To be FED UP of inconsiderate drivers towards horses

[SaltAndVinegarIsTheBest]

I know this thread has been done to death, but I just needed to rant sorry

I’m sick of drivers who just don’t give a shit about horses on the road. Most people are lovely and try their best to give space and drive slowly and it is so much appreciated unfortunately there’s a minority who don’t. I’ve had cars go right up to about a foot away from my horse. I’ve had cars speed past without slowing or giving any space. I’ve been shouted at and called every name under the sun for daring to be out on the road with my horse. I think most riders have experienced similar and try to avoid hacking where possible.

Why can’t people appreciate the dangers involved in horse riding and that if you spook the horse it could have disastrous consequences? My horse is 16.3 and if he rears and I end up crushed, I’d be lucky to even survive.

I’ve been there. I’ve been stuck behind a tractor or cyclist whilst late to work. I know how frustrating it is! But ultimately if a 5 minute delay was enough to make me late, then the problem lies with my timekeeping more than anything else.

And before anyone says anything, horses have every right to be on the road. I avoid it where possible as the risks are too great, but sometimes it is necessary and at the end of the day it is allowed. Blaming horse riders is victim blaming as we should be able to safely hack out without fearing ending up in hospital.

Thanks to everyone who is considerate around horses on the road. To those who aren’t, remember that horse riders want to get themselves and their horse home safely- don’t be the reason that doesn’t happen.

@Polkadotties

It will stop the issue of horse riders being on the roads. I have a bridle way near my yard, to get to it I have to ride on the road. There is a footpath adjoining my yard’s land, the footpath also joins up with the bridle way. If we were allowed to ride on footpaths we wouldn’t have to go on the road

This raises an interesting point, if you (general you here not directed at poster I've quoted) were to be walking or cycling on a bridleway, a designated space for horses to use, but also allowed to be used by people walking and cycling, would it be acceptable for a horse rider to gallop past? Pass you so closely that you fear you may get hit by them? Get so close behind you to make you feel intimidated? Tell you you shouldn't be there, because it's a bridleway and therefore for horses only despite being open to other users? Shout at you to get out of the way?

The road through my village has a bridle way parallel to it, 50m away. There's nowhere you can get to going on the road that you can't get to using the bridle way.

Yet the horses ride on the road constantly. I pass wide and slow because I drive safely but it doesnt mean I'm not going to be constantly baffled by the horse riders insistence on using the road.

The only road users who have the irrevocable right to use the roads are pedestrians, cyclists and horse riders (ie non motorised). Drivers of motorised vehicles can only use the roads under license if they fulfil certain conditions ie pass a test and hold insurance. That right can be revoked if drivers fail to drive according to the standards laid down. That said it never ceases to amaze me that a simple request to be considerate of others using the roads descends in to a bun fight. I wonder how many people who think it's too much trouble to give consideration to non motorised road users have trumpeted "Be Kind" all over social media in the past couple of years?

@OfstedOffred

The road through my village has a bridle way parallel to it, 50m away. There's nowhere you can get to going on the road that you can't get to using the bridle way.

Yet the horses ride on the road constantly. I pass wide and slow because I drive safely but it doesnt mean I'm not going to be constantly baffled by the horse riders insistence on using the road.

It depends what condition the bridleway is in. Some are badly maintained - low hanging branches that knock riders, used by flytippers to dump large items, etc making them impassable in places.

Tell you you shouldn't be there, because it's a bridleway and therefore for horses only despite being open to other users? This has been raised by local riders on Facebook, who question why people on foot should be allowed to use their bridleways.

@Cluckingtell

Tell you you shouldn't be there, because it's a bridleway and therefore for horses only despite being open to other users? This has been raised by local riders on Facebook, who question why people on foot should be allowed to use their bridleways.

So is it acceptable for horse riders to do the things I described in my post because they believe that people on foot shouldn't be on a bridleway? Are they questioning it, or are they demanding that people on foot shouldn't be there at all (despite it being allowed) and are hostile towards the people on foot because they're there? Are they saying their right to use the shared space in a dangerous and disrespectful way towards other users is acceptable because they believe the other users shouldn't be there?

