Why do people from poorer backgrounds have low aspirations

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I may not be explaining myself well here so please bear with me!

I've seen on here a few times where it's been mentioned that people from poorer backgrounds / deprived areas don't have higher aspirations. It seems they can do better but don't.

Just wondering why this is and what would help to change it.

Reason I'm asking is I'm from a por background and I still am. I don't want this for my kids but don't know how or what to do to change it.

I was the first person in my family to go to university. A lot of family took issue to it. They thought that I thought I was above them somehow.

@HelloCrocus

I agree with some PPs actually... Why do we all have to up sticks and move to the other end of the country at age 18? This doesn't happen in lots of other countries. I know, I know - it's our centralised economy and insane house prices. I did it too - but pay the price of having no local support network, no strong roots, and frankly feeling a bit alienated from the urban professional classes that I'm now surrounded by (have become?). It's not that I wanted to be "better" than the lower-middle-class provincial I am, or even to have a great career for the sake of a career; I just wanted to be able to afford a house and family. I'd rather be one of life's vetinerary nurses than one of life's vets (see PP a few posts above), if money was no object. There's more to life.

Meh I moved countries and I'm still "just" a TA.

Drive plays a large part. I came from a poor household where aspiration was sneered at, my mother made it clear women were solely here to look after men / bear children and she made it her life's work to make me feel like I was never good enough.

It also instilled a 'fuck you' in me that made me always be determined that I did deserve opportunity, did need to learn and work hard and could always do better and that wasn't a bad thing.

She stopped me going to university, so I got a (very crap) job, moved out and studied in the evening, at my own cost.

I pretty much worked my way up to where I am now, a senior technical manager for a large successful blue chip, with a little.bit of luck, but mostly hard work, always believing in the back of my head I don't really deserve it.

My daughter is being brought up to believe she can do anything, but she needs to work hard. I won't push her into any particular route, as I don't think University is the only choice to be successful but daily, I do still hear her say stereotypes from her that she must have only heard from other kids. When will we stop stereotyping kids before they even start school

@HundredMilesAnHour

I don't know if staying within 3 miles of where you were born and near family is necessarily a bad thing, and a large sector of society certainly don't think it is, and are quite happy in their so called low aspirational jobs with family around them.

It's not necessarily a bad thing nor is it necessarily a good thing. But it is uninformed. It's not knowing, or worse, being fearful of what else might be out there. Maybe you live in the best place in the world, maybe with the best family in the world, maybe you'd hate being a doctor or a pilot or a dog groomer or whatever you might dream of being. But it's frequently the poor and the working classes who don't have the luxury of finding out and hence making an informed decision.

We laugh at the cheesy phrase "living my best life" but many people don't have a choice in it, they're living their only life. And not necessarily one they'd choose. Some people have been fortunate enough to never be in that position, some of us have been fortunate enough to drag ourselves out (and if we go back, it's through choice rather than necessity) but for some people this is all they know. And all their children will know.

I don't disagree. Just pointing out that the 'aspirational' can have its downsides too. Don't we really want our children to be happy? You can be an unhappy lawyer or a happy window cleaner. Its about letting our children make the best/right choice for them. And as you say, that means being informed of what the options are.

I think it's being rich/well off makes it much easier to take calculated risks with your career. You can take on unpaid internships, you can live rent free (thus not having to work) whilst studying, you don't have that pressure to be earning in order to support other family members, you can easily afford tutoring if you need it or additional study aids.

This is so true. A friend I made at (UK) university spent the summer holidays working as an unpaid intern at the World Trade Center in California. I was back in the North West working full time in a warehouse and waitressing/bar work at evenings and weekends. She's never had any debt, never gone hungry, never done without. She's a good person (and would often feed me when I knew I didn't have the money to feed myself) but she led (and continues to lead) a charmed life.

Low aspirations is definitely a thing.

However my own personal experience is that now primary school don't assist children with the 11 + it's kicked away the ladder for DC whose parents can't help them

But Sen is an absolutely massive issue.

Barely literate People having DC who inherit the dyslexia or whatever and school can't spot it, diagnosis , help because teachers have no Sen training.
Senco often no nothing about Sen.
It's a dead end.
School becomes a place of misunderstanding, boredom and crushing self esteem.

We must get basic Sen training into pgce.
Senco must get level 5 training in strategies to help the DC.

If a child exposed to phonics still can't read by end of year 1. You need to be flexible and change tack.

@idontwanna maybe you have a greater spirit of adventure than I do! Feeling like a confused homebody reading some of these tales of drive and determination...

Sorry I meant to add then we expect those disengaged, disenfranchised illiterate ex learners to suddenly somehow be able to support their children And know what to do!!

@swirlsy

I also think the idea of university has changed. It's definitely accessible to a lot more people & expected for many plus many jobs want a degree even if it's not required. Getting to university is not necessarily going to help you access excellent jobs.

One thing I think that is sometimes looked down on is trades. One of my neighbours was a plumber & very working class, he's just moved to a 2m plus property. One of my mum friends is married to someone with a family building firm, they are loaded.

