AIBU to be totally confused (cost of living crisis)

[LittleBitHeiressLittleBitIris]

AIBU to not be able to understand/ grasp the scale of impending disaster that is building over the increased cost of living?

I genuinely don't see how millions of people with outgoings that are about to be actually higher than income is going to play out.

I'm not trying to be goady and obviously realise no-one has a crystal ball but am I missing something? Has this ever happened before in other recent times/ other cultures and what was the result. I can't even imagine what could happen.

I feel really clueless! Any ideas/ opinions/ further reading much appreciated 👍

@Terfydactyl but basically by donating to food banks you are actually prolonging the agony, if footballers weren’t feeding children the government would be forced to do so, trickle down economics is an absolute friggin disaster because what is gonna happen when the general population can’t afford to do it any more ?

I tend to put “sweet treats” (and luxury items) in the food bank trolley because I figure if you’re having to eat the value pasta and value beans then Christ alone knows you deserve SOME feeling of comfort and luxury.

Not going to apologise for cheering someone up by purchasing something superfluous for them.

@fallfallfall

what did people do in the 20's; well simple meals, extra clothing and nothing new. homes were tiny and furniture sparce. people used their time making and selling. no tv, no "nail art", no phones in most homes, people added things to meat to stretch it out (oatmeal in ground beef, eggs and breadcrumbs). oil filled lamps for a couple hours after sunset and in bed by 8-9. awake with the sun. they used scraps of material to make rugs in the winter. but everyone was in the same situation (although some were very wealthy).

And had an average life expectancy of 51.5... yup exactly what we should be striving for.

Terfydactyl
I think Bringsexyback meant that she saw mostly sweet stuff in the trolleys designated for food bank donations in the supermarkets, not that customers were buying them for themselves.

Most people will be able to make some cut backs even if they don’t realise it now. I’m a single mum, own my own home and barely make ends meet at the moment. I don’t smoke, go on holidays, have takeaways or even drink alcohol. I’m pretty happy despite this but it’s going to be a shock to some when they need to live like me. I have a friend who is on a combined income of 130,000 and she thinks she’s poor and is freaking out. I’m not because I’m used to scrimping and know you can manage and be relatively happy still.

There's a troubling air of what can almost be described as glee that people who don't make the same or sensible life choices might come unstuck here.

Regardless of whether you agree with nail art or Netflix the reality is that is how our society has functioned now for some time. People have been pushed an aspirational lifestyle thru relentless advertising and promotion. People just want a bit of joy in their lives here and there.

The cost of living crisis is a government policy plain and simple. Taxing the rich should be a given in any decent society. I'm a high earner and pay my taxes very happily. That people with much more wealth than I try their level best to avoid doing so is a moral abomination. Shifting the narrative to suggest that the war in Ukraine is the reason we have to tighten our belts now is Tory gaslighting at its finest.

One poster on here effectively suggesting water and gruel. What next? Workhouses?

@Bringsexyback

It was this I was referring to…

It’s actually going to be nowhere near as bad as people are making out at all. Lots of people have had decent pay rises this year that will come to balance any increase in food and fuel prices if you haven’t I suggest you ask for one but I’ve been suggesting that on about 13 threads over the weekend and I just get we can’t …..well then it’s your own fault then.

Do you think that’s how the working world works? Public sector ‘just as for a pay increase’ someone whose job is under threat of redundancy “‘just ask for a pay increase”

Your own fault?? Maybe I should have referred to you as Marie Antoinette rather than Boris

I can get behind romanticising the '70s - although there were periods of high unemployment, power cuts etc, there also weren't the vast wealth inequalities there are now.

The cost of housing bore some some sensible relationships to earnings, social housing was available and affordable, people cooked from scratch, repaired clothes rather than binned them etc.

But romanticising the '20s with life expectancy at just over 50 years, many of the population living in extreme poverty with no way out and prior to the NHS, Pensions Act, Rent Control Act, Industrial Injuries act etc etc is insane.