People (some of them) are just too impatient. I always slow right down, turn the radio off and overtake giving plenty of space. However I do hate overtaking horses as I'm always worried the horse will get scared.
I used to go horseriding many years ago but would be too scared to do it now. I'm quite impressed when I see riders on the road. Seem to be a lot of idiots on the road which is bad enough as a car user let alone a vulnerable road user,

Sorry to hear this OP

Very selfish of them

@SweetFelicityArkright Are they questioning it, or are they demanding that people on foot shouldn't be there at all (despite it being allowed) and are hostile towards the people on foot because they're there? I would say being very hostile - demanding of their right to use a shared path at the exclusion of others. Even though they acknowledge they have no right in law. But like every group of users, some horseriders are assholes - it's just that there are fewer of you and when you come across in an entitled way, it reinforces a commonly help belief.

@gogohm

I know it's a problem but it does go both ways, some mornings I have to pass 3 or 4 riders going to work (not together) plus maybe a couple of cyclists doing 1 mph on the steep bending hill - my 15 minute journey can become 50 mins some days and I don't think that is right either when the riders are out for leisure, waiting until after 9am for instance would help me and the rest of the queue of traffic (a police motorbike actually made a cyclist get off and push in Thursday because he had caused a 2 mile tailback (I know the policeman). Frustration does cause a lot of the problems and employers can be less than understanding. I pass as far away as possible but the road is narrow where the stables are, riders need to keep left to enable as wide a berth as possible.

By the way my biggest bugbear is the stupid national grid contractors whose underpowered trucks can't get up the aforementioned steep bendy hill at more than 5mph, and they have a motor so no excuses! I wish they would sort out the roads here. Rural living hey!

That’s funny because when I went to work last week I was nearly late because I was stuck behind a learner driver. My 30 minute commute (on a good day) became 45 minutes. Initially I was frustrated but then I remembered that the roads are not just for me and other people are equally entitled to use them. And if I had left with sufficient time then I wouldn’t have been late.

You can’t clear the roads of learners, horses, cyclists, and all other slow moving vehicles purely so you can get to work. I don’t know why leaving a bit earlier seems to be such a crazy idea.

Also, you have literally no idea if the riders are out for leisure or not. They could be working and their right to work is as just as important as your right to get to your work.

@OfstedOffred

Everyone has a right to use the road for enjoyment

This is not true. My children aren't allowed to roller skate along it even though it's the only smooth place, I'm not allowed to play skittles in it.

Like it or lump it, roads are primarily there to facilitate transport.

That’s because things called pavements exist for roller skating and therefore using the road would be unnecessary. You have use of the pavement and blocking the road would be unreasonable.

Unless you’re saying you would be fine with horse riders using the pavement too so we can get off the road? I’d be happy with this idea.

Saltandvinegar I live rurally. Many local roads don't have pavements.

@PrivateHall

EVERYONE needs to be more considerate on the roads, this certainly isn't a 'horse' issue. This video was shared in another thread which sums up how inconsiderate many road users are - twitter.com/anthonytilghman/status/1489814943859986438?s=21

That being said, you say many times horses have a right to use the roads as they 'enjoy' hacking. I would love to know how you can tell? Everything I have ever read on the subject suggests that generally horses 'tolerate' being ridden rather than enjoy. They did not evolve to have humans sitting on them and it is no longer necessary as a form of transport. I personally question the ethics of heavy humans thinking they are entitled to be carried around by horses.

I like horses but don't enjoy seeing them on the road and I am very nervous encountering them when I am out running - I end up having to call to the rider to ask what they want me to do as they never look at me or engage with me. I don't like to come up from behind and startle the horse by overtaking without warning, I also am nervous about running towards the horse when going in the opposite direction due to previous bad experiences. When in the car I come to a complete stop if safe to do so to let the horse pass me, or I crawl by if I need to overtake it (the road I often encounter horses on is very very narrow), and don't increase my speed until I am a good bit past. I rarely get a wave of thanks, but I do it anyway because I like to be considerate to all road users but also because I feel a bit sorry for horses as it is.

To answer part of your post, my horse enjoys hacking. How can I tell? She marches out with her ears pricked, interested and keen to get going. I don't have to make her go. She stomps out happily the whole way no matter which way we go.

We do have to ride on roads some of the time and most drivers are fine. I always say thank you to drivers who pass carefully and if they seem unsure I wave them past, and I always pull in to let people past. I hate seeing riders who also aren't considerate of other road users. I don't think anyone is really yet aware of the new laws about passing horses safely and anyway I don't think they will make any difference.

