To appeal this driving ban?

[GaiusHelenMohiam]

Around ten years ago I was very ill, later diagnosed with bipolar, I attempted suicide more than once. I surrendered my driving license.

After about four years I was stable, right meds, right lifestyle, working and all going well. So I reapplied and got my license back. I’ve then had to reapply every year, always successfully.

While in the throes of my illness I struggled a fair bit with alcohol and asked my GP for help. I attended a group for a couple of months, and left the group with the coordinators blessing after a progress review, she said I wasn’t really suited to it as it was aimed at dependent drinkers whereas I was a binge drinker.

This means that I have to have a blood test for my license. It’s always a bit insulting because literally all the literature that comes with the appointment is aimed at High Risk Offenders who drink drive.

I’ve never changed my drinking habits before the test and have always had moderate results.

Anyway Covid delays have meant my reapplication took nearly a year this time (I’ve been allowed to drive while waiting) and I went for my blood test last month.

The results came this morning, again moderate. But the letter says as I have a ‘history of alcohol dependency’ I am banned from driving for a year and have to be abstinent for a year before I can reapply.

What the fuck? Does anyone know if this is worth appealing? I’m not and have never been alcohol dependent, I think there is a mistake in my medical records. I have had my license renewed every year for the past six with no issues at all and this is the first time ‘alcohol dependence’ has been mentioned. They’ve never said I need to be abstinent, just not in the red zone.

I’m kicking myself for not abstaining for a month before the test tbh. But it’s always been fine. I’m fucked without my car, I work more than full time and finish very late, no public transport.

Does anyone know what my chances are of appealing?

Do you also have bipolar disorder? Do you understand the difference that makes?

I didn't until now.

Good luck op I hope you find a better path to the place you need to be.

@GaiusHelenMohiam

I don’t binge drink now!

I have a couple of glasses of wine after a long shift at work to wind down, or share a bottle with DH if we have an evening off together. Like almost every other person I know.

I was very ill and destructive back then, drinking was another form of self harm. I now live my life with no bipolar symptoms or alcohol abuse. I don’t get why this has come up now, unless it’s an error.

Maybe don’t compare yourself to others. You’re basically saying if others drink this much, then it’s ok if I do too. None of my friends and family need a couple of glasses of wine to relax after work, and don’t share a bottle of wine on a regular basis. If this is how much you drink, you’re over the safe guidelines for alcohol.

I have a couple of glasses of wine after a long shift at work to wind down, or share a bottle with DH if we have an evening off together. Like almost every other person I know.

This is not a healthy amount of alcohol to be drinking for someone without bipolar, let alone someone with.

@GaiusHelenMohiam

I think I’ve lost sight of normal since before Christmas. I’ve just been a ball of stress.

You don't see a link between this, a psychiatric illness diagnosis and excessive, nightly alcohol consumption, so much alcohol, for so long that your blood test results are high enough to get you banned from driving? Come on OP, start looking after yourself and the people around you, do something about it.

Ring the DVLA and ring your GP aswell.

@appleturnovers

Definitely appeal it if you have reason to believe it is based on inaccurate information.

Why don't you focus your efforts on stopping drinking completely instead of fighting the technicalities of a ban. - is a stupid comment. Most people in this country drink lightly for social reasons. Abstaining completely for a whole year would be a massive PITA for most people and hinder them socially. Why should OP have to go to those lengths when she's never been dependent on alcohol and, more to the point, has NEVER drink driven?!

Whilst I don’t have any issue with anyone drinking socially. Whatever.

I do take issue with your statement saying about people not drinking would hinder most socially

I’ve never drunk. Nor does my husband. Nor does my family. Nor does his. It’s never once hindered us. In fact people always invite us out because we can drive. It might be the only reason. But we’re always the last standing!!!

@GaiusHelenMohiam

I’ve just checked my last results and they were 2.1.

So it might be that those extra .2 points have fucked me.

What a dick.

*For drivers with a history of alcohol dependence GREEN - %CDT = below 1.7% A CDT level below 1.7% suggests no recent alcohol intake. This means that a CDT level up to and including 1.6% would be acceptable as evidence of there being no recent alcohol intake in someone classed as alcohol dependent. RED - %CDT = 1.7% - 2.2% or more A CDT level between 1.7% and 2.2% or more suggests recent excess alcohol intake.

For drivers with a history of alcohol misuse
A CDT level of up to 2.2% is acceptable as evidence of controlled drinking in someone with a previous history of alcohol misuse only. Otherwise the amber levels below would apply.

For drivers with no history of alcohol dependence or misuse
GREEN - %CDT = 2.2% or less
A CDT level of less than 2.2% or less is considered to be in the normal range. A person whose CDT level falls within this range is identified as consuming little or no alcohol and is compatible for licensing.
AMBER - %CDT = 2.3% - 2.9%
A CDT level between 2.3% and 2.9% is considered to be indicative of possible problematic alcohol consumption. A person whose CDT levels fall within this range is identified as someone who may drink to excess or binge drinks regularly and will trigger further enquiries with that persons general practitioner (GP) before a licensing decision is made.
RED - %CDT = 3% or more
A CDT level greater than 3% is considered to be indicative of alcohol consumption in a dependent manner. A person whose CDT levels fall within this range is identified as someone who is dependent on alcohol and a driving licence will be refused*

As you can see OP, as someone who has a history of alcohol misuse, you’ve fallen into the Amber category, meaning that it’s indicative of a possible problematic alcohol consumption and this triggers further enquiries with your GP.