[quote JudgeRindersMinder]@Bringsexyback

It was this I was referring to…

It’s actually going to be nowhere near as bad as people are making out at all. Lots of people have had decent pay rises this year that will come to balance any increase in food and fuel prices if you haven’t I suggest you ask for one but I’ve been suggesting that on about 13 threads over the weekend and I just get we can’t …..well then it’s your own fault then.

Do you think that’s how the working world works? Public sector ‘just as for a pay increase’ someone whose job is under threat of redundancy “‘just ask for a pay increase”

Your own fault?? Maybe I should have referred to you as Marie Antoinette rather than Boris[/quote]
Whose job right now with the biggest global crisis of lack of workers in every conceivable industry sectory is under the threat of redundancy ?

I have an acquaintance who will be bringing in 100,000 people from Asia next year to try and meet some of the demand we have for the food production industry.

The public sector are probably in the strongest position of all of those to demand pay increases but they’ve just lost their balls.

So yes if you don’t examine the market conditions around you and put your hand up and say I want more money then it is your own fault.

@bringsexyback - but if you work for the public sector you CANT ask for a payrise. I mean you can but even if you're the best performer in the world you won't get one because everyone doing the same job is on the same payscale for fairness. Of course its always open to leave but that would mean no nhs staff, no council, no civil service, no policeq....not sure how that would work?

Agre with everything @Shtfday has said. Even those who can make fairly easy cuts without impinging their own standard of living will have a knock on effect on others.

The only thing I would add is that it will be a gradual worsening for the majority rather than all of a sudden in April "shit I'm poor!" All the papers, MSE etc make it seem, for example that nearly everyone is now on the standard variable gas and electric rates but me, my parents, sibling and the 2 friends I've spoken to about it are still on our old fixes, some have another 18 months to go because they did a 2 year fix. So although when the fix does finally end it will be a huge shock we've got a while where our energy bills won't really go up.

I think October when the price cap goes up again together with needing to use more heating for the winter will be when it hits a lot of people. I can imagine people wanting to have a "proper" Christmas after 2 years of covid restrictions so putting everything on a card, then Jan and Feb seeing a lot of credit/bills defaulting.

There's a troubling air of what can almost be described as glee that people who don't make the same or sensible life choices might come unstuck here.

Yes also the very progressive "I coped without food or heat, so should you" 🙄

If you want to see an example of this playing out in real time, look at what’s happening in Lebanon. It went from one of the wealthiest countries in the region to one where nearly 80% of the population lives below the poverty line. In just 5 years or less. People can’t afford to drive, buy meat, or heat their homes. The lucky ones moved abroad and send home remittances to keep their families going. Even the Syrian war refugees are going back to Syria because it’s that bad.

So; yes it can happen. And with the financial mismanagement Bojo+Co. have inflicted over the last decade, it’s been a while in the making.

For what it’s worth; I left England and moved abroad. The situation is a lot better here, but petrol prices have gone up (but I cycle everywhere thanks to the great cycling infrastructure) and food is creeping up too. I’m really sad to see how difficult it’s getting back home :(

Our country's economy is service sector based. Without people spending money it won't function. I can't see how this will get better.

@bowlingalleyblues

"I genuinely don't see how millions of people with outgoings that are about to be actually higher than income is going to play out."

Google an article about any developing country, or indeed life on benefits in the UK. Life will be like that for more and more of us.

I believe its the current Government's deliberate policy to push Britain into a more isolated and desperate society by stripping back the welfare safety net, the NHS, affordable housing, social mobility, subsidy for public transport, childcare funding (sure start etc) and all the things that make it possible to live a low/average income life with a reasonable standard of living.

IMHO TV programmes playing endlessly over the last decade slating the poorest people: "Can't pay we'll take it away", "Benefits Street", "Benefits Britain: Life on the dole" etc has convinced millions of us that people on benefits/low wages are sponging off us and should be scorned and punished.

Anyway, having lived in a developing country I can see that the gap between our lives here and people in that country are gradually narrowing - malnutrition, no money for fuel, poor public transport, less investment in education, restrictions on our right to protest, we can't leave and seek work somewhere else or easily trade internationally (Brexit) - we are going backwards as a country in many ways, and Covid and the Cost of Living crisis have accelerated it.

