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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

DS Last one picked in PE

483 replies

GoldenLightNights · 09/02/2022 22:32

AIBU to contact the teacher with regards to this:

DS is 9, he’s a wonderful child, great at all things science and maths related but not so much at sports. He plays football outside of school for one of the lower ability teams and sort of enjoys it, he isn’t forced to play or anything like that.

Anyway today at school he had PE, we’ve never had any issues before but today for some reason the teacher let two boys pick teams and my son was the last to be picked. He is quite upset especially as one of the boys doing the picking is a close friend.
Anyway I find the idea of letting other children pick teams horrendous and if not my son some child will be picked last. I actually thought this method of choosing teams was done away with years ago!
I want to contact the teacher to ask if he would consider adopting a new approach to team selection. My husband says I’m jumping the gun and to wait to see if it happens again…… so what do you think?
He was properly upset this evening 😢

OP posts:
WiddlinDiddlin · 10/02/2022 16:48

Move the scenario into the workplace.

Your work requires two teams to work on a project, someone is selected to head each time and is stands in the office and has to pick out of the people there.

The last two are met with groans and moans and mutters and evils, neither team captain wants them, they're not popular or not particularly brilliant at this thing...

Thats a matter for HR and a case of bullying in the workplace, not 'you need to learn to be resilient'..

It also wouldn't happen, asides from the above, you would not BE in a workplace together with a bunch of other people, if your skills at the thing you all have to do, were so significantly worse than the others that no one wanted you on their team!

None of the people saying it prepares you for life or its necessary in teh adult world has given a comparable example of something that truly happens in the adult world... because it doesn't bloody happen, because it shouldn't happen, because it doesn't help anyone and does cause harm.

Oh and I can tell you what happens when the kids who moan and mutter get caught by the teacher... I got a slapping from the kid who got a detention after the teacher heard her say 'oh no not that fat fucker*' to me as I plodded over to their team.. but quietly, after school where no one saw.

Great. Well dealt with.

(*and in all honesty the detention she got was for swearing, not for the bullying!)

LazySaturday · 10/02/2022 16:53

@Petsop

Think you are helicoptering here. When you are academically bright as it sounds like your son is, he gets to be great in the classroom several times a week. Top set. Great grades. Better life prospects. Other kids in his class will spend all their time in the classroom not being the bright ones - and don’t they know it. Streamed into the bottom set, never getting more than a C even with their biggest effort. Being made fun of for being the ‘thick ones.’

On the sports pitch, sometimes this is those kids time to shine. And your sons turn to feel what it’s like to not be the best and how to treat others. Needs to work both ways.

From someone who was shit academically but a natural sportswoman :)

The thing is, this argument doesn't really work with picking teams. My ds is similar to yours op and I loathe picking teams. I would have absolutely no issue with the teachers streaming the kids, putting the sporty ones into a fast paced, competitive team and the less sporty kids into an activity where they build fitness and practice basic skills.

Your example would only work if in Maths children were regularly allowed to pick teams to work on activities or quizzes together.
But they're not, instead, the less academic kids are given different activities to do and support to improve their skills.

Honestly op, I wouldn't go in all guns blazing but I might try to have a friendly chat and see if they can organise things a bit differently.

IamMala · 10/02/2022 16:53

This happened to me throughout my school years, and I still remember that awful feeling after more than fifty years. I never told my parents but I wish I had. I feel today that I really missed out on the fun of sport - which I only found out about when I had children.

Kanaloa · 10/02/2022 17:09

[quote worriedatthemoment]@Kanaloa but it does happen you think clever kids don't laugh at those who fail tests , or comment on them and laugh ? Of course they do my dc have had it happen,
We should be teaching kids to be kind and nice regardless but don't make out it only happens in sports and only the sporty kids behave like this [/quote]
@worriedatthemoment

So what I actually said (the teacher lining all pupils up and encouraging the brightest and most academic ones to choose best to worst the least academic ones) doesn’t happen.

