To be FED UP of inconsiderate drivers towards horses

[SaltAndVinegarIsTheBest]

I know this thread has been done to death, but I just needed to rant sorry

I’m sick of drivers who just don’t give a shit about horses on the road. Most people are lovely and try their best to give space and drive slowly and it is so much appreciated unfortunately there’s a minority who don’t. I’ve had cars go right up to about a foot away from my horse. I’ve had cars speed past without slowing or giving any space. I’ve been shouted at and called every name under the sun for daring to be out on the road with my horse. I think most riders have experienced similar and try to avoid hacking where possible.

Why can’t people appreciate the dangers involved in horse riding and that if you spook the horse it could have disastrous consequences? My horse is 16.3 and if he rears and I end up crushed, I’d be lucky to even survive.

I’ve been there. I’ve been stuck behind a tractor or cyclist whilst late to work. I know how frustrating it is! But ultimately if a 5 minute delay was enough to make me late, then the problem lies with my timekeeping more than anything else.

And before anyone says anything, horses have every right to be on the road. I avoid it where possible as the risks are too great, but sometimes it is necessary and at the end of the day it is allowed. Blaming horse riders is victim blaming as we should be able to safely hack out without fearing ending up in hospital.

Thanks to everyone who is considerate around horses on the road. To those who aren’t, remember that horse riders want to get themselves and their horse home safely- don’t be the reason that doesn’t happen.

@Cluckingtell

Cars are the most dangerous things on the road by a very long way, after all. I'd consider buses and lorries more dangerous - by a very long way.

Car drivers pass a test some time in their late teens and (so long as they don't actually get caught breaking the law) can continue driving for decades with no further checks.

HGV and bus drivers on the other hand have much more rigorous training and testing, tachographs to monitor their hours and will usually have some kind of competency management from their employer. They also spend far more time on the road so will gain experience quicker.

I cycle to/from work every day and never have a problem with HGVs (there aren't many bus routes so I don't see many buses). They never overtake unless it is safe to do so, and always leave plenty of room. In return I make sure that I never enter a blind spot. Cars and vans on the other hand are very variable in their behaviour. I remember one long distance overnight ride where the HGV drivers were without exception diligent about dipping their headlights when I approached. Not so the car drivers.

@MorningStarling

The crucial point is whether slower traffic causes traffic travelling at the normal speed for a particular road to be delayed. Last time I was in Scotland I frequently saw these signs saying "Frustration causes accidents. Please allow overtaking." Whether you're a pedestrian, horse rider, cyclist, tractor driver, invalid carriage driver or whatever else, if you're not able to keep a decent speed up - usually you can tell this by there being a queue of cars behind - pull over and let them pass.

Whilst a driver who causes a horse to get spooked by driving too close will be judged predominantly at fault, the rider has to share some of the blame.

It's a good sign, but should be interspersed with 'Frustration causes accidents. Please try to be patient until it's safe to pass' or suchlike.

'Frustration causes accidents. Please try to be patient until it's safe to pass' or suchlike. You think that would work better? Would be an interesting experiment for the nudge unit.

@Cluckingtell

'Frustration causes accidents. Please try to be patient until it's safe to pass' or suchlike. You think that would work better? Would be an interesting experiment for the nudge unit.

My point is that the onus should be on all road users to behave considerately. Having just that one set aimed at slower traffic is a bit 'look what you made me do', I fear, if there's nowhere they asses as safe to pull in.

@HogDogKetchup

Nobody needs to defend why horses are on the roads - it’s a legal entitlement same as for car users, cyclists and runners/pedestrians. All OP is asking is to be treated with respect in the process.

This, all the way to the bank.

Nobody has more right to use the roads than anyone else.

If a driver can't be considerate to every other type of road use, then hand your licence in.

@Rosieposie101

I voted YABU but only because I don't believe horses should be allowed to use a public road for the reasons you've listed yourself. An inconvenience for drivers and potentially disastrously dangerous for everyone including the horse.

I spend WAY more time stuck behind drivers who do 40mph regardless of the speed limit and conditions than I do stuck behind horses/cyclists/whatever.

Who is inconviencing who, exactly?

YANBU. But fuck me there's some depressing responses on here.

@SaltAndVinegarIsTheBest
if you spook the horse it could have disastrous consequences?
My horse is 16.3 and if he rears ....

@coronabeer
I think they can naturally be quite nervous creatures so it's not fair to risk scaring them - and even if you don't do anything all that bad, they can still panic so you need to allow space for the rider to get them back under control.

@merrypoppings
a cyclist whizzing past him with no warning makes him panic and become dangerous.

