Why do you benefit bash?

[greyblanket76]

My family and I are working class and always have been. My friends are too and so are the people that I tend to socialise with/meet in everyday life. I've only been on MN since last year but have seen so many comments bashing people who are on/depend on benefits and I'd really like to know why?

Is this because some people on here think everyone that's on benefits is lazy and doesn't want to work therefore claim benefits? Or is it something else?

I'll talk about my situation and will keep it as brief as possible as I already know people will come in the comments to try and shame me. I'm early 20s and a single mum (didn't start out that way but your whole life can literally change overnight and that's what happened to me). I have one DC and I'm expecting another so I've been on maternity leave back to back as I'll have 2 under 2.

I've worked full time since I was 17 right up until I went on my first maternity leave. Due to the rate of SMP, I'm entitled to benefits as SMP doesn't even cover my rent which is £1200. I'm entitled to £1670 of UC which covers my rent and all my bills. During the first 9 months of my maternity leave I was receiving around £1507 UC (due to deductions) + £638 SMP = £2145 a month.
Once I give birth to my second DC, my UC entitlement should go from £1670 to £1907. This isn't 100% accurate but due to receiving SMP, let's say the deductions would be due £1700 UC + £638 SMP = £2388 a month. That would be excluding child benefit for both children btw.

When I was working full time, I was earning £1383 a month. I do plan to go back to work after my maternity leave ends as I genuinely love my work and have my whole career in front of me. However can people see the huge jump in difference between the two amounts? Nearly a grand in total! When returning back to work, I would be entitled to some benefits however because I'd be working full time, it wouldn't be a lot. That's why it's advised that you drop hours to work part time in order to get the most help available.

I've read my post back and hope it isn't too confusing but I just wanted some people who benefit bash to understand that sometimes life on benefits seems better especially as you have kids because you get so much more help. My mum keeps telling me to consider not working for a year or two just because I need to consider the quality of life my DC and I will have. I wouldn't be able to pay for rent AND childcare so what would I do? There's a lot that comes into play when deciding if you should go back to work or just be on benefits and I hope some people got that from this post. Seeing as this is an anonymous forum, if you judge/bash people on benefits, I'd really be interested to hear why. Posting in AIBU because I'm prepared to be flamed and have learnt not to take nasty comments to heart

I don't. I understand that I put myself in a vulnerable position when I gave up work. I could need the fallback of benefits at some point if my circumstances change, to give me some breathing space to get on my feet..
Ditto me and DH. We do ok, but we're probably six months away from needing benefits should our health change or something.

Oh and the absolute top a disabled person can claim is £1402 per month. That includes full PiP.
Water bill
Council tax
Utilities
WiFi package
Phone package

Extra clothes
Pre prepared food
Smaller milk cartons

Can you see how it goes?

@Thebestwaytoscareatory

Benefit bashers fall into one of two categories:

1. They are part of the wealthy elite who are deliberately trying to distract the masses from the actual issue i.e., the obscene level of personal wealth a select few hoard and hide for themselves.

2. They are part of the masses who are gullible enough to swallow their masters lies and focus their anger where their told like good little puppets.

Yep.

I think there'll end up being a licensing system to be able to have children. Both the father and the mother will need to sign a legally binding agreement to fulfil certain criteria and will have to guarantee to support the child upto the age of 21. There'll be no absent fathers dodging paying child maintenance because it will be deducted from them at source, they won't have a choice in the matter.

@Sowhatifiam

And if your husband was to walk out on you . Refuse to pay towards the children what then? Would you lose your home? Would you have to cut work hours?

@lalafam believes she made better choices than this. Her husband would never leave her. And if he did, he would always ensure he supported her and the children properly because she made good choices and that sort of thing only happens to people who make bad choices.

The numbers who have had to take shite like that back…..

Well I own my own home, have enough savings and a high earning job that works around the kids so yea I would be dandy! If DH wanted to pay towards them (which he would because he is a devoted father) then that would be a bonus !

I couldn't really give a shit if people are on benefits. I know nothing about the system and I am not interested. I assume if they are on benefits, they need to be.

[quote Waddlegoose]@Hospedia just wanted to ask as I’m interested. How does the Op get the amount in benefits if the cap is £20k and £24k.

Is the cap a net amount? And how does the OP seem be higher than this?[/quote]
There's a 9 month grace period before the cap applies if you've recently been working a certain number of hours/earned a certain amount.

