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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

If 'commoners' can marry into the royal family - why have a 'royal' family -

419 replies

HacketteofHacks · 21/03/2022 12:03

I totally respect the Queen and think she's been largely a force for good...
But at work we were talking about the tour that's on now.. my boss pointed out the the definition of a royal family was that its lineage is 'predetermined by God'.
Well that is archaic in itself - my boss (who is no royalist) the. pointed out that once members of a royal family marry commoners they lose this 'untouchable special-Ness'.
I think he had a good point...
He's from Jamaica so hence we were all having the conversation .

OP posts:
IKnowYouDontTurnTheLightOn · 21/03/2022 15:28

The "President Johnson/Blair" etc comments are so tiresome. I totally agree with the PP who said that it could be someone who has earned their fame with achievement - and obviously would be elected. They're a figurehead, would only be there to represent the UK on the world stage, and shake hands, cut ribbons. Imagine if we had someone like President Attenborough, or President Dench? It would be amazing!

Another thing to consider is, given how much their ancestors shagged around, we don't even know which of them ARE actually directly descended from monarchy. There will be a hell of a lot of other people born way before DNA tests were invented who are direct descendants of the delightful kings and princes of old who'd shag who ever they pleased.

The whole thing is such a nonsense. And I'm STILL yet to see one single reason why the queen has been a force for good, or deserves any respect. Those of us who remember the way she behaved when Diana died certainly shouldn't think so!

I remain permanently bemused by the bullshit sycophancy that surrounds such a pathetic excuse for a piss poor bunch of ignorant and unpleasant people. Be shot of the lot of them!

Abhannmor · 21/03/2022 15:47

@Nicholethejewellery

Yes "divine right of kings" means that the ruler has power appointed by God (as opposed to people), it's nothing to do with lineage. A "commoner" who married into the royal family wouldn't suddenly move up the list of who is heir to the throne, they would never become ruler themselves. Any offspring they had would still have lineage dating back to Cerdic (King of Wessex 519-534) through their royal parent.
Yeah but who isn't? According to Sir Iain Moncrieff who was Chief Flaunter of the Golden Wotsit in the college of Heralds we are unlikely to be descended from say , Frederick the Great of Prussia. But assuming we are Christians of some sort we are all certainly descended from Charlemagne who was crowned Holy Roman Emperor in 800AD. It's just maths.
crepesncream · 21/03/2022 15:51

Sorry but I can't respect any of them. I just don't agree with the whole concept of a "monarchy". It's outdated, undemocratic and shouldn't have any place in a modern society.

TooBigForMyBoots · 21/03/2022 15:55

Somebody has to wear the crowns.👸🧝‍♀️

nostylenoclue · 21/03/2022 16:05

They tried unsuccessfully to marry royals only to other royals - Nature knocked that stupid idea out of their head by causing such things as the Hapsburg jaw.

If they could of made it work, they would have!

Agree with other posters that the Royal family are a complete anachronism. The very idea that only someone born of someone can perform a role is a direct conflict the culture of today's world. No wonder there is tension. After the Queen dies, they should be no more. I cannot see what value any of them actually bring.

myislandhome · 21/03/2022 16:05

I don't understand when people go on about what a great job the Queen has done. What has she actually done? Just exist. The PR people for the Royals deserve an actual MEDAL.

Onlyforcake · 21/03/2022 16:05

The crown and the royal family aren't the same thing. The predestined by God thing is bloody weird. But then anything using religion as a justification is going to be batshit.

It's probably time notions of royalty were ditched. They must realise that in a modern world we shouldn't consider someone more special because they own large amounts of land, have titles because they MIGHT carry from someone who used to be a monarch.

But then the UK seems stuck like glue to these weird superstitious ideas. It must be weird. If they had a true sense of "duty" they'd realise its repugnant to carry on acting superior in anyway and crack on with working towards creating a better less split society. They're just people. But the entitlement is totally ingrained.

Onlyforcake · 21/03/2022 16:07

*Might carry genes from.
I say might as theres definitely one family that won't be putting their genes on any of the family tree sites. Grin

IKnowYouDontTurnTheLightOn · 21/03/2022 16:09

It's the fawning and bowing and scraping I can't bear. Watching 'us ordinary folk' meeting with a member of the royal family is just embarrassing - curtsying to the floor, doe eyed and adoring, for what? People who do nothing, have achieved nothing, offer nothing. And please don't say they do a lot of work for charity - I've worked in charities all my life and watch people hold down full time jobs, raise kids single-handedly and still do more work for charity than any of these 'permanently on holiday' lot will do in their life times. And without a word of thanks for it most of the time . . . .

balalake · 21/03/2022 16:12

The reasons for retaining or abolishing the monarchy are many, but whom they can marry I don't think should be a factor.

TheKeatingFive · 21/03/2022 16:12

The PR people for the Royals deserve an actual MEDAL.

Well yes.

It's amazing really. You'll get a thread discussing their obscene wealth and someone will come along with no irony whatsoever to point out the Queen uses Tupperware thus making her extremely thrifty 🤦‍♀️

TheKeatingFive · 21/03/2022 16:15

People who do nothing, have achieved nothing, offer nothing

It was excruciating watching Theresa May curtseying to Prince William. Say what you like about May, but she's achieved a hell of a lot. Imagine then having to kow tow to frigging Wills?

