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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To ask how many of these you will do to stop global warming?

297 replies

LadyinRead · 07/03/2022 20:38

Apparently if all indivisuals do these six things, we'll be 25% of the way to stopping global warming.
Are we doomed, then? I do most of these but (3) is impossible as appliances aren't built to last that long, and (4) would probably mean never seeing my parents again.

  1. Eat a largely plant-based diet, with healthy portions and no waste
  1. Buy no more than three new items of clothing per year. (Unlimited second-hand clothing allowed.)
  1. Keep electrical products for at least seven years
  1. Take no more than one short haul flight every three years and one long haul flight every eight years
  1. Get rid of personal motor vehicles
  1. Make at least one life shift to nudge the system, like moving to a green energy, insulating your home or changing pension supplier

www.theguardian.com/environment/2022/mar/07/six-key-lifestyle-changes-can-help-avert-the-climate-crisis-study-finds?fbclid=IwAR2llmcsBWVwzzdF0kzuW2tVPAnUbrMUn2hatbfIsrUQ1Awi1EI5XSe1lF0

OP posts:
Titsflyingsouth · 08/03/2022 14:52

I already buy most of my clothes 2nd-hand. Vinted has been a game-changer for me.

We are investigating green energy options. We have a south facing house in South -Eastern England so are considering solar panels.

Have no problem moving investments/pensions etc to more ethical funds in principle but I would seriously need more advice on this.

Live rurally so getting rid of the car isn't an option without better public transport....

I absolutely couldn't go vegan....

Titsflyingsouth · 08/03/2022 14:54

I wish I could keep electrical products for 7 years, but manufacturers make them to be obsolete. Phones being the worst offenders. All the mysterious glitches and issues that miraculously start happening when your phone suddenly turns 3 years old....

KobaniDaughters · 08/03/2022 15:14

Agree @Titsflyingsouth I’ll keep things until they die but they’re just not built to last

AlaskaThunderfuckHiiiiiiiii · 08/03/2022 15:35

I am trying most things except going totally meat free and giving up my car, work in rural community nursing so require my car for my job

deadlanguage · 08/03/2022 15:40

Is it certain phone manufacturers that tend to be common culprits for planned obsolescence do you think? Maybe there could be a campaign against those brands if so.

I have an iPhone which is almost 5 years old and I had one before that for 4 years which only died because of water damage. I also have an iPad mini which I think is 9 this year! Apple stuff is expensive but seems to last quite well.

There’s also the Fairphone which is designed to be easily repairable and uses some recycled materials in the manufacture as well I think.

Daftasabroom · 08/03/2022 15:40

@DdraigGoch EV emissions depend largely on the energy source, EU mix emissions would give a reduction of 32%, UK standard is better, a renewable energy tariff would give a lifetime reduction of over 52%. This is for the Volvo Polestar, smaller lighter cars such as the Nissan Zoe should be better still.

The 100 companies responsible for 71% is again very erroneous. These are scope 3 emissions for the 100 biggest fossil fuel companies. Scope 3 is of little use as it requires double accounting of carbon emissions so paints a very unrealistic picture. The 71% doesn't even include fugitive emissions which a significant element of which could be laid at the feet of those companies. Anyone quoting scope 3 emissions is being deceived (or deceiving).

Scope 1, scope 2 and LCAs are what count.

sadpapercourtesan · 08/03/2022 15:40
  1. No, we will not switch to a plant-based diet. We try to make healthy and ethical choices, but we are omnivorous and happy with that.
  1. I buy most of my clothes second-hand anyway, apart from underwear. I have a teenage son who will not wear second-hand, however, so I guess we fail on that one as well
  1. Keep electrical products for at least seven years - well, I would love to, but that would mean spending 4 years with a broken kettle, for example. We can't afford top-of-the-range appliances, so when they break we do have to replace them
  1. We don't really fly as we can't afford it. I've been on a plane twice in 10 years.
  1. Get rid of personal motor vehicles - we don't drive and have never owned a car. My 17yo is saving for one, however - I don't think anything we said would dissuade him.
  1. Unlikely. We, like many others, are bordering on skint most of the time. Things are about to get a whole lot worse financially, so the priority will remain as it is - making ends meet.
Satsumaeater · 08/03/2022 15:42

