase payment and then agree to supervise our children on these trips which mean so much to the kids.

I wouldn’t care if they weren’t supervising them 24/7 or had a couple of drinks in the evening.

Without teachers these trips wouldn’t happen at all. Just think about that.

How any parent can question or moan about this is beyond me.

Gardeninspring · 06/04/2022 11:51

*cruise around the Med

flumposie · 06/04/2022 11:52

I've done trips during holidays that involved over 24 hours on a coach abroad. I used to run a lunchtime club, extra revision at lunchtime and during holidays. I will do no more. Threads like this and the hatred shown towards teachers over the last few years as depleted all goodwill.

flumposie · 06/04/2022 11:52

has depletedGrin

HesterShaw1 · 06/04/2022 11:53

The teachers aren't with the children during the day as they are off skiing on their own (as the children are in ski school).

Not in my experience of school ski trips. School staff were assigned to each ski class along with the instructor.

Gonnagetgoing · 06/04/2022 11:53

There’s drunk and there’s tipsy. I bet a couple of teachers were tipsy (but could’ve handled a sick child) and the teenagers videoed this. There’s probably also teenagers wanting to run wild, teachers saying no etc. You’ve got no idea what’s gone on there apart from the teenagers side.

Agreed with PP these teachers are giving up their holiday and not getting anything in return.

OfstedOffred · 06/04/2022 11:54

Love all the teachers making out no one ever wants to go on these trips.

Lots of teachers in my family. School ski trip v popular with teachers, most of my relatives have said there's a waiting list of young childfree teachers wanting to go at their school.

Same true for some other trips. A teacher relative of mine did a 2 week trip to an Asian country on a school program - was absolutely happy to do that in school holidays, they were 25, no commitments at home and could otherwise never have afforded the trip. Had a great time as well.

Yes - the teachers shouldnt have to pay. No, it's not always a nightmare going on these trips.

Abraxan · 06/04/2022 11:54

@iwasjustwonderingreally

For those surprised that I ask ...

The teachers aren't with the children during the day as they are off skiing on their own (as the children are in ski school).

They are all also drinking at night and one got particularly drunk.

It has been raised as a complaint and, before I decide whether or not I want to put my name to any complaint, I want to find out if it's been paid for by parents or not!

Having one or two drinks at night after the children are in bed is often considered fine, though less so these days in state schools. Usually the teachers take it in turns to have one completely 'on call' who wouldn't even have one drink.

Getting drunk is a complete no no though, and the teacher could face a disciplinary over it.

How do people know the teacher was really drunk? Have they or the other teachers admitted it?

Biscuitsneeded · 06/04/2022 11:55

@iwasjustwonderingreally There two separate questions here. No, teachers should not be getting drunk while in charge of children. They ARE allowed a couple of drinks in the evening but one or two staff should avoid drinking in case of emergency. When I run a trip we take it in turns, but if I am in overall charge I generally don't drink, or I have one beer with dinner.

However, whether or not the parents pay for the teachers to go is irrelevant to any safeguarding complaint. As it happens, the educational visit company will allow one free place for a teacher per X students, so no the teachers don't pay, and I suppose the students are paying indirectly in the price they pay.

However, having run residentials abroad (not skiing), I can tell you it takes a minimum of 50 hours of unpaid admin to get a trip going. Chasing parents for passports, EHIC cards, writing risk assessments, corresponding with tour company, writing letters to parents, dealing with stupid questions about why they need a passport (?!), working out rooming arrangements and checking with all Heads of Year that you haven't inadvertently brewed disaster etc. Then you get on the trip and discover someone has an undisclosed eating disorder, you have parents phoning you because a child doesn't like the way her bed faces, kids fall out with each other and phone mum in the middle of the night and she phones you, another child asks what is the best way to kill yourself, another child (who you didn't want to take because of his behaviour but were told it was discriminatory not to) climbs out of his dormitory window (ground floor thank God) at night and somehow breaks his ankle, and you and the other teacher on stay sober duty spend all night until 4am at the French A&E with him and then have to stay awake through the following day's activities, then you have sweet and lovely but clearly very precious year 7's coming to your door at midnight in tears because they are homesick, because their parents have never even attempted a sleepover before and yet somehow thought several nights abroad was going to work because they fancied a break themselves.... The list goes on. And the constant worry that someone with a nut or wasp sting allergy has mislaid their epipen and so you are yourself carrying 4 of them around permanently. And then you get back late at night and ALL you want to do is go home and sleep, but several parents are two hours late picking up because they misread the letter and weren't answering their phones. And they don't even say thank you for taking them, or thank you for waiting with them.

And on top of all of this, because you kindly travelled at a weekend and on your day off, those days are completely unpaid.

So yes OP, feel free to complain about the teachers who drank on your child's residential. I wouldn't be too happy with this either. But before you do, bear in mind how hard it is for schools to find teachers who are willing to give up their weekends and half terms unpaid for this level of stress. If you want your DC to even HAVE school trips to go on in future, tread carefully.