I’d re-emphasise OP, you have fallen into the Amber zone (lower end of); you have been on a high risk pathway which, if the situation is as you describe, will probably be a rolling error - not uncommon, but as others have said, discriminatory from a MH perspective. I suggest booking to see your GP to discuss whether they consider you to have a history of dependency - there are criteria for this. If this is, as I suspect, sloppy documentation with near-synonyms like dependence and misuse, you should have good grounds to appeal. You may be a teensy bit on the high end of sensible consumption, but this is a health choice rather than a driving competence issue. If your GP confirms no history of dependence, I suspect an appeal would be successful.

@CassandraCalled

I’d re-emphasise OP, you have fallen into the Amber zone (lower end of); you have been on a high risk pathway which, if the situation is as you describe, will probably be a rolling error - not uncommon, but as others have said, discriminatory from a MH perspective. I suggest booking to see your GP to discuss whether they consider you to have a history of dependency - there are criteria for this. If this is, as I suspect, sloppy documentation with near-synonyms like dependence and misuse, you should have good grounds to appeal. You may be a teensy bit on the high end of sensible consumption, but this is a health choice rather than a driving competence issue. If your GP confirms no history of dependence, I suspect an appeal would be successful.

The amber category is for people with no history of alcohol dependence or misuse.

For people with a history of misuse, there is no colour scale. 2.2 and up is a ban.

@appleturnovers

Definitely appeal it if you have reason to believe it is based on inaccurate information.

Why don't you focus your efforts on stopping drinking completely instead of fighting the technicalities of a ban. - is a stupid comment. Most people in this country drink lightly for social reasons. Abstaining completely for a whole year would be a massive PITA for most people and hinder them socially. Why should OP have to go to those lengths when she's never been dependent on alcohol and, more to the point, has NEVER drink driven?!

If you believe not drinking is so difficult and would hinder someone socially you must also have a drinking problem. What an odd thing to think- drinking is not an essential thing in life.

@HereComesTheSum

I agree. That comment was very worrying.

There seem to be quite a few people on this thread with a worrying relationship with alcohol, which is sad enough, but the worst thing is how they are hurrying to tell the OP not to give up drinking.

I’m having a very shitty stressful time at work, think 60hr weeks and no staff. Some days the only thing that got me through a 16hr shift was the thought of a lovely cold glass of wine afterwards. I’m an idiot.

I wish you good luck with your appeal, but the way you have described your thoughts on alcohol does sometimes indicate there may be more of a dependence on it that you realise. If the thought of having wine really is the only thing that gets you through the day, then maybe there still is a bit of a problem.

I’m utterly baffled by the responses on this thread. The OP has said she has never driven under the influence. The links that are being posted seem to be talking about offenders, ie people who have previously been convicted of drink driving. So surely not relevant to the OP, regardless of how much she drinks. The issue seems to be why she’s having to submit to alcohol testing for her license renewal when she’s not ever had any form of conviction related to alcohol.

The issue seems to be why she’s having to submit to alcohol testing for her license renewal when she’s not ever had any form of conviction related to alcohol.

Crazy, isn’t it?

"The issue seems to be why she’s having to submit to alcohol testing for her license renewal when she’s not ever had any form of conviction related to alcohol."

The DVLA doesn't work on what has happened. They work on what could happen. If you have epilepsy but have never had a seizure behind the wheel, they don't give you a licence and take it away once something happens. They risk assess and decide if you could cause an incident by having a seizure.

The OP has disclosed heavy drinking behaviour at some point to her GP. That has been passed to the DVLA, who have asked the OP to do a blood test. If she hadn't been drinking to excess, that would have been the end of it. But the blood test showed that she was drinking heavily at times, which means that the DVLA don't want to take the risk of giving her a licence.

The DVLA doesn't work on what has happened. They work on what could happen

That’s madness. On that basis nobody would have a driving licence. After all anyone could have a heart attack behind the wheel.

From reading the literature on the tests it would seem that abstaining for 3 weeks or so would significantly improve your score. Why, if you are at risk of losing your license, would you not do what you could to improve your chance of a good score? Must be because you can't because you are dependant upon alcohol. If anything peoples real score should be even higher than what they score if they could abstain for a short period and game their score.

Everything the OP has put about her alcohol intake has screamed denial and attempted to minimise it - that 2.3 score tells a very different story. It is also very likely the OP has also been (albeit unknowingly) dui the next morning regularly.

Time to suck it up and realise you have been luck to be caught this way and not by a roadside breath test (with or without an accident being involved).

@user1471447863

From reading the literature on the tests it would seem that abstaining for 3 weeks or so would significantly improve your score. Why, if you are at risk of losing your license, would you not do what you could to improve your chance of a good score? Must be because you can't because you are dependant upon alcohol. If anything peoples real score should be even higher than what they score if they could abstain for a short period and game their score.

Everything the OP has put about her alcohol intake has screamed denial and attempted to minimise it - that 2.3 score tells a very different story. It is also very likely the OP has also been (albeit unknowingly) dui the next morning regularly.

Time to suck it up and realise you have been luck to be caught this way and not by a roadside breath test (with or without an accident being involved).

👏

@Blossomtoes

The DVLA doesn't work on what has happened. They work on what could happen

That’s madness. On that basis nobody would have a driving licence. After all anyone could have a heart attack behind the wheel.

Not at all. The DVLA has received information that indicates that there is a potential risk. The blood test has backed up this information.

*Oh my good lord. Rest the thread properly.

The most recent development is they’ve revoked her licence because of her blood test result.

We know it happened because OP told us it happened.*

@ThymePoultice apologies, I was referring to the reason for the original “loss” of the licence and didn’t realise that you weren’t.

@EvenTheReceptionStaffHaveLeft

*Oh my good lord. Rest the thread properly.

The most recent development is they’ve revoked her licence because of her blood test result.

We know it happened because OP told us it happened.*

@ThymePoultice apologies, I was referring to the reason for the original “loss” of the licence and didn’t realise that you weren’t.

Fair enough.