Why do you benefit bash?

[greyblanket76]

My family and I are working class and always have been. My friends are too and so are the people that I tend to socialise with/meet in everyday life. I've only been on MN since last year but have seen so many comments bashing people who are on/depend on benefits and I'd really like to know why?

Is this because some people on here think everyone that's on benefits is lazy and doesn't want to work therefore claim benefits? Or is it something else?

I'll talk about my situation and will keep it as brief as possible as I already know people will come in the comments to try and shame me. I'm early 20s and a single mum (didn't start out that way but your whole life can literally change overnight and that's what happened to me). I have one DC and I'm expecting another so I've been on maternity leave back to back as I'll have 2 under 2.

I've worked full time since I was 17 right up until I went on my first maternity leave. Due to the rate of SMP, I'm entitled to benefits as SMP doesn't even cover my rent which is £1200. I'm entitled to £1670 of UC which covers my rent and all my bills. During the first 9 months of my maternity leave I was receiving around £1507 UC (due to deductions) + £638 SMP = £2145 a month.
Once I give birth to my second DC, my UC entitlement should go from £1670 to £1907. This isn't 100% accurate but due to receiving SMP, let's say the deductions would be due £1700 UC + £638 SMP = £2388 a month. That would be excluding child benefit for both children btw.

When I was working full time, I was earning £1383 a month. I do plan to go back to work after my maternity leave ends as I genuinely love my work and have my whole career in front of me. However can people see the huge jump in difference between the two amounts? Nearly a grand in total! When returning back to work, I would be entitled to some benefits however because I'd be working full time, it wouldn't be a lot. That's why it's advised that you drop hours to work part time in order to get the most help available.

I've read my post back and hope it isn't too confusing but I just wanted some people who benefit bash to understand that sometimes life on benefits seems better especially as you have kids because you get so much more help. My mum keeps telling me to consider not working for a year or two just because I need to consider the quality of life my DC and I will have. I wouldn't be able to pay for rent AND childcare so what would I do? There's a lot that comes into play when deciding if you should go back to work or just be on benefits and I hope some people got that from this post. Seeing as this is an anonymous forum, if you judge/bash people on benefits, I'd really be interested to hear why. Posting in AIBU because I'm prepared to be flamed and have learnt not to take nasty comments to heart

Because taking benefits when you have the ability to work, but choose not to because you would be paid less, rubs people up the wrong way. if we all chose to do that, the country would be up the creek. It shows the disparity is cost of living Vs wages and I think that's what upsets me who work.

Some of that 'bashing' is discussion. It often gets drowned oiut by louder, more angry voices, but some really is asking for a logical debate on the viability, appropriateness and sustainability of any and all benefits.

• Some seem to be increasingly useless, impossible to access properly.
• Others seem to be misplaced, making moving off them harder than it should be - the new version of the old Benefits Gap, which was bloody murderous for some.
• Some seem to be nannying, implicated in a minority of people being able to choose to claim and remain unwaged

None of the system really works. But we can't discuss it because of the emotions involved. Some ask questions that look to others like accusations; some give reasons that to tohers look like excuses. And instead of discussing the wider picture threads like this gte bogged down in the minutia and personal to'ing and fro'ing.

And then, much like successive governments, nothing gets understood or changed.

It's not the claimant's issue, it's an economical government one. Those who need help should receive it.

I think the system is ridiculous- as you have said you get £1000 more a month by not working us obviously bonkers.

And as for bashing you … I didn’t have children until I was married, had a house and savings. There seem to be so many younger people who jump into having kids then expect the state to pay got it. The fact you use the phrase “I’m entitled to…” I grew up in a working class family and we didn’t go without but it was very tight. My parents would have never applied for benefits as they thought they were for those in a worse situation. Some young people literally expect handouts as soon as they hit 18

@HTH1

Ok, let’s take a (fictional) example of two sisters, A and B.

A has a baby and works long hours in a low paying job when she would love nothing more than to be a SAHM. Chucking it in and going on benefits is not an option as A has a huge mortgage on her starter property and has to live really frugally. A would love to have another DC but could never afford it, with the childcare costs on top of the mortgage.

B has a baby and works 0 hours, instead enjoying her time with her DC. Each time she has another baby, she gets more money (unlike A who gets less) and eligible for a larger free council property. B can afford lots of luxuries which A cannot stretch to.

C has a baby and is a high earner who is also not eligible for benefits and does not enjoy her job but sticks it out for the money. C would like to spend her money on her own family and not on B having luxuries which are not available to C, at C’s expense.

Long term A and C will be better off than B though, as they will have a pension and own a home.

Most of the people who benefit bash on here are the same people who don't work whilst living with a DH who brings in a six figure salary.

Yet fail to see the irony.

The benefits system is mad. Nobody should be paid more than minimum wage on benefits. IMHO. I thought payments were now capped at £1500 a month

To put it bluntly it’s probably because it annoys people to see someone getting more money than they do for doing nothing. Surely you can understand that?

You take home more than I do and I have a senior position in the NHS (band 7), a masters degree and have worked for the past 17 years. I can’t afford to have kids yet because we can’t afford to pay for childcare, yet other people who don’t work and have decided to have kids (that they can’t afford to look after) take home more than I do as a working professional. The system is flawed and causes resentment.

I suspect this will get zapped, but honestly?
Jealousy.
I decided to wait until I could afford a family, I'm likely to old now. I'm a low earner, but I'm entitled to nothing as I still earn too much.
Maybe I should have just had the family I wanted and let the taxpayer prop me up.