I suppose it could have been worse (Andrew)

CathyorClaire · 21/03/2022 16:17

President Johnson anyone?

This ridiculousness is trotted out every single time Hmm

FTR 'President' Johnson would have been voted in and could just as easily be voted out again. Unlike the royals who we're stuck with.

It's also worth bearing in mind that but for an accident of birth our next king would have been Andrew.

IKnowYouDontTurnTheLightOn · 21/03/2022 16:28

@TheKeatingFive totally agree but think this with so many people who meet them - charity workers, Olympic athletes, politicians, actors. They then get interviewed afterwards and are all starry eyed and breathless and I just think "WTAF????!!!" I was invited to an opening of a charity building a few years that a local group had worked tirelessly to raise funds for but I refused to go as I would have been expected to curtsy to Kate.

Not a fucking chance.

We need to get away from this fawning fandom and wake up to who they really are - and then move on into the 21st century in a modern democracy, where anyone of our children or grandchildren can hold the ambition of being our elected HoS.

IKnowYouDontTurnTheLightOn · 21/03/2022 16:29

www.republic.org.uk/get_involved

Puzzledandpissedoff · 21/03/2022 16:32

The mental gymnastics required to think that a royal family is a good idea/they are special etc etc must be exhausting

Is it though? Most of what's said in support amounts to just "slogans", all of them unoriginal and many of them mistaken, hence:

Do you want a Donald Trump instead?
They bring more in from tourism than they cost
They're a safeguard against despotism
The Queen has no power so it doesn't matter (ironic after number 3)
etc, etc ...

Call me dense, but I'm not sure how parroting a few largely discredited lines amounts to much mental exertion?

Thoosa · 21/03/2022 16:35

@IKnowYouDontTurnTheLightOn

It's the fawning and bowing and scraping I can't bear. Watching 'us ordinary folk' meeting with a member of the royal family is just embarrassing - curtsying to the floor, doe eyed and adoring, for what? People who do nothing, have achieved nothing, offer nothing. And please don't say they do a lot of work for charity - I've worked in charities all my life and watch people hold down full time jobs, raise kids single-handedly and still do more work for charity than any of these 'permanently on holiday' lot will do in their life times. And without a word of thanks for it most of the time . . . .
Agree.

FWIW, I think Kate & William (the supposed future and hope of the institution) are probably perfectly nice people, who do their best in their roles and are reflective, thoughtful etc BUT it’s not enough to justify all this silliness. Monarchy makes no sense as a concept. They both look horribly nervous all the time, too.

The pictures of them arriving in Belize this week made me cringe. Something very archaic about the optics, and not just because of her blue peplum lace frock. Rich white people coming off a plane to be feted by less-rich brown people is not the basis on which the commonwealth will be perpetuated, if it’s going to be perpetuated, and wants to continue. I know some of the people involved like it, but that doesn’t make it a great idea.

Conversely, flying around the world, popping in on former colonies isn’t a good look for the monarchy. If they want to survive, they should concentrate on the UK.

I don’t particularly want the monarchy to survive, though, so I suppose I should be hoping they continue the neo colonial stuff.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 21/03/2022 16:37

The PR people for the Royals deserve an actual MEDAL

Depending on how you define a PR person, many of them already get one.
If they fawn and scrape for long enough, dodge the blame for disasters the RF have largely brought upon themselves, and don't get caught telling the media something the family would rather we didn't know, there's often a gong in it somewhere for the favoured ones

HacketteofHacks · 21/03/2022 16:41

Crikey! Lots of replies and no one appears to believe we should still have a monarchy. It is embarrassing-people having to curtesy. I wonder what the royals think about that. Kate must realise how weird it is...

OP posts:
IKnowYouDontTurnTheLightOn · 21/03/2022 16:41

@Puzzledandpissedoff and that's the fascinating thing isn't it? How do they get away with it??? It's so patently ludicrious and unjustifiable in this modern age. They have proved time and time again that they are nothing special, with their affairs and their divorces and racism and bullying and fraud. So why do so many people still seem so blinkered? Why are people wetting their knickers in excitement at the idea of going to a royal jubilee party and celebrating 'old woman lives a long time'? I feel like I'm living in a parallel universe some times?!

IKnowYouDontTurnTheLightOn · 21/03/2022 16:43

@HacketteofHacks you can reassure your boss that he's not alone in thinking it's all totally mental! Grin

SevenWaystoLeave · 21/03/2022 16:47

They are just symbolic so it doesn't really matter a damn who any of them are, or what their bloodline is. If they could only marry other royals imagine how (even more) inbred they'd be, they'd all have three eyes and no arses.

Thoosa · 21/03/2022 16:48

Kate must realise how weird it is...

It must be like joining a cult.

Thoosa · 21/03/2022 16:49

They are just symbolic

Good. In that case they can surrender a few palaces and the two enormous Duchies in return for salaries, and they won’t need access to the red boxes any more.

Myee · 21/03/2022 16:51

What is the penalty for not curtseying and who applies it? Slight nod of the Covid rule head, or if Covid disappears shake hands, That is polite and accepted by everyone as courteous.

I wouldn't bow to anyone, unless in jest. They can take me to the tower lol. But I wouldn't place myself anywhere near any of them anyway.

They are rich but never seem to have enough, buy a sheikh, make a Lord, get a backhander etc. How much do they actually need FGS. Money grabbing self serving mostly emotionally unintelligent bunch of wasters.