Help for Mr Confused

[oly]

First up I'd better say I'm a Dad and I don't know if I'm allowed to read let alone write here - if an ominous silence follows I'll get the message.
I would like some advice about the cost of running a family and household expenses. I am a professional earning a large salary and putting in long hours. My wife also works very hard running the house and family (4 children 11-18). She tells me she can not survive on £1200 per month - that is for food and non-essentials as all bills including car expenses and petrol are covered. In addition she has run up £8000 debt on credit cards over 2 years that I have just found out about. There have been some words exchanged and I am accussed of being "mean" and "tight". I am at a loss to see how so much has been spent, she does not go away on trips with girlfriends or buy an excess of expensive designer clothes. However she is not good (in my view) at keeping track of finances or being generally financially realistic. Apparently "all her friends" spend well over £200 per week on food, the remaining £400 going on childrens pocket allowance/pocket money, school essentials and clothing. I often buy bits of shopping and usually provide extra for birthdays, parties, christmas, school trips etc. We have a cleaner once a week (cost covered) and she has time to visit friends for coffee and also helps at the children's school.
Can anyone see where and how the money could have gone. AIBU in asking her to economise.

If you as a family cannot afford £1200 on misc expenses then you are not being unreasonable.

Does your wife appreciate where the household income goes ? Maybe if you showed her a spreadsheet of incomings and outgoings she would be able to see that there simply isn't any more available to top up the £1200 pm

think you need to chat but it sounds like a lot to me tho when i was married to someone wirh a healthy income we had a joint account and just got on with it so didnt have an allowance as such which i would have found irritating and demeaning we just shared the money but that may be old fashioned now i dunno

£1200 seems a lot to survive on each month IMO if its only for food, non essentials!! Can't you ask her how much weekly shop is? What else she spends the money on? Maybe she would just like to feel like she has some money of her own?

Hi oly
I don't think you are being unreasonable.
I have approx £1500 although tis does vary a bit from month to month, sometimes £1200 sometimes £1600 - never more than that, but usually £1500,plus child benefit and child tax credits for 5 children aged from 11 down to 9 months. This has to cover all household expenses and running and paying for a very large car. We also have a lot of animals. The only thing my dh does is keep some money aside for hid tax bill before giving me the rest - he is self - employed.
I don't have a cleaner, although I would love one!

Seems a huge amount for what she is using it for, think you need to have serious chat, receipts etc.

First of all welcome

I haven't got 4 children and no teenagers so hard to judge really. I guess part of it depends on where she shops if she is doing the weekly shopping in marks and spencers then £200 probably isn't alot of money to get everything but in my world I think £200 is more than enough even with 4 teenagers eating you out of house and home. Do your children bring their friends home to eat lot? Do you have guests over? Is everything or most of what she buys average price or is everything the most expensive she can get?

I agree that you need to discuss this with her and not us.

FWIW, I have 3 children and a husband with a large salary and ime it is easy to spend £700 - £800 per month on food. We went through a phase of spending £1200 a month just on food/groceries/petrol

If she wants more money and all the children are at school I don't see why she cannot have a part time job tbh.

200 a week on food sounds more than enough. I have 3 kids and we spend about 100 plus a week I would say.

400 per month on just well...things. Hummm. Hard. I can get through that, but I pay for petrol,and some childminding costs. Maybe ask if she can think about where its going?

I have a very rocky history with money and we don't have a good relationship btwn myself and my dh talking about money. I am to blame a lot and have also racked up credit card debt. My advice to you is don't go in all guns tho you may feel like it. I am much more responsive to the 'look, its happened, lets see how to fix it, etc.

I have come to realise I spend when I'm bored. Is she a bit bored? Does she work etc?

Ply, if there is nothing to show for the £8000 credit card spend and no real explanation as to where the money goes or why more is needed could your wife have a problem you are not aware of such as gambling?

and er what does she do all day..maybe she has too much time on her hands and has a lot of treats

If she is going for coffee with friends she could easily spend £50 a month on that alone.

Coffee and snack = about £5 if she does that a couple of times a week it all add's up.

