Would you consider this an emotional affair?

[WouldYouHaveAproblem]

Firstly this is a hypothetical question, the background first:

I have a very close male friend, we're both single so no issues. We have an emotionally intimate relationship, we spend quality time together, we confide in each other, we message regularly and we exchange hugs and kisses emojis. In person we only ever hug hello and goodbye (no other physical intimacy). We've joked about being in a 'platonic relationship' and we both date other people. Neither of us have been in a relationship since we became friends (a couple of years). And no that's not related to us being friends, we've just not met anyone we want to be in a relationship with (and no, we don't want to be in a relationship with each other).

So here's the question. Yesterday we were having a discussion about when one of us meets someone else and I said, that our friendship will in all likelihood be a problem for a new partner of his. He vehemently denies this and says "it'll be a non negotiable and if she doesn't accept my pre existing friendships and trust me on that it'll never work". I said it's not about the friendship itself, but the depth of the friendship and how much emotional energy you give it that would be a problem. He said, "I have enough emotional energy for both".

How would you feel? (..and the fact that we aren't in a relationship with each other isn't the discussion point here).

YABU - an emotionally intimate friendship with a man who is in a relationship is always an EA
YANBU - if the friendship precedes the relationship I wouldn't consider it an EA

Sorry @Gwenhwyfar you've misunderstood me. I don't see my friends just once a month. With one set of friends we have a monthly meal out standing date in our diaries. I have great friendships of fun, holidays, support and different sets of friendship groups and one on ones. I still don't own my friends. Their lives are theirs to do as they please. I don't begrudge any of my friends not putting me first in terms of thinking about their futures and lives, I would be happy for any of my friends in decisions they make that might take them away from our immediate friendship, because of where their lives are going. So if my friend got a promotion and moved away, I would be thrilled for her, if my friend had two dc close together and was shattered and had no time to meet up, again I'd be happy that she was doing what she wanted to do in life and wouldn't take her lack of time for me as personal. When my male friend is in a relationship I don't try to insert myself as his priority or number one person. I make friends with his dp and don't overstep. I'm happy for him and wish him the best. If he told me what OPs friend has told her I would think he had feelings for me and would feel uncomfortable in that friendship. I have no desire to be anyone's favourite person over their partner or hypothetical partner.

I have a best friend, I still don't need to be her favourite person over her dp. That doesn't mean we're not close because I'd be happy for her if a promotion and move happened.

Seems a bit odd that you don't want a relationship when you are effectively in one minus sex.

That’s kind of the definition of friendship. Why has relationship become synonymous with romantic partnership?

"So if my friend got a promotion and moved away, I would be thrilled for her"

I would be thrilled for my friend too and wouldn't try to stop her going. However, I would still be sad to see her go. That's normal.

"I have a best friend, I still don't need to be her favourite person over her dp. "

Yes, I agree. I wouldn't expect to be no.1 either, but I'd expect the friendship to continue even if with less regular contact. And I'd accept having to be in the company of the new partner too. It would make no difference whether it was a male or female friend.

OK @Gwenhwyfar but the OPs friendship with this man isn't like that. This friendship is one where the man is essentially saying she comes first. This is a friendship where OP is sure that after these two years of friendship they will be friends and in each others lives forever like they currently are. I wouldn't presume to be in my friends lives forever like we are now, life happens, moves, promotions, family life ect. The attachment comes across to me as more than a friendship between them. None of my friends post 20 have said these sort of phrases.

It’s likely that your friendship is this intense now because you are both single and have that time to give to each other

👍

The only situation that I've known that was similar was a married friend who relied on a male friend for emotional support. She was aggrieved when he met someone, and though they professed undying emotional love, he moved on and left her bereft.

But that is not the case here, you are single, yet you do not speak of your worries if you met someone else, have you hypothetically theorized about that?

I personally don't think any future partner of his would be too pleased about the level of control you have over this man.
You have effectively asked if you would always be first in his affections.
That in my opnion is selfish and not something a friend would ever ask.

You cannot regulate someone elses relationship to fit with your own desires.

Sounds like you are just bff's
Maybe a bit more deeper friendship rn as no one is dating but nothing more to it
So nope. No EA. Just friendship .

I dont know what you are getting at really...