I suspect the OP might be in that grace period.

Well I own my own home, have enough savings and a high earning job that works around the kids so yea I would be dandy! If DH wanted to pay towards them (which he would because he is a devoted father) then that would be a bonus !

Thats not just choices, thats a huge amount of luck.

which you'll deny naturally..

@MaryAndHerNet

Well I own my own home, have enough savings and a high earning job that works around the kids so yea I would be dandy! If DH wanted to pay towards them (which he would because he is a devoted father) then that would be a bonus !

Thats not just choices, thats a huge amount of luck.

which you'll deny naturally..

Haha "luck" ok then. More like hard work and good planning. No hand outs. We reap what we sow

@sugarplumfairy65 I would love to know what you think someone with a PhD should be earning? I'm on similar to the poster with a PhD, why do we need to ask ourselves why we aren't on more? For example most university lecturers float around 40-50k (they start off on 35k). Should someone "only" taking home £2700 (after deductions) feel like they are low earners?

@Elsiebear90

To put it bluntly it’s probably because it annoys people to see someone getting more money than they do for doing nothing. Surely you can understand that?

You take home more than I do and I have a senior position in the NHS (band 7), a masters degree and have worked for the past 17 years. I can’t afford to have kids yet because we can’t afford to pay for childcare, yet other people who don’t work and have decided to have kids (that they can’t afford to look after) take home more than I do as a working professional. The system is flawed and causes resentment.

Exactly this. It's also the attitude of people like the OP. She states that she is "entitled to" live off benefits. It's that sense of entitlement that winds people up.

@lalafam and I'm Paris Hilton. No luck here though, I worked harder than people on benefits to be this famous.

grey, I 'get' your situation. Nobody should make judgements because we don't know what is round the corner. I'm glad the benefits system exists and don't grudge anyone who is able to receive some - but I know that in recent times there has been much hardship because of cuts.

We really should mind our own business when it comes to other people's finances, be thankful if we have enough, and if we can help someone, quietly, that's good.

Seen a lot on MN but this thread the amount of nasty comments and the posters that have no clue of the benefits system is shocking. Don’t know how some people sleep at night with their judgemental, not got a clue attitudes!

@Florenz

I think there'll end up being a licensing system to be able to have children. Both the father and the mother will need to sign a legally binding agreement to fulfil certain criteria and will have to guarantee to support the child upto the age of 21. There'll be no absent fathers dodging paying child maintenance because it will be deducted from them at source, they won't have a choice in the matter.

Ha that will never happen

@giggly

So just to make sure I understand your situation. Early 20’s two children-under 2 which is not what you expected and you receive benefits that equates to an annual working salary after tax, NI and pension contributions of approx £41000. My understanding of benefits is for people who are between jobs so they don’t starve/ homeless or for those who are physically or mentally unable to work at all/ full time. Having children does not exclude a person from working and I understand that UC and tax credits assist those on lower salaries to pay for childcare. My exdh was entitled to benefits due to a permanent disability which affected his ability to work full time and thus affected his earning potential but work he did. The issue that i have is parents not working because like you are better off on benefits. I work full time and have done with two dc from when they were one year old each and apart from CB have supported my family by living in an area that is cheaper for housing. There was someone on here the other week who was just exhausted working and raising a child and managing their debt and got all offended when their question of just giving up work was argued and classed as benefit bashing. I’d gladly give up work if I thought I could gain in benefits what it has taken two degrees and years of not seeing my children in exchange for my monthly salary gained over the last 30 years with another 13 to go before can retire. My issues with your situation is that benefits are giving you what I have had to and continue to work my arse off to get. Does that answer your question.

@giggly yep. You're annoyed that someone gets something similar to what you get however they haven't had to work for their degrees or struggle with a husbands who has a condition. However do you ever think that you don't know what that person's been through to get to that situation? I take it you don't really care. If you've struggled to get there then everyone else can/should. I've also said I'll be going back to work after maternity leave thanks

I haven't read the full thread so not sure if this has been said, but for me...

The benefits system is there for people in need, the vulnerable in society who need the help. 100% I totally support those who need it, it's a marvellous system for so many in need.

What I don't agree with is when it's a choice! When people "weigh up" what's going to get them more money and then just choose not to work. That's different, but I don't judge... if you want to set that example for your children then so be it 🤷🏼‍♀️

I don't bash anyone who is entitled to AND genuinely needs the money.

