AIBU to be totally confused (cost of living crisis)

[LittleBitHeiressLittleBitIris]

AIBU to not be able to understand/ grasp the scale of impending disaster that is building over the increased cost of living?

I genuinely don't see how millions of people with outgoings that are about to be actually higher than income is going to play out.

I'm not trying to be goady and obviously realise no-one has a crystal ball but am I missing something? Has this ever happened before in other recent times/ other cultures and what was the result. I can't even imagine what could happen.

I feel really clueless! Any ideas/ opinions/ further reading much appreciated 👍

Well do what they’ve done for centuries I suppose in the endless cycle of feast and famine.

Maybe we should have paid more attention on the theatre trip to see Joseph and his amazing techni coloured Dream coat rather than thinking life would just keep getting better and better.

But yes, there will be a lot of suffering esp in a world which is defined in material wealth,

Costs of welfare will rise so will taxes. People will need to learn to cut their cloth or face crippling debt where available.

But didn’t take long for Utopian France to raise its head lol

I think there is some truth re being able to live more simply BUT for most the big expenses are housing, utilities & transport, not food or easily cut treats

Yes! Giving up avocado or cereal is not going to save hundreds of pounds 🙄

Costs of welfare will rise so will taxes.

This had to happen anyway due to social care/NHS costs but they cannot target income any further so where will the tax come from?

Costs of welfare will rise so will taxes.

This had to happen anyway due to social care/NHS costs but they cannot target income any further so where will the tax come from?

@AppleButter

And we all know what happened across Europe at the end of the twenties . . . . .

Seriously, malnutrition in Britain in the inter-war years was so bad that there were barely enough fit soldiers for the army (this fact made people in charge finally take notice, general poverty they didn’t care so mich for). When rationing kicked in during the war, SOME groups actually had better nutrition than before the war.
So no, it isn’t going to be an arte povera idyll, but really damaging for years to come, and with long term political danger if not remedied quickly (turning to extreme political ideologies, scapegoating, the rise of neo-facism).

I wish you were wrong, in your last paragraph... sadly I think you're spot on.

Costs of welfare will rise so will taxes.

This had to happen anyway due to social care/NHS costs but they cannot target income any further so where will the tax come from?

@AppleButter

And we all know what happened across Europe at the end of the twenties . . . . .

Seriously, malnutrition in Britain in the inter-war years was so bad that there were barely enough fit soldiers for the army (this fact made people in charge finally take notice, general poverty they didn’t care so mich for). When rationing kicked in during the war, SOME groups actually had better nutrition than before the war.
So no, it isn’t going to be an arte povera idyll, but really damaging for years to come, and with long term political danger if not remedied quickly (turning to extreme political ideologies, scapegoating, the rise of neo-facism).

I wish you were wrong, in your last paragraph... sadly I think you're spot on.

@Terfydactyl I actually see nothing but sweet shit in the trolley at Aldi in Sainsbury’s buyers you looking at sometimes and you genuinely worry that there’s no nutritional value in any of the things being donated it’s all rubbish sugar filled cereal, packets of biscuits, little cakes. Christmas couldn’t move for all the selection boxes that have been added in there, I did wonder what the hell anybody was gonna have for dinner.

@fallfallfall

what did people do in the 20's; well simple meals, extra clothing and nothing new. homes were tiny and furniture sparce. people used their time making and selling. no tv, no "nail art", no phones in most homes, people added things to meat to stretch it out (oatmeal in ground beef, eggs and breadcrumbs). oil filled lamps for a couple hours after sunset and in bed by 8-9. awake with the sun. they used scraps of material to make rugs in the winter. but everyone was in the same situation (although some were very wealthy).

Many many people went hungry. I remember my mother saying she didn't realise when she was a child that when her mother sat them down to a meal and had nothing herself it was because there wasn't enough food to go round. She would tell them she had eaten before them and have a slice of bread.