Just catching up on messages, thanks for all the responses. Good to get different perspectives.

For those asking why we were discussing it, it was no big deal, the conversation just evolved from talking about a film that had been on the telly ("You've got Mail") where the relationship starts over email. I called their relationship an 'emotional affair' and he wasn't familiar with the term (not English first language speaker) and the conversation progressed from there.... And as for why I was thinking about it this morning - I was reading something else on here about an EA and it reminded me of yesterday's conversation so I thought I'd get the MN opinion - nothing more complicated than that.

For those saying that our friendship is intense now because we're both single I agree, and I certainly don't expect the same level of interaction once he's in a relationship. But from my perspective I know what I'm like and I have another very close male friend who I've been friends with for 30 years and even though we don't speak as often these days we're still as close as we ever were (he's my DS's godfather).

@WitchyStarLight

OK *@Gwenhwyfar* but the OPs friendship with this man isn't like that. This friendship is one where the man is essentially saying she comes first. This is a friendship where OP is sure that after these two years of friendship they will be friends and in each others lives forever like they currently are. I wouldn't presume to be in my friends lives forever like we are now, life happens, moves, promotions, family life ect. The attachment comes across to me as more than a friendship between them. None of my friends post 20 have said these sort of phrases.

Hmm. I would say that with all my friends I have ALWAYS INTENDED to be friends with them forever. When I or they move, we vow to keep in touch and visit. Of course, it doesn't always happen, sometimes you lose contact, but other times it does. I spent new year with a friend I haven't lived in the same town as for over ten years, but we've met up once or twice a year while living far away from each other and keep in touch with messages, etc. The man didn't actually say she comes first either though did he? He just said they would still be friends even if he finds Miss Right. It's the kind of thing people say to their friends all the time. Of course, sometimes it doesn't work out in reality, but I find it totally normal to at least want to be friends forever.

(I do have a Forever Friends mug given to my by a school friend that I'm no longer in touch with except on FB).

I really don’t understand people who drop their mates when they get into a relationship. I’m currently on holiday with two friends - we talk over WhatsApp almost every day, confide intimate and emotional details of our lives with each other and actively make time to do fun things and spend quality time together. They are in relationships of 10 and 5 years respectively and our friendships have never been compromised by this. We’re all female (but I’m bisexual which apparently would make me a threat in some people’s opinion!)

I also have male friends who I’m similar with - confiding, hanging out, doing activities. They’ve been in relationships and single over the time I’ve known them. I wouldn’t expect to be dropped for a partner as I was there first and friendships are equally as important as romantic relationships imo. Neither would I tolerate a partner telling me to keep friends - male or female - at arm’s length.

I genuinely wonder what kind of friendships people have if they’re so ready to ditch them when they get into a relationship. Are some people’s friends just surface level acquaintances you have small talk with and nothing else? My friends have dragged me out of some of my darkest moments and I love them - platonic love is a thing. Relationships don’t have to be romantic. Friendships are life affirming and I’m so grateful for mine (especially as I was unpopular and bullied in school and didn’t have any close friends). I genuinely am sorry for people who never get to experience deep and loving friendship - I thought I never would.

Your friendship to me sounds like a lovely, close friendship to be treasured, and honestly if I were you I wouldn’t stand for a future partner trying to dictate the dynamics of my friendships with me.

"I genuinely wonder what kind of friendships people have if they’re so ready to ditch them when they get into a relationship. Are some people’s friends just surface level acquaintances you have small talk with and nothing else?"

Unfortunately, yes, but not all obviously. When you're single you just get used to seeing some old friends only when their partners are away. I've never forgotten another single friend being told 'my DH is away, do you want to come and hang around while I do the laundry?' What an offer, but I suppose they were still friends...

I think you are in a relationship, albeit a sexless one. You are meeting a lot of the needs people normally meet via a partner.

If one or both of you have another relationship, I'd anticipate your friendship changing tbh.

I wouldn't describe your relationship as an EA if you are open about it with new partners, but I can see it might not be OK for them.

@TedMullins

I really don’t understand people who drop their mates when they get into a relationship. I’m currently on holiday with two friends - we talk over WhatsApp almost every day, confide intimate and emotional details of our lives with each other and actively make time to do fun things and spend quality time together. They are in relationships of 10 and 5 years respectively and our friendships have never been compromised by this. We’re all female (but I’m bisexual which apparently would make me a threat in some people’s opinion!)