@deadlanguage

anyway plant-based diets are actually just as bad for the planet as meat-based ones

and the earth is flat…

Cheese and milk from the farm down the road is definitely better than importing alternatives from overseas. Generally eating local is much better than eating imported crap out of season.
Satsumaeater · 08/03/2022 15:44

Is it certain phone manufacturers that tend to be common culprits for planned obsolescence do you think? Maybe there could be a campaign against those brands if so

it's not just that they break - it's that the support for them is removed. For example we "had" to replace a perfectly good Windows 7 laptop in early 2020 because Microsoft stopped doing updates for it. That's the sort of thing that needs to be sorted out.

VelvetChairGirl · 08/03/2022 15:45
  1. Eat a largely plant-based diet, with healthy portions and no waste.

Already do.

  1. Buy no more than three new items of clothing per year. (Unlimited second-hand clothing allowed.)

couldnt do that, they dont last that long.

  1. Keep electrical products for at least seven years.

i try to keep them a damn sight longer then that but I have no control over when they break.

  1. Take no more than one short haul flight every three years and one long haul flight every eight years.

never been on a plane.

  1. Get rid of personal motor vehicles.

never had one.

  1. Make at least one life shift to nudge the system, like moving to a green energy, insulating your home or changing pension supplier.

no can do, I am in a rental and hopefully will get a state pension if they still exist.

Jaxhog · 08/03/2022 15:48
  1. No, but we have a weekly menu which has cut food waste to the minimum
  2. working on it
  3. yes
  4. not flown anywhere for 4 years
  5. We live rurally, with no buses. It's also very hilly and dangerous for bicycles. We wanlk whenever we can
  6. yes

Don't forget we should also be reducing our use of plastic too, along with other things:

  1. never buy plastic water bottles. Reuse what you already have
  2. Ditto plastic bags
  3. use reusable/washable facemasks
  4. buy sustainable fish
  5. buy local produce
mrkramps · 08/03/2022 15:49

Cheese and milk from the farm down the road is definitely better than importing alternatives from overseas. Generally eating local is much better than eating imported crap out of season.

100%. Is not possible for everyone but this is the ambition, not eating imported plants from monocultures in the amazon. You're also supporting more ethical practices by choosing smaller, local farms re. Animal rearing.

We incorrectly think plant based is unproblematic, but there's just different issues that arise.

RealBecca · 08/03/2022 15:50

I do 5 out of 6. I'll do 6 out of 6 when there is better public transport in rural areas.

Xpologog · 08/03/2022 15:56

Only one I don’t do is 5. I live too rural to go without a car. I don’t use it every day though.

deadlanguage · 08/03/2022 16:00

@Satsumaeater that is incorrect. Milk is around 700-800g co2 per pint and 85-90% of that comes from the farming, before you even get to the packaging, refrigeration, transportation etc. - in fact the transport is only 1%. Soya milk is around 500-600g per pint, by comparison.
A veggie burger is around 1kg vs 2.5kg for a cheeseburger. A banana is only 80g and 1.8kg for an out of season punnet of strawberries imported by air. At 2kg, a steak is about 25 bananas!
These figures are from Mike Berners-Lee’s book which lists the carbon footprint of lots of things. This doesn’t even factor in the impact of the methane from cows, which has a stronger greenhouse effect than co2.

Agrudge · 08/03/2022 16:00
  1. Eat a largely plant-based diet, with healthy portions and no waste

nope, meat and cheese is the best. But I dont waste food

  1. Buy no more than three new items of clothing per year. (Unlimited second-hand clothing allowed.)

nope i dont buy clothes for fun just as and when needed

  1. Keep electrical products for at least seven years

i keep thing until they no longer work. And try to repair if possible

  1. Take no more than one short haul flight every three years and one long haul flight every eight years

*nope I work 48 hrs a week I'm entitled to take a holiday to where I want to go.

