To think this isn't very nice ? ( Pro-life protestors)

[chattycaterpillar]

I am pregnant, 11 weeks, first pregnancy. Like all first time mother's, I am very worried about miscarriage.

Anyway, my booking appointment was changed to a phone appointment cos I had Covid at the time of the appointment. The midwife arranged for me to come in today, ( a week or so after isolation finished), so I could get my bloods/ Blood Pressure/ urine sample done etc.

The maternity centre is based in a community hospital that has a variety of NHS Community/ outpatient services attached, ( acute/ emergency treatments are at the main hospital across town). But the community hospital has maternity outpatients, mental health teams, counselling, STI testing, audiology, physiotherapy , dermatology services attached to it. It also has BPAS abortion clinic inside, ( which I didn't realise until this morning).

Anyway , a short distance from the hospital, when I was going in, there were about 8 signs with the most horrific images , ( very large), of dead foetus's etc. I had a leaflet thrust in my hand and the images, well for someone worrying about miscarriage, they were very upsetting.

AIBU to say whilst I understand termination is a controversial issue, it's completely out of order to force these images on members of the public ?

The midwife who did my bloods etc said I wasn't the first person who'd been upset by it, and that there was also a recurrent miscarriage clinic being run at the hospital so she imagined it would cause a lot of upset.

Never mind a vulnurable teenager or rape victim walking into the BPAS clinic being forced to see these images ?

I got talking to a lady in the waiting room who said she had experienced a stillbirth a few months before and found being confronted by these images incredibly distressing.

P.s would love to hear from the 6% voting YABU!

I wonder if the Police, Crime, Sentencing and Courts Bill 2021 will tackle this sort of protest (rather than just fools glueing themselves to motorways?) I hope that the Bill wont curtail peaceful protest but these sort of protests have to be in the mind of the Government when drafting the bill? They are completely abhorrent.

OP, I watched a TV programme once and they said the photos (in the protests they were investigating) were fakes, very realistic horrific fakes.

@LuckySantangelo35

P.s would love to hear from the 6% voting YABU!

According to a related thread, those who have voted YABU feel that they 'would be ripped apart' if they voiced why they feel harassing women is OK.

@Crazycatlady83

I wonder if the Police, Crime, Sentencing and Courts Bill 2021 will tackle this sort of protest (rather than just fools glueing themselves to motorways?) I hope that the Bill wont curtail peaceful protest but these sort of protests have to be in the mind of the Government when drafting the bill? They are completely abhorrent.

OP, I watched a TV programme once and they said the photos (in the protests they were investigating) were fakes, very realistic horrific fakes.

That was my thought too, hopefully it gives the people who are opposed to the new restrictions something to think about.

They are up in arms that they might not be allowed to block roads and inconvenience or alarm the public, but forget there really are things that people should be banned from doing.

I can't think of anything that justifies forcing graphic images of dead foetuses on people (certainly not the issue of abortion).

@Waitwhat23 That’s very cowardly isn’t it. If you cannot defend your opinion, shows what a shite one it is.

@Waitwhat23
What related thread?

Fairly sure I'll get my post deleted if I do a direct link but there's a thread on AIBU which has a title of (roughly) 'is it cowardly to vote YABU on a clearly emotive thread without explaining why?'

@Waitwhat23

Fairly sure I'll get my post deleted if I do a direct link but there's a thread on AIBU which has a title of (roughly) 'is it cowardly to vote YABU on a clearly emotive thread without explaining why?'

Oh okay, thank you!

Thirteen years ago I had to have a termination, it was either that or having my baby die in agony soon after being born. It was a horrendous thing to have to do but the kindest.

It still hurts, we have a grave we put flowers on and wonder what might have been.

If I saw these cunts I’d shove their leaflets where the sun doesn’t shine. How dare they judge me and other women in what could be horrendous situations? I doubt many women terminate a pregnancy lightly, it’s a horrible experience to go through.