Absolutely trade's are looked down. A plumber isn't a fancy title... so unfortunately nobody's interested even though it's a very handy trade and you can earn very well like you say.

[quote RosesAndHellebores]@Xenia of course we need nurses. Absolutely nothing to stop men from becoming nurses.[/quote]
pretty sure some Mnetters would love to stop men becoming nurses!

@Tigersonvaseline

Low aspirations is definitely a thing.

However my own personal experience is that now primary school don't assist children with the 11 + it's kicked away the ladder for DC whose parents can't help them

But Sen is an absolutely massive issue.

Barely literate People having DC who inherit the dyslexia or whatever and school can't spot it, diagnosis , help because teachers have no Sen training.
Senco often no nothing about Sen.
It's a dead end.
School becomes a place of misunderstanding, boredom and crushing self esteem.

We must get basic Sen training into pgce.
Senco must get level 5 training in strategies to help the DC.

If a child exposed to phonics still can't read by end of year 1. You need to be flexible and change tack.

Wow. I know nothing about SEN or teacher training. Do they seriously not cover it at all during their training?

My experiences that the tide is turned against university now and the last two years with the online friggin earning for six grand a year may well be the final nail in the coffin. I have overheard numerous people in our office say that their children will not be going to university unless it’s for dentistry medicine veterinary law and who could blame them ?

@Jedsnewstar

I was the first person in my family to go to university. A lot of family took issue to it. They thought that I thought I was above them somehow.

Yes this is my experience too and not being able to use my degree because I’m an unpaid carer it’s rubbed in my face it was a waste of time and money and they’re better than me somehow.

It is not low aspirations, just another ceiling to break through. Think businesses need to see the benefits of a fully diverse workforce including people from impoverished backgrounds for the social structure to change and people to see what can be apired to.

For me i grew up in a very poor area but everyone was poor and we knew no one who was rich. Of my class of 24 , i know from various sources that only 7 of us have a "career".

@swirlsy half of DP's family are in the trades, no degree, raking it in!

If you are good being in a trade and working for yourself is extremely lucrative .

I don't think your statement is correct, and if you do, it certainly doesn't have to be.

One thing that stops children from turning into successful adults is adults telling them that they have no/little expectations for them. It is not fair at all, especially when we all have access to education...which I think should be free btw.

It has nothing to do with successful parents btw. Nonchalantly saying 'well if they aren't surrounded by successful doctors, solicitors and accountants then they have nothing to aspire to' is patronising, absurd and bollocks.

My partner and I both come from very working class families. He didn't go to university, but did do an engineering apprenticeship which has enabled him to be a very successful earner. He is now his own boss. I went to university twice, and my job, which pays very well, has nothing to do with my time at university.

I'm still paying my student loans and tuition fees, and will be for the next 10 years, but I was able to accrue that debt because I had the opportunity. It wasn't because I was privileged. I'm extremely grateful that you don't have to be privileged to access education in the UK.

No, Sen is often an optional unit!!

Extra ordinary isn't it!!

Wc think the better jobs are for other people

@HundredMilesAnHour maybe he knew she didn't have the grades to be a vet or money to get through it
My niece wanted to be a vet but she was never going to be as academically she wasn't string enough just how it is , so we encouraged her to still do animal care but aim for a vetinary nurse or zookeeper etc , something doable
She just wasn't able to get grades to be a vet , impossible , you can't prouduce a's out of everyone

@BetterLox unless you have worked in many schools all over the country you shouldn't stereo type no , you should also understand why its harder for some than others , you as a school arrange parent helpers to read more with those children
And again it won't be all and I don't think tarring all with the same brush is a correct way to go about things and its a shame teachers look at it like this

@waterrat

For the teacher saying some parents engage less with reading. Do you understand there are structural reasons why this happens ? Working class parents may work shifts or do manual labour that leaves leaves very tired. They may be under severe stress from money worries or not have enough money to eat properly so they are tired. This nonsense about aspirations is just ignoring the brutal reality of how poverty causes stress that leads to less ability to move forward in life.

The teacher who posted just before you makes it clear she does know why parents aren’t engaging. But the bottom line is that that lack of engagement negatively affects their children, regardless of the reason for it.

I agree education,determination and hard work. My DS met his girlfriend at university. She came from a single parent family, benefits, she's the first one to go to uni in her family - I don't really know much about her family. She worked from when she was 12, straight A student all through school. Won a scholarship to attend No1 ranking uni, everything paid for. During her time at uni also won another scholarship so she could study abroad for a year - again at top uni, everything paid for. After graduating was accepted onto a v competitive graduate scheme. So proud of her, there's no doubting she's highly intelligent but she's also a very hard worker and determined.

@BrightYellowDaffodil she still stereotyped and it won't be all of the poor children whose parents are like this and if they don't engage she won't know fully why will she , she implied only poorer parents who don't bother i have family and friends who are teachers and they say its all sorts of parents , and there are parents who really try regardless of their background

@Redact but not everyone is naturally bright you can't produce straight a's out of everybody