But maybe people should flights for meetings*

  1. Get rid of personal motor vehicles

nope i like have 2 diesel cars and a motorbike

  1. Make at least one life shift to nudge the system, like moving to a green energy, insulating your home or changing pension supplier

we are being squeezed enough in this country I'll go with cheapest suppier. if I get the opportunity to own a home I would look at insulation.

We are a small country,without the big countries doing more any of the above is a drop in the ocean

AllOfUsAreDead · 08/03/2022 16:05

@entropynow

None of these will "stop global warming". Changes need to happen on a governmental and global basis and this sort of guilt-tripping serves no purpose save the illusion of control.
This. Plus even if people followed that list it's not enough. No flights, no cars at all, one child per family maximum, no more importing food from other countries (survive on what we make instead), no more buying stuff that we don't need. Those are the rules we need, and yes some people will suffer, but the amount of people we have alive were never meant to be, as cruel as that sounds. Our health care system keeps people alive that nature would have killed off ages ago. That's basically what we will end up at regardless any way, just won't happen for several decades, maybe centuries.

But you're right, it won't stop regardless. It will happen, some will survive it, many won't.

CeratopsofthePharoahs · 08/03/2022 16:07
  1. I am trying to eat less meat in general, but there's no way on God's green earth I am giving up bacon.
  2. For myself I don't buy a great deal of clothing. However, my children are growing and probably need more than 3 new items a year. Their school used to have a 2nd hand uniform shop, but since they changed the uniform and covid happened, they aren't currently doing that.
  3. I replace electronic items when they break. Currently have a microwave that was bought in the mid 90's. We only replaced our computer monitor and printer because the drivers became obsolete and there was no way to update them. I'm still pissed off by the printer, to be honest, it was a Cannon bubblejet and was a brilliant piece of kit.
  4. Haven't needed to fly anywhere in years, have no plans to going forward. We tend to holiday on the south coast of England.
  5. Public transport where I live is unreliable at best and doesn't go to the places I need to get to. Also, with my health slowly worsening I can't walk very far any more. I need my car. I am considering getting an electric car in the future, but right now they're just too expensive and it's better to keep an older car going than to buy a new one.
  6. Home is as insulated as it can be. When it comes to energy supplier, cost is the biggest factor, especially at the moment. I'd like to get solar panels, but again it's the £££ I just don't have.
KobaniDaughters · 08/03/2022 16:24

@Satsumaeater @mrkramps eating plant based doesn’t mean you can’t buy locally and in season?!

Daftasabroom · 08/03/2022 16:51

@CeratopsofthePharoahs and anyone else thinking of fitting solar panels please consider an air source heat pump first.

DdraigGoch · 08/03/2022 17:02

[quote Daftasabroom]@DdraigGoch EV emissions depend largely on the energy source, EU mix emissions would give a reduction of 32%, UK standard is better, a renewable energy tariff would give a lifetime reduction of over 52%. This is for the Volvo Polestar, smaller lighter cars such as the Nissan Zoe should be better still.

The 100 companies responsible for 71% is again very erroneous. These are scope 3 emissions for the 100 biggest fossil fuel companies. Scope 3 is of little use as it requires double accounting of carbon emissions so paints a very unrealistic picture. The 71% doesn't even include fugitive emissions which a significant element of which could be laid at the feet of those companies. Anyone quoting scope 3 emissions is being deceived (or deceiving).

Scope 1, scope 2 and LCAs are what count.[/quote]
Figures for the below post is taken from the 2020 edition of Mike Berners-Lee's book "How bad are bananas?"

"Renewable energy tariffs" are more greenwashing. It's an accounting fiddle. You should be looking at which generators cover 'marginal demand', not just your own tariff or the grid as a whole. If you are on such a tariff and you switch on a light, does a wind turbine start spinning slightly faster somewhere? No. That little bit of extra demand on the grid was almost certainly fulfilled by the governor on a gas turbine (or worse a diesel generator) opening slightly.

Likewise my parents have solar panels and storage batteries (and I'll do the same when finances permit). Yes, when they boil a kettle they are doing it for free, using renewable energy from their own roof. That doesn't mean though that it wouldn't have been better for the environment not to boil that kettle, and instead to sell that energy to the grid which would have (very slightly) reduced the output of said gas turbine.