My granny was a cook, she could make a delicious meal with scraps but starvation in the 20s ruined her health.

@Bringsexyback

Well are we going to force a general election? If its going to be that bad ? In the 1920 they had general strikes. If people think we are returning to those days I suggest we return to those mentalities as well sharpish. It’s actually going to be nowhere near as bad as people are making out at all. Lots of people have had decent pay rises this year that will come to balance any increase in food and fuel prices if you haven’t I suggest you ask for one but I’ve been suggesting that on about 13 threads over the weekend and I just get we can’t …..well then it’s your own fault then.

Ok then Boris. Your ignorance is staggering

People may end up being forced to emigrate to countries where the cost of living is cheaper? Uprooting your home due to living costs is nothing out of the ordinary for millions of immigrants/second generation immigrants. For many, it's normal to be working in one country and send money home to your family in another. The situation OP is describing has existed for decades in many other countries and the logical answer is to move until you find an arrangement that's bearable. Many immigrants still live on the poverty line in their host countries but it's better than the real risk of starvation, cold or crime.

If things get bad enough in the UK/Europe then families might be forced to find similar arrangements. They might be able to do remote jobs that ensure an income and then live somewhere cheaper. Or one person takes on whatever job they can find in another country and sends extra money home. Budget might not stretch to travel, so once you move you accept that you will not see your relatives & friends for many years. People are resilient and it's not the end of the world to start anew somewhere. Having your immediate family with your (spouse & kids) is already a huge privilege. A common scenario is to start a business somewhere (shop, restaurant, cleaner etc) and have the whole family pitch in. This means you're not reliant on an employer and will have some kind of income.

@Polyanthus2

If people can't afford their mortgages more houses should go back on the market - if everyone isn't airbnb ing as they can't afford holidays, those houses also might go back on the market. If the cost of keeping your empty airbnb house aired is higher due to increases oil prices then again some homes might go back on the market. If the oligarchs give up their homes/estates they might appear on the market. If lots of houses go on the market the prices should fall.

That’s wishful thinking. There are too many people with enough money who will easily snap up those cheap houses to rent out to the people who will need them when they default on their mortgages. There is a shortage of decent rental property and this will tip the scales more firmly in a landlord’s favour. Add that to the number of people who will no longer be able to afford to move to larger properties and I think will see far fewer houses coming to market. We are already finding it in our area - almost daily postcards from local estate agents inviting us to have our home valued, but there’s no way I’d move at the moment - taking on more debt when there’s a potential risk to one or both jobs would be madness. So house prices may stagnate, but I don’t think there’ll be a swathe of bargain homes to be had.

@JudgeRindersMinder I don’t think Boris would be calling for general strikes do you ?

It is going to be tough for many many people who need to plan ahead now. The NI rise should not go ahead- 1.5% on top of the energy crisis and what is likely to be 8-10% RPI (not the lower CPI the govt likes to quote) means.

Speaking personally, we had very very tough times around 2008 so have done this before. The difference is that after struggling last time we vowed we would never again take out car leases (90% of new cars are leased/ PCP), use credit cards for holidays etc when we had got through the worst. Can cars be handed back these days and cheaper cars bought?

This time round we switched off the central heating a month ago and just heat the living room with a stove. We have halved our gas consumption.

The energy companies don't advertise this fact, but you can switch to variable monthly direct debit bills, so you don't have to accept their plans and you just pay for what you have used that month. We've done this as our gas use has plummetted but they wanted to hike our monthly payments. Take meter readings frequently though so you don't get behind

There are so many money saving websites now and doing a massive review of absolutely everything can make a huge difference.