@merrypoppings
Horses are unpredictable...
My horse will walk past a tractor or big lorry with no problem but if he sees a crisp packet or an open drain he thinks its a fire-breathing dragon and will leap into the middle of the road

@lakielady
she has disabilites arising from a fall when the horse she was exercising freaked when a noisy car with a loud turbo roared past them

@cookiedough123
it makes me nervous cos she is more likely to spook at a random plastic bag, or a very bright flower

And yet you all think horses are safe and suitable for the modern road environment? They sound like an absolute liability and a danger to al those around them.
Are you really in proper control of that animal? No you simply are not as the above shows. Cars, bikes, motorcycles have brakes and steering - horses do not. You see the best trained horses in the world at professional show jumping events, doing what they are trained to do every singe day, and there will regularly be the odd one freak out at a jump or refuse to do what it is told and chuck its rider off.
Never mind the previous poster recounting the horrific tale of the a horse randomly kicking out at a pedestrian and killing a young child it was passing.

It's not 1960 any more when you might be passed by the odd morris minor every half hour or so - modern roads and modern traffic levels are a very different place.

@lewittdee
they're an archaic luxury that you're imposing on the rest of us. A tractor is different, they're participating in agriculture, not a hobby.

if you are putting a massive animal that spooks easily onto a public road, you're putting others in danger. Then wanting to blame others for imposing a safety hazard on the rest of us!

Like it or lump it, roads are primarily there to facilitate transport.

Exactly, playing with horses is a hobby or to facilitate someone else's hobby (ie horse racing and gambling being the hobby). There must be a miniscule number of really working hoses in the country. All the horse racing excuse stuff is still just for a hobby - these are not working horses.

@LewittDee

Well if the horses dislike schooling, I guess that's that sorted then

Cars shouldn't be reckless and no one should be shouting harassment. But it's annoying to act like cars driving on the road (e.g. passing without slowing down enough for your horse's liking) are doing something wrong because you are riding a massive, spookable animal on a shared road.

"Well if the horses dislike schooling, I guess that's that sorted then hmm" Haha :-) I've been a horse rider for many years - oh yes and been hit by a car ! - I honestly think riders should stay off busy roads, especially at peak driving times. Hack in quiet times guys. Horse riders do tend to be courteous towards drivers, always saying thank you if drivers slow down and pulling over in first available place to let cars pass. Horse riding enthusiasts have local FB pages where inconsiderate horse riders, if spotted, are taken to task by other riders they often know in the horse world and reminded to thank drivers, pull over, wear Hi Viz. We do try to be considerate :-)

I don't understand why so many drivers have absolutely no patience or consideration for others. People who can't manage basic human decency on the road shouldn't have a license.

The majority of people in this country work in "facilitating someone else's hobbies", once you allow for all non-essential retail, tourism, most tech, service industries, sports, kids activities, entertainment... What makes those hobbies more valid than "playing" with horses? Or should we all abandon those jobs and try to sustain the population working in only those occupations that are arbitrarily declared valid?

@user1471447863

Iirc the horse industry is worth around £4.5 billion. It supports a massive amount of people, through various jobs, and things like racing and hunting are often the lifeblood of rural areas.

As a rider, I hate being on the road. I've already had one accident that injured my horse, so badly he had to be retired at 10,and I dread having another. I always wear high viz and lights but that makes no odds to drivers who think they are a supreme being and must take precedence over everything else.

A lot of the time, riders have no choice but to use the road. It's not good for horses to stay in the school, going round in circles, and the bridleways are often unusable.

The argument isn’t should horses be on the road or not. Most would rather not be but many places have limited off road riding or need roads to get there.

However, they are allowed; end of story.

The element that people do have control over is is it preferable to wait a few minutes then pass safely or risk a persons life.

I once had a horrible accident on the road on a usually calm horse who was experienced in traffic. A tractor pulling a trailer came up behind me so I moved onto the verge as it was a single track lane and I didn’t want to hold them up.

They passed us far too fast and combination of speed plus rattling trailer spooked the horse, he bolted, slipped and fell on me on the road. Horse got away with minor scrapes, I had several broken bones and a head injury but I consider myself lucky that it wasn’t worse considering I had half a tonne of horse crush me on tarmac.

The driver was prosecuted for dangerous driving.
Was it worth him saving those 30 seconds?

P.s I was riding that horse for work, not a hobby.

The argument isn’t should horses be on the road or not. Most would rather not be but many places have limited off road riding or need roads to get there.

However, they are allowed; end of story

Yes. This! All day long.

Peoples opinion as to whether horses should be on the road is totally irrelevant. They are legally entitled to be there and drivers are expected to behave responsibly around them.

My DD rides. She rides on the road as little as possible just to get to bridle ways, but has been subjected to horrifying driving. She wears hi-vis, has a helmet camera, rides at quiet times and on quiet roads, she says thank you, pulls in whenever it’s safe to do so and her pony is fine in traffic, however she’s been hit by a car (car drove up her ponies arse - no injuries to either fortunately), been overtaken so close the roof of the car hit her foot, she’s had all sorts of abuse shouted at her, drivers revving their engines, drivers hooting at her and drivers over taking far too close without slowing down at all.