So unless you are off-grid with your own independent you can't just go "all my electricity is renewable" and use as much of it as you like, guilt-free. The way your usage is attributed when your supplier does deals with National Grid, doesn't change the actual impact of you flicking that switch. You should still be trying to minimise your usage, whatever tariff you're on. Mike's book makes it clear why even though the grid is 30% renewable, when you are counting the carbon cost of flicking that switch, you should be assuming that the power you are using was actually generated using fossil fuels (page 51).

So, onto electric cars vs ICE cars. If you took a small, efficient petrol car from London to Glasgow and back, you will have been responsible for the emission of 237kg of CO2e. Half of that through the exhaust pipe, a third is a share of the impact of manufacturing and maintaining the vehicle, and the remainder is what the oil giant emitted in the process of getting fuel from the well to your tank.

Making the same journey in a small electric car by comparison holds you responsible for 148kg of CO2e. Which is around 50/50 between manufacturing and energy generation. So it's certainly better than doing it in a similarly sized petrol car (and miles better than the 1.02 tonnes an SUV generated, though I don't have comparable figures for an electric SUV), but still considerably worse than the 64kg emitted if you did the return journey by train.

As I said before, I'm not denying that electric cars are less of a problem than petrol or diesel. What I am saying is that electric cars are still a problem. You can't just trade in your car for an electric one and congratulate yourself on saving the planet. Most people need to move onto a combination of bicycles for short distances, and public transport for long.

And before anyone living in an isolated smallholding in Inverie comes on to protest that they have no choice but to use a car - I know you don't! I'm directing this at the 80% of the population who live in urban areas, most of whom DO have that choice, if they really did care.

mrkramps · 08/03/2022 17:15

[quote KobaniDaughters]**@Satsumaeater* @mrkramps* eating plant based doesn’t mean you can’t buy locally and in season?![/quote]
Yes @KobaniDaughters

But most people realistically aren't doing that. They're buying soy milk from Sainsbury's, not apples from the farmers market. I get it, it's not conveniently or always possible, hence why it's rarely done.

Maybe where you live, but in London it's rarely the case, it'll be supermarket, because you think plant based = green without considering where it actually comes from.

Yea I know I need to be assertive with sourcing food myself, as I say, it's a goal for people to work towards

Chouetted · 08/03/2022 17:32

@Satsumaeater

Is it certain phone manufacturers that tend to be common culprits for planned obsolescence do you think? Maybe there could be a campaign against those brands if so

it's not just that they break - it's that the support for them is removed. For example we "had" to replace a perfectly good Windows 7 laptop in early 2020 because Microsoft stopped doing updates for it. That's the sort of thing that needs to be sorted out.

I'm curious over why you couldn't update to 10, or put Linux on it, if it was still perfectly good?
thecatsthecats · 08/03/2022 17:34

1 - Staying omnivore, but endeavouring to reduce the air miles of ALL food, and associated packaging waste.
2 - What about knickers? I am working on this one, but I'd like the second hand market to help me out more on sizing (I'm tall and curvy - 34" waist and 50" bust - no easy to find second hand clothes).
3 - Easy. Our white goods were sold with the house in 2013, still going strong.
4 - Working on it - when we do travel, we try to opt for train/coach links within/between countries.
5 - I barely use my second hand car - local transport and on foot for the vast, VAST majority of journeys.
6 - Furniture/redecorating/reusing - we mend, restore, revamp household items rather than buying new.
7 - We plan to have one child.

Chouetted · 08/03/2022 17:40

@CHIRIBAYA

To say a blanket 'no' to reducing food waste is to demonstrate the most sickening entitlement and disrespect for the millions of people who lack the luxury of wallowing in such pig headed ignorance. Those posters refusing to reduce their fast fashion consumption are effectively saying that what is going on in the Atacama desert, which is dumping ground for fast fashion clothing, is fine. If that's the case let's dump it in your back yard instead. & this thread is not guilt tripping, it's about being a grown up and taking responsibility for your choices.
Most food isn't wasted by us.

I'll continue to throw away my chicken bones and mouldy oranges, thanks. They get composted by the council, who can do it at scale much more effectively than I can.

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