There are those who claim what they are not due,make numerous fake claims using stolen identities.

You have ,with your partner(s),put yourself in a position where you have to rely on benefits,you're not the first,or the last,but if you're happy with it why are you worried about what strangers think?

It must be clear that those who work endlessly hard and provide for their families,can be upset to see others who have no work ethic,handed more money for no work.
There are so many rights and wrongs connected to benefits,but no way should anyone in genuine need to slighted in any form for needing,and being given,enough help.

@Thebestwaytoscareatory

Benefit bashers fall into one of two categories:

1. They are part of the wealthy elite who are deliberately trying to distract the masses from the actual issue i.e., the obscene level of personal wealth a select few hoard and hide for themselves.

2. They are part of the masses who are gullible enough to swallow their masters lies and focus their anger where their told like good little puppets.

I'm neither rich and elite or a nodding dog.

Just very experienced within the benefits sector. I've seen cases which almost broke me emotionally I've also dealt with cases (a large number) that make my blood boil.

Media fans the flames with the system, but like everything it has 2 sides. Unless you work in the sector then you can only judge by what's reported.

I don't think anyone would deny vulnerable, medically unfit or genuine people in need benefits. The issue is those (and there are MANY) who use and abuse the system, make it a lifestyle.

It's not black & white which many on Mumsnet seem to think it is judging by the replies on here.

@D0lphine

Sometimes it seems like you do everything right in your life. Work hard. Go to uni get a job. Wait to have a family until you can afford it. And it's so so hard. Mortgage payments insane, £££ going on childcare, debt from uni, limiting your family, not seeing your kids because of work.

Then you look at someone on benefits doing nothing and being given a council house and money so they can spend all their time with their kids.

I'm jealous!

@D0lphine I don't have a council house and I'd much rather have a mortgage. At least you're honest about the jealousy part. I think most people are jealous/envious because they've worked hard and look at it as other people receiving 'handouts.' It's very interesting

Thing is, we have lived through 20+ years of government policies designed to transfer money from the poor to the rich, and it ramped up unbelievably during the pandemic. How many billions of pounds went to government cronies for useless or even non-existent PPE, for example?
The billionaire class know very well that as long as they can keep stirring up the fuckwits to blame the desperately poor for their own struggles, they won't have to pay living wages - or any wages at all, because the Tories are going to be reintroducing workfare pretty soon. And, for the hard of thinking on this thread, what workfare generally means is private companies not having to pay wages because the Government pays desperate people an absolute pittance to do the jobs instead. Last time they tried this one, there were cases of people being sacked by their employers, then taken back on as unemployed people being 'helped to learn how to work'.
There were also people with qualifications and skills being threatened with sanctions if they didn't attend 'job training' which consisted of being patronised by some little shit with less education than these job applicants themselves had...

Haha "luck" ok then. More like hard work and good planning. No hand outs. We reap what we sow

nope.

Luck.

Or put it this way.

If your CV was behind another, your high paying job would be someone elses right now, lucky yours got picked.
or maybe you had supportive psrents? lucky you.
or you met a decent man that wasnt just pretending to be decent until you married, thats lucky that is.
or perhaps your children were born healthy physically and mentally, lucky that is.
or that house, your offer got accepted, thats a bit of luck....

Actually having children under 3 does excuse you from working according to the UC guidelines.

Just another fact seeing as people want to throw around insults without knowing the facts. I will be going to work but even if I didn't, I have until my youngest being 3 to work a minimum of 16hrs

A lot of people saying that OP hasn't had to work for what she has, like they do, but the amount OP gets right now is LITERALLY because she has worked. She doesn't have the benefit cap because she has worked and her UC is increased by SMP BECAUSE she has worked, and is going back to work afterwards. She wouldn't be getting the same amount as those in work if she had never worked, or didn't have a job pre pregnancy.
Also, unless you have a disability, people on UC and jobseekers can't stay on it as a lifestyle. People say they're annoyed when women cut their hours to 16 a week but you can only do this until your youngest is five. So it's not a long term lifestyle choice and unless someone is really good at faking disability, you can't stay on the full amount without working full time, for life.

Haha "luck" ok then. More like hard work and good planning. No hand outs. We reap what we sow
How do you think this makes people like me feel?
I had a good career. Im too I’ll to work. I cannot afford to put my heating on and here you are judging me. How dare you, I strongly suspect that for the forty odd years I was working I contributed more to society than you did, not just financially either.