Please or to access all these features

Add post

Watch this thread

Save thread

Start a new thread

Flip thread

Hide thread

My feed

Active Unanswered threads

Getting started FAQ's

Unanswered threads Acronyms Talk guidelines

Hide shortcut buttons

Talk

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Flip

1 2 3

Original poster

Should I go to CSA??

63 replies

kickasssinglemum · 06/03/2022 10:06

Me and my ex-p split when our DS was a few weeks ago. Since DS was 4 months old ex-p started paying me £200 per month for maintenance. This increased to £350 on my request to cover half the childcare costs as we both work full time.

He has our DS overnight 2 nights a week (as he’s still a toddler). DS goes to childcare 3 days per week and I have him at home with me the other 2 days per week, while working a full-time job 5 days a week (I wfm these 2 days). My job is very stressful and demanding but I’m trying to keep the cost of childcare to a minimum.

We both have good jobs and earn well. Ex-p earns significantly more than me however. He is self employed so I don’t know how much exactly. However he owns 3 expensive properties (1 he lives in and 2 he rents out) as well as a mobile holiday home and drives a very nice car.

He has complained previously that he shouldn’t be paying me anything at all as I also have a ‘good job’ and that he only needs to “pay what he can”.

Childcare fees have now increased due to inflation so essentially there will be nothing left over from his current £350 once I pay half of his share of the childcare fees. I have asked him for more and he’s reluctant to increase the monthly payment anymore than £50 a month (so £400).

I pay for everything for DS and ex-p doesn’t pay for anything extra, except supplying what DS needs the 2 nights he stays with ex-p. We also share the driving for when DS stays with ex-p but ex-p doesn’t share the driving to nursery. I do all of that.

Ex-p has a new girlfriend and they frequently go on foreign holidays together and spend a lot of their weekends travelling around the country staying in 5* spa hotels. His girlfriend is much younger than him and wouldn’t be earning much at all to afford such a lifestyle, so I know he pays for everything for her.

I’m thinking I should go to CSA to get them to properly assess what ex-should be paying as I think it should be a lot more. Thoughts?

I don’t know ex-p’s NI number so is it a case that CSA will write to ex-p to ask him to provide details of what he earns?

OP posts:

justamumseekingadvice · 06/03/2022 10:09

Considering the fact that your child stays several nights a week with your ex - you are VERY unlikely to get anymore of child maintenance service, you will probably end up getting less.

Seriously £350-400 - count yourself lucky and be grateful for that rather than cutting off your nose to spite your face - I get £30 a month for my DD and plenty of single parents on here get absolutely nothing - try living off that!

PonyPatter44 · 06/03/2022 10:09

Yes, of course you need to go through the CSA. However, be aware that given you don't really know much about your existing finances, not even his NI number, you may find that he doesn't declare much of his income, meaning you might get even less maintenance.

MrsGHarrison87 · 06/03/2022 10:14

I thought the CSA only make them pay if they're not contributing elsewhere. I know if its a 50/50 shared arrangement they don't have to pay child maintenance. I don't know though, I never bothered chasing payments from my children's fathers as they were low earners and wasn't worth the stress.

earlydoors42 · 06/03/2022 10:16

As he is self employed, he might have creative accounting to make it look like he earns very little and so you might end up with less. My friend's ex owned several houses and had a shop but only had to pay her about £2 a week or something ridiculous.

Rainbowqueeen · 06/03/2022 10:20

The problem for you is that he is self employed. Does he declare all his income?

It’s very easy for self employed men to avoid paying what they should.

As a first step I would have a look on the csa calculator. Plug in what you think he earns then see how that compares to what he gives you.
His attitude stinks which worries me.

And finally write to your MP to ask that child maintenance laws be amended to take into account income from all sources not just employment (so dividends and rent as well) and that there is a link between the immigration department and child maintenance so that if someone pays a very low rate or maintenance and travels abroad then that is flagged as something that should be checked. Also if they are in arrears they are prevented from leaving the country until the arrears are paid.

TheDoveFromAboveCooCoo · 06/03/2022 10:20

It would be CMS not CSA and you can ask them to investigate as you don't believe he is paying his fair share.

Off the top of my head isn't it something like 30% of net earning.

And @justamumseekingadvice just because you don't have a decent arrangement with your ex that doesn't mean everyone else should suffer the same. Maybe try not to come across as so bitter next time. Also 2 nights per week is not "several nights".

lunar1 · 06/03/2022 10:21

I don't think you should specify with him that this is to cover childcare costs, he may just stop paying when your DS is at school.

It's a tricky one when he's self employed as he can hide a lot of income. I don't think assets are taken into account either.

The laws on maintenance are absolutely rubbish, you might find they end up lowering payments.

Original poster

kickasssinglemum · 06/03/2022 10:22

Ex-p is a barrister so I don’t know if he is being ‘creative’ with his accounts. He probably is. I worked out on the CSA calculator that the £350 ex-p is currently paying, taking into consideration the 2 nights a week DS stays with him that it’s the equivalent of ex-p earning £50k a year. He earns at least double that!

OP posts:

Lou98 · 06/03/2022 10:23

Honestly, if he's self employed I can't see you getting any more than £400 a month off of him.