My Dad was born in the early 1920s. I remember him telling me about his Mum having a cup of crusts with hot water, pepper, salt and a knob of marge for meals because once she'd fed the children and my granddad there was nothing left. They kept a goat and chickens which made things better for part of the year. He told me how angry he was that his Dad always managed to have his tobacco each week while his Mother went hungry.
When Dad and my Uncle joined up in 1939 they were given extra rations as they were diagnosed with malnutrition.

also, for the poor, not having a phone isnt an option, as you need one to keep on top of your universal credit account. If you dont live in town its probably cheaper than having to get a bus (if they run) into the local library to check your account, which is another option. Bus fares are astronomical round here.

People may end up being forced to emigrate to countries where the cost of living is cheaper?

I think young people will do this, far too much burden on them & little reward as housing is so expensive. I expect many will look for opportunities abroad, obviously this will only exacerbate things here.

The problem is that utility prices have been disproportionately cheap for a number of years. The deal May cut re energy prices about 5 years ago has ended at the worst possible time and we are paying for it now.

I think people have lost sight of the fact that things like inflation, interest rates, food, white goods, etc., have been very cheap for a very long time. It was never going to continue. I believe we will enter a depression. There is very little any government will be able to do about it.

I grew up in the 60s and 70s and have fond memories , but drawing pictures in the frost on the inside of my windows doesn't have the same appeal now .

What will happen? Some people will find a way to get very, or even, richer from it. Some people will die, from despair or pride. Some people will be cold abs hungry but survive. Some people will eat out less and be ok.

Those already at the bottom of the pile will suffer most. The gaps between incomes will grow. Childrens life chances will be impacted and society as a whole will suffer from the effects for much longer than the crisis goes on for.

[quote Bringsexyback]@Terfydactyl I actually see nothing but sweet shit in the trolley at Aldi in Sainsbury’s buyers you looking at sometimes and you genuinely worry that there’s no nutritional value in any of the things being donated it’s all rubbish sugar filled cereal, packets of biscuits, little cakes. Christmas couldn’t move for all the selection boxes that have been added in there, I did wonder what the hell anybody was gonna have for dinner.[/quote]
You see those with money right now.

Dirt poor people dont have the money to buy sweet shit, I know I was one for 10 long gruelling years. At one point I had no fridge so I lived on cooked pasta, no sauce, no butter, just plain pasta cos that's all I had in the cupboard and all I could afford to buy, 10p spaghetti for the best part of 6 months til I saved for a fridge. And water. People now will be doing the same as me all those years ago, it's not even just no fun, its grinding poverty, no end in sight, frankly I can see suicide rates increasing.

The possibility of being better off one day however distant gives you a reason to eat plain pasta or oatmeal for months at a time, or as I did microwave meals (I did this because depression and fuel poverty meant cooking food for long was not an option, my oven wasnt switched on for 10 years)

Those on fixed incomes are in dire straits, and if you @Bringsexyback dont want to give to a food bank or some other relevant charity because you apparently see dirt poor people buying nothing but sweet shit, then fine. The rest of us who can still afford it after the price rises will do what you wont.

@fallfallfall

what did people do in the 20's; well simple meals, extra clothing and nothing new. homes were tiny and furniture sparce. people used their time making and selling. no tv, no "nail art", no phones in most homes, people added things to meat to stretch it out (oatmeal in ground beef, eggs and breadcrumbs). oil filled lamps for a couple hours after sunset and in bed by 8-9. awake with the sun. they used scraps of material to make rugs in the winter. but everyone was in the same situation (although some were very wealthy).

A lot of families in the 1920s queued for a mug of soup and spent days in the public library to keep warm.

Many mothers and babies died, some women while giving birth but many because the oil lamp they kept on over night so they could see their baby to feed was knocked over and burned babies to death.

@Terfydactyl my apologies by trolley I meant the trolleys at the front of the store in Aldi and Sainsbury‘s that are filled with donations to the food bank typically it tends to be stuff thats just about to go out of date that Sainsbury’s or Audi have put in there, or junk and rubbish that people obviously do feel that those in need deserve a treat donate but they actually need dinner.

The wage stagnation over the last 2 decades hasn't helped or the inflation of assets.