To despair at our obession with cars

[SelkieQualia]

They are awful. Noisy. Polluting. 4 million people die every year from the effects of air pollution. Housing developments are built around them, which means that the most vulnerable people in our society - young people, the elderly - are made even more dependant on those who drive.
Why do we tolerate such terrible public transport and cycling infrastructure?

My last experience of using public transport was the single most stressful thing I've done this year. It cost an absolute fortune, took almost three times as long as driving and I found exactly nothing relaxing about it.

27 years since I left for Uni I haven't driven since then- DH nearly 30 years.

We've lived all over UK, holidays Uk based and done by train done days out buses trains and walking with 3 DC - commuted into work gone to interviews hospital appointment - everything having never driven.

And you're not wrong - so many horrific journeys seriously over crowded trains where it's a fight to get on and off - serious reliablity issues with buses and trains and the ever increasing costs.

These days it's often better to get a taxi if it's a set time to be there.

At least in cities and towns massive improvements are needed - rurally I think some cars willl always be needed though even there improvements could be made.

When you consider the almost nonexistent bus services in rural areas (where I live), the high price of train travel and the chances of drunken behaviour, risk of infection and getting wet walking to the bus stop in pouring rain it's a no brainer to use a car. Local authorities in rural areas are doing little to set up charging points so I do not intend to go electric and electric cars are very expensive to buy. My present 18 year old petrol car passes the MOT easily and the environmental costs of manufacture have been long amortised unlike those of a new electric model.

Captain, absolutely not, I am talking about the posters who don't need to drive snd have a flippant attitude towards reducing car use, I am not talking about people who have to drive for what ever reason, of which there are many

Because there's pitiful public transport in most places - the first bus to my workplace goes at 10am! Yes 10am it's obviously no intended for those who work. (It's laid on by the council every 2 hours and links 2 medical centres)

We have got very caught up in the practicalities and all the times it ISN'T convenient to use public transport/walk/cycle, but if we all tried to make alternative choices for those occasions when is IS convenient I think it really helps.

I am as guilty as the next car-driver - I live rurally, and whilst I could walk the 3 miles to my nearest town, realistically I mostly don't because the route is either via a lane which is extremely muddy in winter (not to mention hilly all year round) or via a 60mph B road with no pavement.

However, I really do try to walk everywhere I can within the village and am often viewed as a bit odd for doing this. Most of my neighbours drive to church, which is perfectly walkable in 10 minutes from almost all parts of the village. And yes I know, some of them will be rushing off to somewhere else afterwards which would mean walking the 10 minutes home isn't practical, but I know that the vast, vast majority are not (mainly because they pass me in the car on the way there, and then they pass me again on the way back!).

As for cycling @SelkieQualia you obviously don't like near here, 1 in 5 hills with sharp bends on 60 mph roads

I live rurally and work in community nursing covering that large rural area, I need my car and won’t be giving it up if I want to keep my
Job.

Alastair, no-one was suggesting you should

It is easier to just jump in a car. I don't think many people would even consider the feasibility of not driving when choosing activities.

We are the only people who don't drive our child to their swimming lesson. This is in a town with decent public transport and the lessons are at a school.

We wouldn't commit to activities like this if we had to use the car.

There is definitely an attitude of 'it's easier to drive' for non essential trips. Work and school I understand.

Captain, absolutely not, I am talking about the posters who don't need to drive snd have a flippant attitude towards reducing car use, I am not talking about people who have to drive for what ever reason, of which there are many

But you were flippant towards a poster who cited precisely a lack of infrastructure as their reason for driving, and the vast majority of posters on this thread, with only one or two exceptions, have cited lack of infrastructure, cost or disability. The more people obsess over the poor attitudes of a minority of car drivers, rather than the real issues preventing people from accessing more sustainable transport, the more the debate polarises and the actual issues are swept under the carpet.

For many people, using a car is unavoidable. However, many choose to avoid cycling or use public transport when they could easily do so. My husband is one. His journey to work would be a (company subsidised) 35 minute bus and train journey. The bus goes directly to the train station and bus times are timed to coincide with train times. From the train station there is a short walkway that leads directly to his office door. It is the ultimate journey in terms of convenience yet he still often chooses to take the car, which costs parking and uses fuel. He thinks he is too important to take the car. My ex boss was the same, straightforward bus journey to work yet I think she thought it was beneath her, so she always drove.

We have an electric car but the difficulty of finding charging points if we drive further than an hour and a half away from home is stressful. Electric cars also use heavy metals and a lot of energy to manufacture. It would be far better if everyone who could, reduced their vehicle use as much as possible, and those who have no other choice could continue to drive.

A lot of people with cars like cars. They like the independence and freedom a car gives them. They like being able to meet up with friends and family and stay until they want to leave. They like driving and see the car as an extension of their home. I do use buses during the day where I can but I don't cycle - I've had a car for over 50 years and will be sad when I'm deemed too old to drive it.

@balalake

What I object to most is people not walking short distances who can, and large SUVs. The latter I would reduce by requiring a separate driving test, as many would opt for a smaller car instead.