It's worth looking in to but only you will know - if you decide to go down the CMS route and it turns out he owes you less than £400, will he then start paying less as he doesn't "have" to pay it? If so, you may find yourself in a worse position but only you will know what kind of man he is and if he would do that or keep giving you what he is now

Lou98 · 06/03/2022 10:26

Cross posted - he may not be fiddling the accounts as being a barrister he's less likely to get paid cash in hand. However, keep in mind he'll have tax, NI and business expenses etc that can be written off of that too.

As I said above, if you think he would keep paying you the £400 regardless of what CMS says then there's no harm in trying but if they then come back and say he only owes £300 for example then will he drop down to only paying you that?

Mellowyellow222 · 06/03/2022 10:29

@justamumseekingadvice

Considering the fact that your child stays several nights a week with your ex - you are VERY unlikely to get anymore of child maintenance service, you will probably end up getting less.

These threads are always a race to the bottom.

Women throw up their example of a useless ex who pays £2.50 a year a tells the women they should count themselves lucky they’re get anything.

It’s all very depressing

lunar1 · 06/03/2022 10:31

It's probably not fiddling accounts. But he will be able to buy an awful lot through a limited company that the rest of us have to buy post tax. Are dividends used in the calculation?

Theunamedcat · 06/03/2022 10:32

Be careful he can start to declare "losses" technically his rental properties bring in income but he can ask them to pay cash and hide that he could go for 50/50 and there is no reason why he wouldn't get it and pass the child off to his girlfriend to look after

It's only 12% of his salary so unless your very sure he won't hide or go for 50/50 you might not be better off

Theunamedcat · 06/03/2022 10:34

He is under no legal obligation to actually pay for your childcare anyway just 12% minus his two days

Can you get a cheaper provider?

Original poster

kickasssinglemum · 06/03/2022 10:40

Thanks for the advice all. I think he would be really difficult financially if I went to CMS. If the assessment was lower he would start paying the lower amount.

I know he should be paying a lot but if it runs the risk that he earns less then it may not be worth the hassle. I might just try and have to appeal to his reasonable side and hope that he can work with me financially in splitting the cost of childcare and then contributing a bit more to general maintenance also.

OP posts:

millymolls · 06/03/2022 10:40

Well
Of course he should help more but unfortunately

I). He’s not expected or required to pay towards childcare costs ( over and above cms mo they min)
2) he’s self employed, likely to only pay himself c£12k per year

So you could see it go down based on a cms assessment

Original poster

kickasssinglemum · 06/03/2022 10:53

He’s currently only paying £350. He hasn’t agreed to the £50 increase yet! My worry is that he would try and go for 50/50 custody and as he’s a barrister he would have lots of legal friends who could advise him on what to say.

He doesn’t live wi the his girlfriend but on the 2 nights he does have DS he passes him off to his mum so he would do that if it was on a 50/50 split basis. I would die if he got 50/50 as DS is only 2.

I think I’m probably best asking him to agree to the increase to £400 and as and when big purchases come up maybe help out there too from time to time.

OP posts:

AHungryCaterpillar · 06/03/2022 11:16

I would try to avoid cms if you can, they are rubbish, my ex didn’t have to pay anything and cms wouldn’t do anything about it.

cadburyegg · 06/03/2022 11:20

As he is self employed and you're getting £350-£400 for one child I don't think it would be worth the hassle of going through the CMS

MorningStarling · 06/03/2022 11:25

As a rule only go to the CMS if you're certain that you will get significantly more than you get through any voluntary arrangements. If they award you less, or even the same, it's a lot of hassle and aggravation for nothing.

LacasadeBernadaAlba · 06/03/2022 11:29

Seriously £350-400 - count yourself lucky and be grateful for that rather than cutting off your nose to spite your face

If the ex partner is paying below the minimum that the CMS would calculate, I don't think she needs to be grateful for what she gets. It's a legal minimum at the end of the day. The system is utterly broken - I haven't received a penny for 3 children in 12 years - but we shouldn't be telling people to feel grateful they're getting as much as they do because it's more than we get.

newbiename · 06/03/2022 11:31

@justamumseekingadvice

Considering the fact that your child stays several nights a week with your ex - you are VERY unlikely to get anymore of child maintenance service, you will probably end up getting less.

She should be grateful he contributes financially to his child ? She pays for everything.

LuaDipa · 06/03/2022 14:16

@justamumseekingadvice

Considering the fact that your child stays several nights a week with your ex - you are VERY unlikely to get anymore of child maintenance service, you will probably end up getting less.

I’m sorry you get such a small amount, but op should not be grateful that her ex is paying for his child. The system is utterly wrong but that isn’t op’s fault. She she should get what she is entitled to as should every other single parent. What is wrong is that your ex gets away with paying so little.

Thehop · 06/03/2022 14:20

I would think carefully. He’s not obliged to pay towards any childcare at all.

liveforsummer · 06/03/2022 14:20

If he's self employed he can easily avoid CMS at all. Many self employed men pay £7 pw . Given he has him 2 nights every week that will reduce what he's expected to pay. I'd stick with what yo got rather than rock the boat

Flip

1 2 3

Swipe left for the next trending thread