To think most marriages have elements of LTB in them

[AdamRyan]

In my (finished) marriage there was quite a lot of behaviour I put up with, that would have mumsnet saying "LTB!"

Talking to friends, family there seems to be a lot of it about in their marriages too. (Not gender specific, things like financial control, secret drinking, debts, cocklodging, contempt, verbal abuse etc etc)

I think most marriages/long relationships have elements of LTB behaviour- but I don’t know if my perspective is warped.

Putting on voting to allow people to be semi anonymous, as I expect the comments to be full of very happily married types saying IABU

It's all down to the ability to leave in a lot of cases. It doesn't matter how strong you want your boundaries to be, if you've got no chance of leaving, you let it blow over.

My marriage has none of those. I've been married for eight years and we have children together.

I was married to a very abusive man previously and would absolutely LTB at any sign of abusive behaviour.

I don't think it is light hearted to laugh at putting up with abuse within a marriage and having a bar so low for the partner in your life.

Mumsnet is very quick to say LTB.

I think a lot of it comes down to presentation. I'm very happily married but my DH has some faults, as do I. If I posted on here purely about his faults and painted them at their worst while failing to say anything about my own faults, I could definitely get people telling me to LTB, without my actually saying anything untrue (although it would be misleading). I suspect most of us could unless we're married to saints.

Does that mean my marriage has elements of LTB? Seems like a low bar.

No, I don't think they do.

Mine doesn't, but only because I left a few B's over the years and found out what I did and absolutely didn't want in a man/relationship and refused to accept anything less. Rather be alone.

I genuinely don't think mine has. I reckon I could leave my husband if I wanted/needed to; we have a lot of family close, I earn a decent wage etc. Certainly no financial control, verbal abuse, contempt, debts or secret drinking. I could list all the good things about my marriage (such as sharing the housework equally) but ultimately we respect each other and we are a team and I think that generally gets us past most hurdles.

It's all about balance.
Yes mine has done LTB level things over the years. I have wanted to split in the past when his actions made me feel worthless but we worked through it and I ditched my rose tinted glasses. Very conditional love.

I think that most people are flawed and therefore by default there are likely to be things done in isolation that could cause cries of LTB.
So on that YANBU

No.

And based on the examples you gave I wouldn’t need to be told to LTB, I would already be gone.

I wouldn't say most marriages have these problems. But I do think that far too many marriages/LTR do have these problems and that a lot of people put up with unacceptable behaviour from their partner for various reasons. Fear, low self esteem (thinking that they don't deserve better), not wanting to be single, not wanting to break up the family, financial repercussions, sunken costs fallacy etc.

Personally I am in a very happy marriage but I can see how I would be willing to forgive things that I would tell others to leave for. Our lives are so intertwined, the dc's love DH so much and I would be completely skint as a single mum. I'd like to think that I have a line that, if crossed, I would end my marriage despite the reasons to hold it together. But I don't know for sure as DH has been a very good partner so far so I haven't had my boundaries tested.

Sometimes you can’t just leave due to financial difficulties, children or having no family anywhere close to you.

I imagine feeling trapped doesn’t do much for the relationship though.

I realise you don’t want to hear dissenting views, but no, those are all massive red flags and I know at least three marriages that have broken up over similar issues, because the wives weren’t willing to put up with it. All had their own jobs and therefore income, though. I have seen some horrible marriages where I’ve wondered what the people are staying for, though.

I think I know what you mean.

I'm married and if I listed all the bad stuff alone, I'd probably get a few LTBs. So would dh if he listed all my bad qualities.

I don't think any marriage is perfect and there's always that chance things will turn sour. I think it's quite realistic to accept that, but to know where your own red line is or know how much you're willing to put up with.

Absolutely!

I have an awful temper and dh drinks too much. Either of us could use those as a reason to leave. I suppose there's an element of letting stuff go for the bigger picture. We do love each other and we're happy 90% of the time.

@YellowRosesWhiteRoses I agree. My dh is supportive loving funny a good dad and very kind. He can also be grumpy snappy and very set in his ways. Nothing he has ever done is abusive but he's been selfish rude and thoughtless on occasion.

If those occasions were representative of even a fraction of our marriage I should leave but they are not. They have happened a handful of times in over 20 years.

I on the other hand have always been 100% delightful.

I agree to some extent, but actually the things you listed are quite significant red flags and I would genuinely urge anyone experiencing those things to think about whether they can leave.
No marriage is perfect, but I genuinely haven’t experienced any of those things in the 10 years we’ve been married.

I think long term relationships require compromises on both sides, where one partner is unwilling it creates a power balance issue which isn't good. Consequently many relationships do have elements of ltb but sometimes on an individual level we are willing to put up with elements because other things are good. I do wonder sometimes though why today's women put up with the men they do on hear

My marriage doesn't but previous relationships have done.

@MaryLennoxsScowl

I realise you don’t want to hear dissenting views, but no, those are all massive red flags and I know at least three marriages that have broken up over similar issues, because the wives weren’t willing to put up with it. All had their own jobs and therefore income, though. I have seen some horrible marriages where I’ve wondered what the people are staying for, though.

I do want to hear dissenting views I have quite a lot of issues and feel like I don't understand what a realistic expectation of a relationship is. I think I forgave too much in my marriage - but we get such strong messages about "compromise/make it work" on one hand and "value yourself/ltb" on the other I get confused! Basically I just wanted to understand whether my experience is unusual or not. Based on voting, it looks quite even so maybe its just not clear :) Interesting posts on here, thank you.

No I don't believe you are correct.

I am married a long time and nothing you have described has ever even vaguely occurred during our 29 years.

But at times we can irritate each other and have had to work through mildly different parenting styles during the teen years.

We both bite our tongues at times which is important because once you say something unkind you can't take it back, so saying nasty things in anger is something you need to be careful of, if you want a happy marriage.

I have a bunch of old friends in very long marriages and kindness and loyalty are two very important ingredients.

You can't live together for a long time and not irritate each other at times, it's how you handle yourself and the irritation that counts.

I can't speak for others but I could certainly present snapshots of my 15 year marriage that would have MN saying LTB (or even MN telling my DH to LTB).

In my view, it isn't about the occasional bad patch or strife. There are clearly 'lines' that shouldn't be crossed but in an average marriage with ups and downs, the whole picture should be considered before thinking about a split.

I had a dreadful marriage, with so many different things, where any one of them should have had people urging me to LTB. Eventually I did, and I'm embarrassed about what I put up with for far too long.
I spent many years alone afterwards, but have now been in an amazing relationship for nearly a decade that has never had the slightest hint of the kind of behaviour that occurred before.
Many years ago, I would have agreed with you, but thankfully now, I know it can be so different

I think apart from actual financial, physical, emotional or sexual abuse within a marriage there are differing views of LTB “ crimes”. Some things in my marriage other MN’s would find unacceptable ( my DH has MH issues which make living with him difficult at times) but I don’t see that as LTB worthy. On the other hand I see things in other marriages that I would find unacceptable for myself. I wouldn’t judge another woman who has different boundaries than I do and makes the decision to Leave “Her” Bastard

Some Marriages/LTRs have LTB behaviours (which vary by person), but I think it’s to a lesser degree than the short term relationships have.