You need to work out exactly how much a normal months worth of food shopping costs and count up all the small incidentals because I've found that's where most of my money goes.

We have a separate account (both have a debit card for it) that we transfer money to for shopping and petrol. I then get a set sum transferred to my account for my own personal use (my wages ) and mrpnut sorts out all the rest of the bills.

We have our own business and because of that I'm used to keeping track of our money - but £1200 doesn't sound an unreasonable sum for household expenses.

It is easy to spend £200 per week on food if you have that sort of money, buy lots of convenience food & treats. It is also possible to eat healthily & well on £100 (I assume it is more like feeding 5 adults & 1 child as they are older). The moneysavingexpert.com has lots of information about budgeting, paying off debts etc.

Perhaps your dw needs a complete u turn in her way of thinking about money.

You need to jointly make decisions about your income & expenditure so that there is joint responsibility for it IYSWIM

I for one would be in heaven if I had £1200 per months for food, car & misc!!

I do think discussing it with her in an adult manner is much better than treating her like a child and bawling her out for wasting money. As a married couple (regardless of who earns what), the money should be treated as an equal pot, not your money and her money. I can almost guarantee that (like niceglasses) she will not respond well to finger wagging !

Oly, don't worry about being a dad - we quite like having dads around (See the Dadsnet section under topics...)

How about suggesting she keeps track of what she spends... 10 mins each eve plugging the day's receipts into a spreadsheet. Then you and she can see where the money goes, and if the family really does need more.

LoveMyGirls - coffee and snack is more like £10 in my neck of the woods. £15 if you include parking for an hour or 2 !

From a part-time working mum who shares finances with DH I can tell you that all our household bills excluding shopping come to £1100. We have a 3 bed semi in the south east with a mortgage under £100,000.

And food prices have steadily risen in the last couple of months, our weekly shopping budget is £60. This feeds, but does not include much fresh produce or meat, however it does include nappies.

So I can see totally where you're wife is coming from when she says £1200 is not enough. And you have 4 older children to feed and provide heat light and power for heat. How big is your house?

I think a bit of balance is needed. You acknowledge she works hard, at home allowing you the time to dedicate to work, so you have that partnership going for you already. Perhaps you need to work together more on the financial side now as well.

Ask her to start a ledger of all household bills and food shopping so you can see what is being spent and where, not so you can spy on her activities but so you see where there is room to downsize or change etc (energy providers, insurances and such)

Your wife may have run up bills that she hid from you because she resents having to ask for money. And feels that she is expected to work miracles with what you do give her.

Good luck

LowFat - all bills are covered. It is just food shopping and incidentals that are coming out of the £1200

Should add my children are both under 5

Yes, I would also say I think we (me and dh) have such a bad relationship with dosh because I absolutely HATE having to ask for money. This was part (only part) of racking up debt. I would avoid asking for money if I could. Maybe a small amnt she can spend on stuff just for her which is above board so she doesn't have to feel like she has to hide it?

Sorry - did read, but mis-read

In which case, I cannot see where the problem is, I would love to be in her shoes

of course if you have a healthy income maybe she just thinks well sod it we can afford it my mates do

i get the impression she has racked up the cc debt but you could pay it off? ie it's not a problem as such

If mortgage , bills and car cost are covered and the £1200 is for food and non essentials then it should be enough

If you didn't know about the credit card debts, has she been paying this out of the £1200. That would immediately knock it down to £1000 if she was just making the minimum payment each month.
If your 4 kids are teenagers, and she is covering allowances & mobile phone costs etc for them (which could be substantial, blimey even their school dinner allowance alone may run near to £100 a month) are THEY doing what they can to minimise these? Even a couple of hours working around the house/garden.
I must say in your wife's situation I would consider working part-time, especially to service/clear my debts. However, you may find that once she has her own income contributing to household expenses, you will have to bother behave in a more honest and clear manner with each other.
[Please note: I don't speak from the high ground on this. I recently posted about how concerned I was that I'm not accounting for the household money properly, and I have to cope on £2,500! All suggestionsd were gratefully received.]