YANBU, these people are bastards, and lying, insensitive bastards too. Who want to force women to give birth.

I complained to the police about this in Cardiff last year. Apparently these fuckers have a right to subject people to horrific images that they haven't consented to seeing. Never mind people's right to go about their lawful business, the pro life nuts are the only ones whose rights seem to matter.

The police were sympathetic but said their hands were tied. I was not the first person that day to go in and object. Personally, I think I should have the right to beat them in the face with their own placards, without getting arrested!

Clearly a complex issue

It's not. Painting this as a debate is playing into these people's hands. Access to free, safe abortion saves women's lives. In their thousands. Debates have some kind of sides. This doesn't. Free, safe abortion is necessary healthcare. Banning it doesn't stop abortion, it just makes it deadly.

I used to be involved with a program which housed young, homeless, pregnant women in homes. Not one of the households supporting young, pregnant, homeless women was pro-forced birth. We were helping the women who wanted to have their babies but were all firmly pro-choice. Where were all the pro-forced birthers? Outside clinics, not helping women.

We need to stop behaving as if certain things are a debate with two sides. Hating women isn't a side, it's an abomination.

@MrsTerryPratchett

Clearly a complex issue

It's not. Painting this as a debate is playing into these people's hands. Access to free, safe abortion saves women's lives. In their thousands. Debates have some kind of sides. This doesn't. Free, safe abortion is necessary healthcare. Banning it doesn't stop abortion, it just makes it deadly.

I used to be involved with a program which housed young, homeless, pregnant women in homes. Not one of the households supporting young, pregnant, homeless women was pro-forced birth. We were helping the women who wanted to have their babies but were all firmly pro-choice. Where were all the pro-forced birthers? Outside clinics, not helping women.

We need to stop behaving as if certain things are a debate with two sides. Hating women isn't a side, it's an abomination.

Yes, exactly. It's not a debate.

Don't want an abortion? Excellent, don't have one. Don't stop anyone else having one.

MrsTerryPratchett hear hear!

I'd like to add that we should be careful, even here on this thread, of talking in terms of somehow 'ok' reasons to be having an abortion. Perhaps rape, perhaps medical reasons ect.

Perhaps it's being done subconsciously - but a woman who has had an abortion for ANY reason will feel upset by those images, there should be no right or wrong abortion. That road leads us straight to the pro-lifers.

Woman should not feel they need to justify their choice.
I mean this kindly.

God that’s awful. My youngest DD has just had a miscarriage, and I would be so upset for her if she’d had to face these images when going to one of her many checkups. I hope you’re ok OP and wish you all the best with your pregnancy.

@Laiste

MrsTerryPratchett hear hear!

I'd like to add that we should be careful, even here on this thread, of talking in terms of somehow 'ok' reasons to be having an abortion. Perhaps rape, perhaps medical reasons ect.

Perhaps it's being done subconsciously - but a woman who has had an abortion for ANY reason will feel upset by those images, there should be no right or wrong abortion. That road leads us straight to the pro-lifers.

Woman should not feel they need to justify their choice.
I mean this kindly.

Exactly. There is no 'wrong' type of abortion, as long as it's wanted, safe, and freely available.

@MrsTerryPratchett

Clearly a complex issue

It's not. Painting this as a debate is playing into these people's hands. Access to free, safe abortion saves women's lives. In their thousands. Debates have some kind of sides. This doesn't. Free, safe abortion is necessary healthcare. Banning it doesn't stop abortion, it just makes it deadly.

I used to be involved with a program which housed young, homeless, pregnant women in homes. Not one of the households supporting young, pregnant, homeless women was pro-forced birth. We were helping the women who wanted to have their babies but were all firmly pro-choice. Where were all the pro-forced birthers? Outside clinics, not helping women.

We need to stop behaving as if certain things are a debate with two sides. Hating women isn't a side, it's an abomination.