I drive a Ford Galaxy which is bigger than many of the SUVs. I need the boot space and I struggle to get into lower cars. Would I still need another driving test? Where do you cut it off...?

I also like driving. I enjoy it and I don't want to give that up.

Captain, not at all - many people choose to live where they live, not all, but many. If living rurally is important, that will naturally come with lack of infrastructure, if urban living is important, that comes with less green space etc. Some people decide where to live based on these kind of things.

I use my car as I have no desire to travel to work on a bus accompanied by rowdy schoolchildren going to the schools that are en route. But I suppose at least that means their parents aren't using cars to get them there ...

My preferred method of transport is by motorcycle, its much quicker and uses considerably less fuel, but the local city council have vastly reduced the number of dedicated parking spaces available. The nearest is 15 minutes walk from my office. The ones that remain are all on sketchy, unlit side streets so security for both myself and my bike is an issue here.

I'd cycle to work but there's nowhere secure to park that either. Shame really as the council has invested a fortune (££ millions) in creating about half a mile of dedicated cycle lane on the main route across the city...

My son's school is a hour away in one direction. His respite in a hour away in another. The activities he likes doing/can access are up to a hour away in a third direction. Having schools and suitable activities available nearby is privilege.

@Momicrone

Captain, not at all - many people choose to live where they live, not all, but many. If living rurally is important, that will naturally come with lack of infrastructure, if urban living is important, that comes with less green space etc. Some people decide where to live based on these kind of things.

Something like 17% of people live in rural areas (and of course a couple of hundred years ago, closer to 100% of people lived in rural areas!).

Can you imagine how bigger towns and cities would cope if their populations increased by nearly a quarter if everyone moved from rural to urban locations? Public transport and other infrastructure wouldn't cope and we'd have severe overcrowding, not to mention the urbal sprawl needed to provide housing for everyone. So, it's basically better to have people spread out and that means making transport provision for them. In most rural locations, that will mean an acceptance of private cars as public transport would be ruinously expensive to provide.

So, the answer is a balance. Public transport where the number of people justifies it, i.e. areas of concentration of people and facilities, but private transport in more rural areas. One size really doesn't fit all and a mix is needed. It really is pointless trying to provide a comprehensive public transport system in a rural area, likewise it's a bit stupid to own/drive a car in Central London.

@Momicrone

Captain, not at all - many people choose to live where they live, not all, but many. If living rurally is important, that will naturally come with lack of infrastructure, if urban living is important, that comes with less green space etc. Some people decide where to live based on these kind of things.

DH and I grew up rural - we've chosen cities and towns to live but even there public transport varies widley.

I have to admit I eyerolled at a "green" journalist who wrote about living fairly centrally in London but claimed they couldn't manage with out a car.

We've found though odd things even in cities - other locations within same city you can't get to at times needed - or places with no public transport -so you can't get close. Sometimes a taxi or long walk is the answer other times you just can't get there.

I completely agree op. I don't drive.

There will be loads for car drivers responding saying they couldn't possibly do without their cars.

The point is that we all have to accept that we are going to be inconvenienced, as the current level of car ownership is unsustainable.

Yes there are people who absolutely can't manage without a car. But most car drivers could choose to use their cars less, but are not willing to inconvenience themselves.

User149, so we agree then

@AntiHop

I completely agree op. I don't drive.

There will be loads for car drivers responding saying they couldn't possibly do without their cars.

The point is that we all have to accept that we are going to be inconvenienced, as the current level of car ownership is unsustainable.

Yes there are people who absolutely can't manage without a car. But most car drivers could choose to use their cars less, but are not willing to inconvenience themselves.

That’s fine that you’ve chosen not to drive, your choice.

My choice is to own a car but I only use it twice a week at most, I rarely eat meat, have a veg box from the local farm, seldom fly anywhere on holiday and only have one child. Those are my compromises.

Others may choose to have four kids, holiday abroad twice a year and NOT run a car as their compromise.

Regardless if your view, pretty much every one of us is polluting the planet just by being on it.

I have no public transport options I can use in my location. A car is a necessity in a rural area, especially with children. I am a keen cyclist and do this where I can, but I think the move should be to electric cars rather than getting rid of cars altogether which would really impact anyone in an area like ours.

@AntiHop

I completely agree op. I don't drive.

There will be loads for car drivers responding saying they couldn't possibly do without their cars.

The point is that we all have to accept that we are going to be inconvenienced, as the current level of car ownership is unsustainable.

Yes there are people who absolutely can't manage without a car. But most car drivers could choose to use their cars less, but are not willing to inconvenience themselves.

It's not just inconvenienced.

What makes you conclude that the current level of car ownership is unsustainable?
What other aspects of modern life will need to change/end, and why?

But most car drivers could choose to use their cars less, but are not willing to inconvenience themselves
No I’m not willing to be inconvenienced. I’m too busy and tired and have too little time. I will sacrifice a LOT for convenience because it buys me extra time - for most journeys it saves me at least an hour. If I have to cut back on other things to afford driving them so be it, I’ll cut back on food and heating before I cut back on driving. I’m willing to compromise by working from home and getting stuff delivered instead of getting in the car. I’m not willing to use a different mode of transport though.