[quote Mumoblue]@HTH1

If you think people on benefits have “lots of luxuries”, you’re out of touch. Also there is a two kid benefit cap.[/quote]
Pretty sure there is a maximum savings limit when you start to lose benefits, which is why there is a ‘use it or lose it’ mentality and you see people on benefits with posh cars, huge flat screen TVs etc.

Like many others, I have a lot of sympathy for the (genuinely) disabled or those who, for example, work long hours but are so underpaid that they need top up benefits. I also would not begrudge someone who did everything right (had DC with their DH when they could actually afford them then they and DH lost their jobs for reasons beyond their control) but am not happy to pay for the feckless.

I don’t know why people benefit bash but they do

We are judged very harshly by family and friends so much so our circle is so small now it’s upsetting. To see people you thought were kind come out with such nasty stuff just because we are on benefits is horrible

We want to work - we can’t. Benefits are our safety net because our situation is so hard. We are both carers for disabled dc

“Long term A and C will be better off than B though, as they will have a pension and own a home.”

Well A will probably just buy her council house for peanuts at some point and make a huge amount of money off of that.

I don't bash generally but there are some situations where you just think people make such poor choices like having another child when they clearly can't afford it or starting a family really young. And situations like a member of my own family who decided she wanted another baby with the same dad as her first whom she had been split from for years so got back together just to have another. Dad has never paid anything towards either child. And the many who are on benefits and have a partner who lives with his mum round the corner, pay nothing and the woman claims as single despite them being together. It's just the worst type of fraud really. Then there's my ex collegue who as a single man in his forties with no commitments chooses to work 3 days a week, was offered more hours but wont take it as it will affect his working tax credits ! How he gets away with doing so few hours whilst claiming benefits I don't know. If he was on UC he'd be having to look for full time work I imagine.
However for many, life on benefits is hard and there are huge obstacles to people getting off benefits like childcare, shift work, zero hours contracts and needing to be available at all hours a t short notice and massive rents that are out of control and very poor availablity of affordable housing. Why on earth the tax payer is paying £1000+ a month for families in private rents which line rich landlords pockets is one of the biggest outrages of current times and something we should all be protesting against. It is not the fault of the claimants who need somewhere to live.

@Elsiebear90

“Long term A and C will be better off than B though, as they will have a pension and own a home.”

Well A will probably just buy her council house for peanuts at some point and make a huge amount of money off of that.

You can't buy a council house if you aren't working.

@HTH1

I’m on benefits myself and it is barely covering costs. I’m certainly not accruing a bunch of savings. Granted, I live in a place where to cost of living is high, but with the amount of people living in poverty being what it is- I simply don’t think this is a big thing among people on benefits.

Also it’s bloody annoying when everyone acts like they’re entitled to your life story to determine if you’re worthy of your benefits or if you should just bloody starve.

@Elsiebear90

To put it bluntly it’s probably because it annoys people to see someone getting more money than they do for doing nothing. Surely you can understand that?

You take home more than I do and I have a senior position in the NHS (band 7), a masters degree and have worked for the past 17 years. I can’t afford to have kids yet because we can’t afford to pay for childcare, yet other people who don’t work and have decided to have kids (that they can’t afford to look after) take home more than I do as a working professional. The system is flawed and causes resentment.

This is exactly the point I was making. Why should @Elsiebear90, who has contributed so much to society over so long, not be able to afford to have DC while others are given handouts from her wages to allow them to have multiple DC?

“You can't buy a council house if you aren't working.“

They’ll just get a job when they want to buy it, trust me I’ve seen this a million times before, even with my own family.

You don’t get handouts to have multiple dc ! There’s a 2 child limit on benefits

I think many people have put it better than me as I haven't really worded my point well. But that's exactly it. It's just a rough figure and I'm sure I can apply for working tax credit when I go back to work but how can I get more money being on benefits than working full time? That doesn't make any sense and all it'll do is convince people to stay on benefits longer or drop their hours down to the bare minimum which prevents them progressing in their career. I shouldn't have to choose between 'should I just stay home on benefits or should I try and make it work working full time.'

With that being said, if someone chooses to stay on benefits because they won't even be able to pay their rent and bills let alone afford to buy food for themselves and DC if they worked full time, why benefit shame? It isn't their fault that's how the system works. That's what I was trying to get at so thanks for the comments that were basically saying the same thing

Why won't people direct their anger to the government instead of the people who have found themselves (such as me) in these positions?

1. I don't benefits bash - but people who defraud the benefits system I have no tolerance of.
2. I also recognise there is a cohort of people who have put themselves into situations quite deliberately or fecklessly where benefits are their only option to meet basic needs.

Benefits are meant for those who find themselves in temporary or permanent difficulties and unable to work. I know how impossible their lives would be without the benefits they are completely entitled to. Its people in 1) and 2) that make it harder for genuine claimants to get their much needed support.

@Elsiebear90

“You can't buy a council house if you aren't working.“

They’ll just get a job when they want to buy it, trust me I’ve seen this a million times before, even with my own family.

So now you're moaning about them getting a job?

I've never benefit bashed. But f***ck me those figures are a real kick in the teeth.

Especially as someone that's currently struggling by on SMP of around £600 a month and had to save and save and save to be able to afford to have a baby. Then will have to return to work when they are 6months because my savings will run out.

Suppose the difference is I'm paying a mortgage which is an asset, rather than rent. But then again you might get a council house that you can right to buy... with your rent (as paid by UC) deducted off the sale price.

I actually want to cry.

It seems like a lot of people here are actually mad at the cost of living crisis/low wages and are just misdirecting that at people on benefits, which I imagine has all the tax dodging millionaires and exploitative bosses laughing all the way to the bank. 🙄