Kids might laugh/be mean (which they also do to those kids who aren’t athletic) but to my knowledge of working in schools and putting my four kids through school there is no classroom equivelant of two children pointing out their peers best to worst while the teacher stands by nodding.

Kanaloa · 10/02/2022 17:11

And I say that as someone with three super sporty children who would always be picked first in team sports. Those three also doing well in the classroom.

My other son is autistic, academically struggling, and very poor hand eye co-ordination.

So I don’t know why people insist on acting like it’s some fair split where the ‘sporty’ kids are picked first for gym and the less sport ones get to ostracise their peers in maths class, because firstly it just doesn’t happen in maths, and secondly there’s no guarantee that because you’re rubbish at sports you’ll be great at English.

cansu · 10/02/2022 17:15

If it happened very week I would agree with you. It is one occasion. Yes you are overreacting.

worriedatthemoment · 10/02/2022 17:22

@Kanaloa maybe the teacher shouldn't ' be allowing laughing at and also its always the worst picked last depending on how its done , if different kids pick then different kids will be last as many also base it on friendship groups as well
So it can work if its done properly

mogsrus · 10/02/2022 17:32

Someone has to be picked last don’t they so it was your boy,& you honestly think it’s worth getting uptight about it, explain life doesn’t go his way all the time

Kanaloa · 10/02/2022 17:36

[quote worriedatthemoment]@Kanaloa maybe the teacher shouldn't ' be allowing laughing at and also its always the worst picked last depending on how its done , if different kids pick then different kids will be last as many also base it on friendship groups as well
So it can work if its done properly [/quote]
So how should it be done? Children should be alternated so they can always pick their friends?

And then what about the child who has no friends?

You’re twisting yourself in knots to try and make it ‘work’ when there’s a much easier way to make it work. Teacher says ‘abc you’re in that team, xyz you’re in the other.’

JohnMcCainsDeathStare · 10/02/2022 17:49

Children pick their friends but in their own time - the classroom or PE is not the place for a popularity contest.
Also there needs to be space for the concept of PE without any competative element against other children that isn't optional. Considering any cohort of adolescents its a bit like getting pugs to compete against alsatians or Old English sheepdogs againts greyhounds - a pretty daft way to introduce competition.

worriedatthemoment · 10/02/2022 17:56

@Kanaloa im not twisting myself in knots I am answering the OP question , this has happened once she wants to go straight in , her DH thinks they should wait and see what happens or if it happens again
Which i agree with
There are ways to do it better but you don't have a problem when in english they say pick a partner or science pick a group do you ? Same things happen then

Mojoj · 10/02/2022 17:58

You know what? Some kids are good at sport and get to shine. Your kid is bright and will have his moment to shine. That's life. We can't be good at everything. Maybe the teacher lets all the kids take a turn at choosing the team? Kids need to learn that they're not good at everything and that's okay.

SweetJasmine17 · 10/02/2022 18:01

@Mojoj

You know what? Some kids are good at sport and get to shine. Your kid is bright and will have his moment to shine. That's life. We can't be good at everything. Maybe the teacher lets all the kids take a turn at choosing the team? Kids need to learn that they're not good at everything and that's okay.

Let's ignore bullying and gossip too. Life , everyone!

ChocolateMassacre · 10/02/2022 18:02

It's not about kids having a 'moment to shine'. It's about them not being humiliated and put off PE.

If PE actually puts less sporty kids off sport and exercise, there is zero point in them doing it.

JohnMcCainsDeathStare · 10/02/2022 18:05

And here is another example that some people who are in charge of PE have passports to Topsy-Turvy Delusoworld.
I had 0 hours of swimming all of secondary school but that wasn't the same for all. Guess who DID get to do swimming - those who were already doing interschool competitions. That's right, let those who are good swimmers have swimming lessons...