I also have male friends who I’m similar with - confiding, hanging out, doing activities. They’ve been in relationships and single over the time I’ve known them. I wouldn’t expect to be dropped for a partner as I was there first and friendships are equally as important as romantic relationships imo. Neither would I tolerate a partner telling me to keep friends - male or female - at arm’s length.

I genuinely wonder what kind of friendships people have if they’re so ready to ditch them when they get into a relationship. Are some people’s friends just surface level acquaintances you have small talk with and nothing else? My friends have dragged me out of some of my darkest moments and I love them - platonic love is a thing. Relationships don’t have to be romantic. Friendships are life affirming and I’m so grateful for mine (especially as I was unpopular and bullied in school and didn’t have any close friends). I genuinely am sorry for people who never get to experience deep and loving friendship - I thought I never would.

Your friendship to me sounds like a lovely, close friendship to be treasured, and honestly if I were you I wouldn’t stand for a future partner trying to dictate the dynamics of my friendships with me.

This is totally how I feel. Thank you!

@AllOfUsAreDead

Seems a bit odd that you don't want a relationship when you are effectively in one minus sex.

I could see future partners on both sides having a slight issue with this to be honest. You'll have the 'cool' woman comments of course who don't care about any interaction with the opposite sex by their partner even when it's highly suspicious, but I would find this a bit odd. Even if it was with someone of the same sex I'd find it a bit odd and wonder if they have struggled to come to terms with being homosexual. Because it does sound like an actual relationship and you're even calling it an emotional affair, you know this has gone beyond friendship.

Maybe you should rethink what you actually want with this man. You are no longer friends, you are more than that.

Nail on the head

@Stompythedinosaur

I think you are in a relationship, albeit a sexless one. You are meeting a lot of the needs people normally meet via a partner.

If one or both of you have another relationship, I'd anticipate your friendship changing tbh.

I wouldn't describe your relationship as an EA if you are open about it with new partners, but I can see it might not be OK for them.

Yes, as I said in my OP, we've acknowledged our 'platonic relationship'. When either of us enters a fully fledged relationship it will shift to a friendship. And as a pp said...friendships outlast many relationships. But my question wasn't about our relationship - it was about the effect of our friendship on any future relationships.

It would depend. If he was in a relationship but was confiding in you about things he should have been confiding in her about, or generally sharing more of his life with you than with her, that would be a problem.

I thought a platonic relationship was the same as a friendship or in your situation a close friendship.

You do seem very wary, even scared of losing this friendship.

I honestly don't think you can gauge what will happen in the future regarding future partners, it's impossible to quantify how much it will affect this friendship.

OP, you say you’ve discussed getting together. Is there a mutual physical attraction or is one of you attracted to the other?

I don't find men tend to form this kind of super intense friendship that they claim they would place even over a sexual relationship, without any sexual feeling on their part.

"I thought a platonic relationship was the same as a friendship or in your situation a close friendship."

It is.

i had a friendship like this.. the moment he started dating someone he pretty much cut me off.

If it was a genuinely platonic friendship, there would be absolutely no difference when one or both of you were in relationships, except possibly for having less time to spend together.

One of my closest friends was married when I first knew him, got a divorce, was single for a bit and is now seeing someone new. It hasn't made the slightest difference whether or not he was married, single or seeing someone, because (a) I'm married and (b) he's like my brother, so his relationship status is no concern of mine, apart from me being happy to see him happy etc.

Ive got platonic male friends
We’ve never talked avout the possibility of getting together
We never said ‘but we aren’t compatible’
Because it wasn’t relevant because we weren’t interested and the friendship never changed when we got partners

Ive got friends I said were platonic. We had maybe kissed when drunk, or gone on a date or talked about what we’d be like as a couple, thought about if it would work. When one of us got into a relationship our friendships ended or felt inappropriate

@WouldYouHaveAproblem

I think he cares for you a lot more than he says - question is do you feel the same and if so tel him x

"If it was a genuinely platonic friendship, there would be absolutely no difference when one or both of you were in relationships, except possibly for having less time to spend together."

Well yes, but that's quite a big difference.