The NHS in comparison to Spain is unfit for purpose . . .

[Lineofconcepcion]

My partner was taken ill a couple of weeks ago, we're on an extended holiday to Spain and Portugal. We went to the nearest public hospital in Oveido. Within 5 minutes he was triaged, examined within half an hour, given iv painkillers within 40 minutes, seen by an a & e doctor within the hour. Diagnosed, put on an iv drip for antibiotics within another half hour. Completed this, had the cannula removed, discharged with a prescription all within 2 hours. I was allowed with him during the whole of the treatment/examination. Treated amazingly well, faultless, lovely staff, who uploaded Google translate, to communicate better. All this on a GHIC card.

If it had been the NHS we would have waited 12 hours to be seen, denied my entry to be with him and generally be pissed off by the lack of care.

Where has it all gone so wrong?

Out of curiosity, if you were a Spanish National living in Spain, would you get free treatment?

@notimagain you just need a GHIC which is sufficient for most needs. www.nhs.uk/using-the-nhs/healthcare-abroad/apply-for-a-free-uk-global-health-insurance-card-ghic/

@Wrongkindofovercoat

Sorry just seen your update, how much is health insurance for a post retirement aged person in Spain, do you know ?

It’s varies due to your health but my parents are currently going though the residency process and they are paying around 2.5k each for 15 months cover.

@TruffleShuffles on average if you know, obviously the older someone is the more likely they are to have pre-exisitng conditions, such as diabetes, hypertension, arthritis etc which I imagine would bump up premiums.

@LaMagdalena

Okay, I am corrected. I didn’t really mingle with many post-work but pre-retirement people!

No no, you and TruffleShuffles may well be right as far as Spain goes but the S1 reciprocal arrangement certainly continues to work in France post Brexit and I thought the theory was it should still work EU wide for those who qualify.

Be interested to know the reality.

I love the NHS and all it stands for but there are not enough staff, those that do stay are overworked. It is being strangled and it is failing.
It is just another part of the country and with the transport system and energy prices that are being handled better in other European countries.
Our government are completely at fault about all these failing and dont appear to care about the impact these issues have on ordinary people.
It isn't the NHS I want rid of - it is the Tory government.

So 5k for the both of them for 15 months cover ? When they complete their residency application will they be entitled to free cover or will they have to continue paying at the same rate ?

@Wrongkindofovercoat

So 5k for the both of them for 15 months cover ? When they complete their residency application will they be entitled to free cover or will they have to continue paying at the same rate ?

Yep 5k for two, they will have to continue after gaining residency until retirement age as they will not be working on Spain. Luckily they both reach it next year when they will be able to apply for their S1 forms, they were too impatient to wait another year before applying for residency.

[quote Lineofconcepcion]@notimagain you just need a GHIC which is sufficient for most needs. www.nhs.uk/using-the-nhs/healthcare-abroad/apply-for-a-free-uk-global-health-insurance-card-ghic/[/quote]
I'd be careful assuming that..from the GHIC link you posted:

"You can use your card to access medically necessary state-provided healthcare when you're visiting an EU country or Switzerland."

(my emphasis).

It shouldn't be used to provide cover if you are resident overseas, that's exactly where the S1 comes into play....though I'm aware of the reality.

@Anycrispsleft

It's the same in Germany. The healthcare is so, so much better. It frustrates me so much when ppl in the UK resist change to the NHS because "you wouldn't want a system like the US" - well no, but a system like France, Germany, Switzerland or Belguim would be just fine.

Well this is true, but you have to contribute a lot in Germany. Mind you, as a PP said the Irish system is fucking woeful and you have to pay into that too.

I dunno about Spain. But the NHS needs more cash and better management.

We've had a few run in with the NHS with older relatives over the last few years and we've been amazed at what great care our relatives have had. One of my relatives died of cancer and the fact that they and we believe their care couldn't have been better is a huge comfort.

I have experienced delays for some things with my own health so I'm under no illusion that the NHS is perfect but there is a lot that it does well.

The NHS is a disgrace. It's not underfunded at all no matter how much people whinge that it is. It's badly managed to the hilt. So many staff need sacking and starting again. The execs and managers need gone as does the ridiculous waste. The system is ridiculous. Where I am from health care is incredibly good and although it's paid for the insurance system helps. Thing is people are so shit scared of having to pay for healthcare they will pretend the NHS is not a huge failure. Sure they can lament about the great care they received but they simultaneously shut down when people talk about the rampant neglect and abuse they have suffered at the hands of NHS staff. The NHS at this point probably costs as many lives as it saves.