She’s not asking for a red carpet. Just that drivers don’t act like dicks and behave responsibly - as per the Highway Code.

Having been a rider in my youth I always pass horses wide and slow and have helped catch an escaped (from the field not accident) horse before. There can be a shortage of paths or bridleways and some people cannot drive sensibly - small country road are bad for it.

I would agree that some people just drive like dicks and are a danger to all other road users / cyclists / walkers because they think a metal box entitles them to have priority.

@TabbyM

I would agree that some people just drive like dicks and are a danger to all other road users / cyclists / walkers because they think a metal box entitles them to have priority.

That metal box will be useless when you get half a tonne of horse through the windscreen

In my experience its the narrow country roads that bring out the worst in drivers. They get impatient.

We have a 17:1 4yo. She's pretty unmissable in a high viz sheet with rider also in high viz but some drivers don't seem to appreciate how dangerous it is to pass to close to 700kg of flight animal at high speed. I view it as my job as a rider to discourage them from taking stupid risks.

Wherever possible, we pull in off the road to let traffic pass. When there's no room to pass, and nowhere to pull in, we stay in the middle of the road so that drivers are not tempted to try and pass where it isn't safe.

Where there is 'just' room to pass, we usually ask oncoming drivers to stop then walk past the stationary car (It can be hard to keep a 4yo horse completely still but is much easier to ask her to walk past a car that has stopped to let her past).

Sometimes if there's a car waiting to pass from behind, we do the same thing - ask it to stop, turn round and walk past it then turn round again and continue with our hack. We aren't in a rush and its good practice for her.

Minimising the amount of time drivers are stuck behind us generally seems to work. And we always make sure to say please and thankyou.

In 2020, 1,037 road traffic incidents which involved horses were reported in the UK. (The British Horse Society estimates that there may have been more like 3,000, since many are unreported.) 80 horses were killed by cars that year. Over the ten years between 2010 and 2020 (can't find this for 2020 alone) 44 riders have been killed and 1,220 have been injured on roads, while 395 horses have been killed and 1,080 have been injured. By cars and the drivers of cars, not by other horses.

In 2020 there were 1,460 reported (human) road deaths involving cars, included in an estimated total of 23,529 killed or seriously injured (KSI) human casualties, and 15,584 human casualties of other severities.

Looks to me as if cars are considerably more menace to other road users than horses are.

Just sayin'.

Where I live many of the lanes are too narrow for two cars to pass each other without one of them pulling in to a passing place, and you just damn' well have to wait for any horse in front of you going in the same direction to have finished using the bit of lane you want to go along, just as you have to wait for any car going more slowly than you. Likewise it is sensible, if you see a horse or horses coming towards you, to pull in to a passing place and wait until they have finished using that bit of road. Sensible because after all, a horse could do a lot of damage to your car with a shod hoof if you try to push it about. Also polite, not that the sort of idiot who uses their horn to demand their right to drive along such lanes at seventy would know what that word means.

@AskingQuestionsAllTheTime

In 2020, 1,037 road traffic incidents which involved horses were reported in the UK. (The British Horse Society estimates that there may have been more like 3,000, since many are unreported.) 80 horses were killed by cars that year. Over the ten years between 2010 and 2020 (can't find this for 2020 alone) 44 riders have been killed and 1,220 have been injured on roads, while 395 horses have been killed and 1,080 have been injured. By cars and the drivers of cars, not by other horses.

In 2020 there were 1,460 reported (human) road deaths involving cars, included in an estimated total of 23,529 killed or seriously injured (KSI) human casualties, and 15,584 human casualties of other severities.

Looks to me as if cars are considerably more menace to other road users than horses are.

Just sayin'.

Where I live many of the lanes are too narrow for two cars to pass each other without one of them pulling in to a passing place, and you just damn' well have to wait for any horse in front of you going in the same direction to have finished using the bit of lane you want to go along, just as you have to wait for any car going more slowly than you. Likewise it is sensible, if you see a horse or horses coming towards you, to pull in to a passing place and wait until they have finished using that bit of road. Sensible because after all, a horse could do a lot of damage to your car with a shod hoof if you try to push it about. Also polite, not that the sort of idiot who uses their horn to demand their right to drive along such lanes at seventy would know what that word means.

Looks to me as if cars are considerably more menace to other road users than horses are I see you use absolute numbers not percentages of road users. Given you are getting so excited by number proving your point - do you know the percentage of accidents for different types of road users?

Well, it might be interesting to know how many car-drivers are killed by horses on the road... I suppose if a horse ran into a major road and the driver of a car skidded into something avoiding it and was killed that would count.

The trouble is, I couldn't find any examples. So at the moment the percentage of road users killed by cars is 100% and by horses 0%. It might even be the case that you are more likely to be killed by a falling rock coming in through the windscreen than by a horse.

I think I will go on worrying more about being killed by a car than by a horse when I am driving.