Kanaloa · 10/02/2022 18:06

[quote worriedatthemoment]@Kanaloa im not twisting myself in knots I am answering the OP question , this has happened once she wants to go straight in , her DH thinks they should wait and see what happens or if it happens again
Which i agree with
There are ways to do it better but you don't have a problem when in english they say pick a partner or science pick a group do you ? Same things happen then [/quote]
Clearly we have really different school experiences, because I’ve never seen an English teacher pick out the two cleverest students and have them choose from their peers one by one until one child is left.

Just never seen it happen in any other class. ‘Work with a partner’ isn’t the same situation.

worriedatthemoment · 10/02/2022 18:13

@Kanaloa you have no idea that the pe teacher picked the two most sporty kids at all ? None whatsoever you have just assumed that
Being left out is being left out regardless of subject. If everyone is told to pick pairs and your the last one standing its the same thing its not exclusive to pe

worriedatthemoment · 10/02/2022 18:16

At no point as the OP said the other kids bullied or the teacher stood around laughing in this situation or that it was the two best kids at sport picked to select the team
So many are saying bullying , etc always the same kid last when this has happened once at this school for the OP child it may never happen again ,

worriedatthemoment · 10/02/2022 18:17

@Kanaloa so the kid left without a partner feels ok do they ? How is it not the same , feelings have been hurt and the rest of the class clearly sees who is left alone , its totally the same

Goldilocks99 · 10/02/2022 18:20

I'd bring it up in a calm meeting op. This is not best practice, certainly hasn't been taught on teaching courses for at least fifteen years.

Teacher has a number of ways to choose groups:
Everyone pair up with a friend. Teacher then puts 'pairs' accordingly in teams.

Find someone who game. Eg has the same colour eyes, likes the same music as you. See above.

Stand in line order. Numbers 1 or 2.

Physical he's that end up with children on two sides. Teacher calls teams when an evenish split.

Planned beforehand on skills and put on lesson plan.

There's no need for team choosing and it's actually a very time inefficient way to choose teams.

Topseyt · 10/02/2022 18:23

To those saying that it teaches resilience and prepares kids for life, no it doesn't.

Can people really not see that it could be extremely damaging telling children that the feelings of rejection and humiliation caused by this so-called "teaching method" are preparing them for life? Telling them to prepare to be rejected and humiliated because "that's just life!" Wondering why it just might have a negative effect on their mental health?

It is bollocks. As a teaching method it shouldn't just be outdated, it should be banned.

rarge · 10/02/2022 18:23

Why do some people want children to feel bad, I just don't understand it. This is the hill you're choosing? Why not make kid's lives better, rather than teaching them to be tough by putting them in awkward or humiliating situations

Freebus · 10/02/2022 18:23

The aim of pe teaching should be to encourage ppl to be more active. There are a lot of government initiatives in that line, trying to encourage ppl to take up sport whatever their age, ability etc. Its completely counterproductive if schools aren't on board with that.

Kanaloa · 10/02/2022 18:24

[quote worriedatthemoment]@Kanaloa so the kid left without a partner feels ok do they ? How is it not the same , feelings have been hurt and the rest of the class clearly sees who is left alone , its totally the same [/quote]
You’re clearly desperate to insist this is fine and not upsetting at all, so I don’t really see the point of arguing with you.

Partnering up is different because it doesn’t involve every child being chosen one by one until one is left unwanted. Usually in my classroom experience the teacher will quickly say ‘okay and you three group up together.’

My comment about the ‘sportiest children’ was a response to people insisting that oh it’s ok because the other kids who don’t shine in gym will shine in academics (both irrelevant and not guaranteed.)

There’s no reason to do something hurtful when you can easily do teams without doing this.

topcat2014 · 10/02/2022 18:24

I was picked last. At my boys school the teacher would say I should be at the girls school etc.

No life long effects but glad this practice has generally fallen out of favour