I am from a devoloping country and every bit of this rang so true.

Our country's economy is service sector based.

This is always overlooked when others criticise the spending on Netflix or a takeaway

@XenoBitch it's illegal in the UK to increase rent by 20% within a 12months period.

what did people do in the 20's; well simple meals, extra clothing and nothing new. homes were tiny and furniture sparce. people used their time making and selling. no tv, no "nail art", no phones in most homes, people added things to meat to stretch it out (oatmeal in ground beef, eggs and breadcrumbs). oil filled lamps for a couple hours after sunset and in bed by 8-9. awake with the sun. they used scraps of material to make rugs in the winter.
Why romanticise what was surely a miserable time for millions,?
I thought governments were responsible for working hard so a repeat of the Great Depression is avoided.
What is happening here is normalising these scenarios, so people accept them.

Over the past few months lots of cost of living threads have appeared and it’s heartbreaking to read.

We keep being told we deserve it because we vote for Tory governments. Isn't it worth remembering that most people don't vote Tory actually.

Used to work for the dss. Unfortunately people will give up paying for food, bills kids etc before they give up their big tv , Netflix, sky , alcohol , drugs tobacco etc.
I really think this is the beginning of the start . It will get so much worse for everyone. Especially if bird flu spreads to humans or we get another covid strain.

[quote Monday55]@XenoBitch it's illegal in the UK to increase rent by 20% within a 12months period. [/quote]
The trouble is with a no fault eviction, The tenant either excepts the increase or they find themselves served with a section 21 and yes they could take it to court and fight it but often people don’t know their legal rights or don’t have the mental energy to do so.

We were forced to move out of a property in December because the landlord wanted it back the property is still stood empty I have spent over £3000 in removal costs and storage because we had to move, and will have to move again into a purchased property and I was advised by the council that there was actually nothing I could do about it so I might as well get on with it. Absolutely appalling advice

This was not ‘always going to happen’.
There are several countries in Europe who have already imposed caps on the amount of increase that energy companies can provide.
The companies are fleecing us because the government is allowing it, because it’s likely the Conservative party donors are board members of the different energy companies.
This government is corrupt.

@Pasithea

Used to work for the dss. Unfortunately people will give up paying for food, bills kids etc before they give up their big tv , Netflix, sky , alcohol , drugs tobacco etc. I really think this is the beginning of the start . It will get so much worse for everyone. Especially if bird flu spreads to humans or we get another covid strain.

Well to be honest with you you can’t really blame them it’s very easy to judge people wanting short-term instant gratification but the long-term doesn’t look too great for them so I can understand why they might not want to prolong it

@Bringsexyback I’d say if you can afford it donate money regularly to your local foodbank and fill in a form so they can claim the tax back for it too. That way they get more to spend and can use it for what they need at that moment in time (which might also be paying for premises or vans to deliver to some of the most vulnerable accessing their service or bulk buying when there are good special offers on foodstuffs they are short of). You’ve reminded me we should increase our direct debit. It’s really worrying how many people are going to be struggling in the coming months

The only positive this whole crisis may have from handing out bounceback loans to anyone who asked for them, to billions wasted on ppe contracts with mates to a lack of help with fuel costs is that maybe this will destroy the false narrative the British public have that the Tories are good with the economy, and people might stop voting for them. Probably not though.

@fallfallfall Have a read of this about the 1921 census: www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-59879470 - not the Dorothy Sayers stuff but the men in Hove and Liverpool so desperate for help to house and feed their families that they were writing about it on their census forms in the hope that someone would see it who could actually do something. Or read Cider with Rosie by Laurie Lee which has all the nostalgic stuff you mention but also elderly couples separated and taken to the workhouse to die when they could no longer look after themselves.

My grandmother was born in the 20s and lived in a 2 bed wooden bungalow with her parents and 5 siblings. She and her sisters slept top to toe in the same bed. When she was 14 she had to leave school to go into service because the family needed the money, even though she was clever and you'd expect someone like her to go to university now. Her dad was a factory electrician, so a pretty good working class job at the time, and yet this level of poverty was considered normal. Are we really ok with going back to that?