LiberteEgaliteBeyonce · 06/04/2022 11:55

@phishy

This is probably one of the worst drip feeds I’ve seen.

Take your own sodding kids skiing next time.

Take your sodding kids skiing yourself next time. This.
MichelleScarn · 06/04/2022 11:55

@Sarahcoggles are they 'working' they're not getting paid.

Am assuming your own parents never drank and you never drink to remain always 'fully coherent'?

Constant Vigilance of course...

Abraxan · 06/04/2022 11:56

@iwasjustwonderingreally

For those surprised that I ask ...

The teachers aren't with the children during the day as they are off skiing on their own (as the children are in ski school).

They are all also drinking at night and one got particularly drunk.

It has been raised as a complaint and, before I decide whether or not I want to put my name to any complaint, I want to find out if it's been paid for by parents or not!

Although may not be supervising the ski school they will be on call constantly, day and night.

A school trip really isn't a holiday for teachers, even if they dare have a drink in the evening.

QuentininQuarantino · 06/04/2022 11:56

You complain, they won't do any more trips.

It is not a "free holiday" it is stressful and hard work and means they can't catch up on the ridiculous amount of paperwork they have to do of an evening, thereby increasing their workload on their return.

Also, in some of the language trips I've been on, we've been able to hand over care to the residential staff there, and effectively became "off duty" although obviously as we knew the kids, we hung around. Do you know the exact arrangement for this particular trip?

Why are you complaining third hand? What is your actual problem? Or do you have a whatsapp group where you all work each other up into a frenzy before sending copy and paste complaint emails you heard about third or fourth hand from someone's kid and nothing to do with your own? Those are tiresome....

echt · 06/04/2022 11:56

@OfstedOffred

Love all the teachers making out no one ever wants to go on these trips.

Lots of teachers in my family. School ski trip v popular with teachers, most of my relatives have said there's a waiting list of young childfree teachers wanting to go at their school.

Same true for some other trips. A teacher relative of mine did a 2 week trip to an Asian country on a school program - was absolutely happy to do that in school holidays, they were 25, no commitments at home and could otherwise never have afforded the trip. Had a great time as well.

Yes - the teachers shouldnt have to pay. No, it's not always a nightmare going on these trips.

No teacher has said that no-one wants to go on theses trips.

Love that you're NOT a teacher but happy to give hearsay evidence.

waterrat · 06/04/2022 11:57

Op the few hours of ski school clearly are a minor break to make up for being on duty 24 hours a day. Don't be so petty.

catmothertes1 · 06/04/2022 11:57

@KindergartenKop

The pupils pay for the teacher.

It's not a holiday! They have to make sure 50 teenagers don't do anything stupid for a week! Who do you think gets up at 3am and gets the girls out of the boys' room? Who takes johnny to the hospital when he sprains his ankle?

Exactly. Not a holiday at all. You are basically on duty 24/7.
Abraxan · 06/04/2022 11:58

@iwasjustwonderingreally

The complaint is that their child was ill and they'd have expected there to be at least one teacher who wasn't drunk and who could take responsibility.

I would imagine we'd all hope that when sending our kids away with the school.

There is video/photographic evidence of drunken teachers. The Head Mistress has actually contacted some pupils asking them to delete the photos.

So all 4 teachers were drunk? So much so it is obvious via a video?

Videos and photographs can't tell you someone was drunk, unless they were really very much OTT about it and even then it could be high spirits and silliness rather than drunkenness.

JudgeJ · 06/04/2022 11:58

@AnxiousHeffalump

Well that kid won’t be going on a school trip ever again.
Naughty! I recall oversubscribed trips where names were drawn but not all names were in the hat, if a parent constantly objects to school discipline there's no way their child would go away on a trip.

This thread has me shivering, remembering squatting in a small tent, in driving rain, at 3am, trying to broker a peace treaty among squabbling 10/11 year olds.

EmmaGrundyForPM · 06/04/2022 11:58

After every school trip my dc did I made sure I emailed the organiser to thank them and to pass on my thanks to all staff on the trip. I know how hard teachers work and there is no way I'd want to be a responsible adult on a school ski trip (or any other residential trip).

That said, Greg Davies told a brilliant story on Graham Norton about the time he was a teacher on a school trip to France.

OfstedOffred · 06/04/2022 11:59

Echt

Someone has said "bear in mind how hard it is for schools to find teachers who are willing to give up their weekends and half terms unpaid for this level of stress".

Not all schools find it hard to find teachers willing to go.

Sockwomble · 06/04/2022 11:59

There will always be staff on duty and they cannot drink. No one will be drunk.

ilovesooty · 06/04/2022 11:59

@iwasjustwonderingreally

Jeez, it was just a simple question to clarify a situation as a parent is complaining that the teachers were drunk when their child was ill.

I'm not saying teachers should pay!!!!

Well that parent can complain if they want to, on the basis that this is what their child told them.

Why do you and other parents feel the need to be involved?

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