I had to gonti A & E in Italy once having accidentally set myself on fire ( yes really). Arrived 10pm, seen, given basic treatment and out by midnight with a dermatology appointment for 10.30m. Seen, prescribed further treatment and follow up appointment in one week.

Trying to find the Italian to explain id caught my short in gas flame, doused myself with unfortunately filthy washing up water and had a huge burn in my boob qas entertaining.. they let me go for an excruciating minute or two before switching to fluent English

As well as my good experience with healthcare in Spain, DP was taken ill on holiday in Norway once. It seemed exactly like the NHS. A bit chaotic albeit not nearly so long to wait, a slightly couldn't care less attitude, not much treatment or interest in treating him (fortunately he recovered) but they couldn't be bothered processing the charging either, presumably because we were foreigners. So we were never invoiced or asked to leave our details! Just waved away. I was a bit shocked when I saw all the Norwegians paying for their treatment there and then and some withdrawing money from the cash machine adjacent to the invoices desk.

People are still in the past thinking NHS are beyond compare to anywhere in the world....

I was horrified at the hospital my aging dementia mum was placed in in UK, compared to my personal health experience in Europe.

NHS staff deserve a medal for their dedication.

@Blossomtoes

Spain spends a higher percentage of its GDP on healthcare. It’s obviously going to be better. You get what you pay for.

It doesn't. This suggests to me that their system is highly efficient. www.statista.com/statistics/268826/health-expenditure-as-gdp-percentage-in-oecd-countries/

For all the inefficient staff people are taking about there are hundreds more who work their arses off to give their best to people! I work hard as a nurse in critical care, my colleagues are amazing and we do our best. I agree we are not angels or superhero's but we certainly do deserve respect for the job we do. It's hard, it's sad and it's heartbreaking at times. Well done for sitting on your sofas offering your expert opinions 👌

I was taken ill on holiday in Tenerife about a month ago - very impressed with care I received - needed a follow up appointment with my GP on return home - I’m not able to book anything - keep ringing but constantly told no emergency appointments left (it’s not an emergency) and no pre bookable appointments
I’ve got a diagnosis and have had tests etc abroad - what I would like is ongoing treatment and medication

Well done for sitting on your sofas offering your expert opinions

We’re not all doing it. I know all too well that the NHS runs on staff commitment and goodwill against all odds.

@bringmelaughter

The NHS in comparison to Spain is underfunded for it’s purpose . . .

There we go, I fixed the title.

This!

The NHS is shocking. Precious little is investigated when things go wrong. The standard of care is pathetic and it's complete pot luck if you live to see a consultant and even then you best hope for one who cares and is competent. Most Brits are completely shocked when they experience healthcare pretty much anywhere else. 200 babies died in Shrewsbury...will anything really change? Is the same not happening all over the U.K.? Years to be seen for autism referral. The U.K. doesn't do early intervention like the rest of the western world because children aren't seen for years! It's a disgrace.

It needs tearing down and starting again. It needs proper funding and if not then find privatise it because the level of care is so low now.

I can't speak for the Spanish healthcare system but in the UK I recently had an eye injury. 111 told me to go to A&E within the hour. I waited for 2 days to be seen by a doctor (I had to go back the next day). I now have permanent vision damage.
It's very scarey to think the help just isn't there when you need it. I'd rather pay a small amount more every month for a functioning system.

@Anycrispsleft

It's the same in Germany. The healthcare is so, so much better. It frustrates me so much when ppl in the UK resist change to the NHS because "you wouldn't want a system like the US" - well no, but a system like France, Germany, Switzerland or Belguim would be just fine.

Exactly this.

The patient outcomes, survival rates and patient care by the NHS are shocking for a developed country and have been for a very, very long time when you look at the international data comparisons.

I am baffled why some people in the UK think it's so good.

Haven't read the thread but I will say when we get critically ill patients repatriated to UK from Spain, they come with the most horrific healthcare-associated infections, far beyond what we have in NHS.

The physio and basic nursing care has also been severely lacking based on the contractures/sores.

I have always thought the Australian hybrid system works well, but I realise this is only if you can afford private insurance/are never ill/are rich enough to pay for private yourself.

My child has been diagnosed with something and needs to see a specialist about 'what next'. If we want to see him on social medicine (ie paid by the government) it is about a 6 month wait. If I can afford 300quid, we can see the same person privately in 3 weeks,

My mate broke her foot- free xrays, but paying for crutches (not a bad thing I guess) a moonboot, physio and consultant appointments.

So be careful what you wish for.
BTw I used to work for NHS- it is way too managerial heavy and needs fewer meetings and more hands on staff.