Sorry, @MrsTerryPratchett, I didn't mean I think abortion should be banned/ taken off the NHS, ( as you say, that would pave the way for illegal and unsafe abortion which would be horrific). Clearly , it needs to remain a safe, regulated NHS service.

However, I do understand the need to drastically reduce the number of abortions in the U.K, as that is clearly a high number of women who will suffer some considerable trauma. I think we can all agree that none of us would ever want to have an abortion for fun.

I just think, instead of forcing these horrific images on people, it would make more sense for the pro life cause to focus on:

1. Better sex education and promotion of/ access to LARC contraception, for all women.
2. Longer sentences for rapists/ severe punishment for child exploitation, to minimise the risk of pregnancies being conceived due to rape.
3. Providing better benefits, maternity rights, employment rights.
4. More HV, early years, respite support.

I’m pro-life and a Catholic. I massively disagree with the graphic posters being shown in the situation you describe.
I think it’s counter productive and distressing.
We need more education about the stages of development of the unborn baby and more open discussion about abortion regret - it isn’t spoken about enough.

However, I do understand the need to drastically reduce the number of abortions in the U.K, as that is clearly a high number of women who will suffer some considerable trauma. I think we can all agree that none of us would ever want to have an abortion for fun.

No-one believes women have abortions for fun. But for many women abortion is a straight forward medical procedure without any trauma. It's not always devastating, emotional, traumatic etc. Most abortions are not.

2) Longer sentences for rapists/ severe punishment for child exploitation, to minimise the risk of pregnancies being conceived due to rape.

This shouldn't be done with the objective of reducing abortion at all! It sends a message that abortion is worse than the act of rape itself and we should only stamp it out to stop those pesky abortion-havers.

I'm so sorry you had to see that, OP.

I ised to be friends with someone who got mixed up with one of these anti-abortion groups, and it is like brainwashing. They have 'training' sessions, big events, planned campaigns (they ran a hate campaign against the MP Stella Creasy), lists of companies they boycott because they donate to Planned Parenthood or fund emergency contraception through Obamacare in the US. We had a huge falling out over it when I was suffering PTSD after my son's birth and her argument was that if it saves one child's life, surely it's worth however many people being upset by their images.

We need more education about the stages of development of the unborn baby and more open discussion about abortion regret - it isn’t spoken about enough.

99% of women said having an abortion was the right choice 5 years later. Abortion regret is vanishingly rare.

@cuno

However, I do understand the need to drastically reduce the number of abortions in the U.K, as that is clearly a high number of women who will suffer some considerable trauma. I think we can all agree that none of us would ever want to have an abortion for fun.

No-one believes women have abortions for fun. But for many women abortion is a straight forward medical procedure without any trauma. It's not always devastating, emotional, traumatic etc. Most abortions are not.

2) Longer sentences for rapists/ severe punishment for child exploitation, to minimise the risk of pregnancies being conceived due to rape.

This shouldn't be done with the objective of reducing abortion at all! It sends a message that abortion is worse than the act of rape itself and we should only stamp it out to stop those pesky abortion-havers.

Sorry I didn't mean that to sound like rape is okay as long as there is no pregnancy involved. Clearly it isn't.

@chattycaterpillar

No I don't think you think that, I think you are being well-meaning with it, but the argument to reduce abortion on that basis would be used against women.

@cuno

We need more education about the stages of development of the unborn baby and more open discussion about abortion regret - it isn’t spoken about enough.

99% of women said having an abortion was the right choice 5 years later. Abortion regret is vanishingly rare.

Yes. I don't think that the fact that the vast majority of women don't suffer any form of trauma after terminating a pregnancy is spoken about enough.

The percentage of women who suffer abortion regret is actually very low. This is not to say that these women shouldn't have help built into the system - they should. But let's not buy into the myth that it's particularly common because that's feeding the pro life brigade's agenda.