I hate the notion that horses are only owned by the wealthy. I work in the NHS and rent my house, I scrimp and save for my horse and go without a lot of other things. I can imagine that many of the people saying horses are for rich people get far more holidays and new clothes than I ever do!!

Everyone just has to be considerate
Cyclist shout hi so they don't spook the horse, motorists slow down
In return I slow down past walkers, let car drivers know of anything I can see that they can't, move into a gateway to let people past, let people's children pet the horse, say hi to walkers... it's just mutual respect
And it's so nice when you have a hack like that and everything just works

I was out riding once, towards a bend. Car hurtled around the bend, slammed brakes on and started screeching at me. I think she frightened herself because she wasn't expecting me to be there but if you're going to drive round country lanes at that speed... I could have been a Walker or cyclist or child

[quote Cluckingtell]**@SweetFelicityArkright* Are they questioning it, or are they demanding that people on foot shouldn't be there at all (despite it being allowed) and are hostile towards the people on foot because they're there?* I would say being very hostile - demanding of their right to use a shared path at the exclusion of others. Even though they acknowledge they have no right in law. But like every group of users, some horseriders are assholes - it's just that there are fewer of you and when you come across in an entitled way, it reinforces a commonly help belief.[/quote]
Yes, I think you're right, people always fall back on the stereotype about horsey people to justify their words/actions no matter how dangerous they are, but as pointed out upthread, the stereotype is just that, a stereotype and certainly not representative of horse riders as a whole, and even if it were, not a reason to endanger people on purpose because you believe they shouldn't be there, or the law that allows them to share the space is archaic and outdated.
Same goes for horse riders that are demanding sole use of bridleways and being hostile about it, they'd be just as unreasonable to endanger walkers or other users of the shared space because of a belief that those other users shouldn't be there.

IME it's usually the other drivers, any pedestrians and of course the horse(s), rider(s) that end up having to deal with the results of someone driving around horses aggressively or without attention as the person causing the problem is usually long gone.
The horse I used to ride on the road was pretty much rock solid in any kind of traffic, with trains, tractors, bikes etc, that didn't stop her reacting in a perfectly normal way to incidents like having objects thrown out of windows or being driven at or into.
Anyone who thinks that a horse shouldn't react under such circumstances needs to ask themselves if they would react if something was thrown at them while driving, if someone aimed their car directly at them while driving. I've had both happen, more than once, and I wasn't the problem, the people behaving that way were the problem, the horse would not have reacted had those people just driven on past.

There's entitled arseholes in all walks of life, but unfortunately it you happen to love horses, you're assumed to be an entitled arsehole without question, and that's then the justification for behaving dangerously, which as I've said before, is a pretty poor excuse for behaving that way.

That’s because things called pavements exist for roller skating and therefore using the road would be unnecessary. You have use of the pavement and blocking the road would be unreasonable.

I'd be quite happy if residential streets went back to being used for skating and jumpers-for-goalposts football, instead of being monopolised by two-tonne juggernauts. Cars could pass, but only once they've waited for the kids to pick up their ball and move to the side.

@OfstedOffred

Saltandvinegar I live rurally. Many local roads don't have pavements.

That still doesn’t give people the right to go roller skating and play on roads

You can’t seriously be comparing the rights of a horse to be on the road with the rights of children to rollerskate on the road? That’s absolutely ridiculous. The latter is for pavements, and it’s a shame if you don’t have any in your area, but that change the fact it’s got pavements.

The roads are for everyone to use so long as they are using something which is legally allowed to be on the roads. That includes cars, motorbikes, horse and cyclists.

@OfstedOffred

Where I live there are numerous riding trails including a large woodland full of wide bridle ways. The local riders will literally ride down the road when there is a bridle way running parallel to it 50m so yes, it pisses everyone off.

I pass wide and slow but get annoyed with rubbish like "horses have every right to be o the road". That's an archaic freedom dating from horses being an actual legitimately useful form of transport. Today horse riding is an expensive leisure pursuit, largely the preserve of the well off and it's a huge inconvenience to people actually using roads for transport.

‘Horses are largely the preserve of the well off’

Why is this even relevant and why did you feel the need to mention it? It’s almost as if you’re excusing people’s illegal and irresponsible behaviour towards horses on the road purely because you believe the ridiculous stereotype that all riders are rich.

And you appear to know absolutely nothing about horse riding so sweeping statements about how horse riding is largely an expensive leisure pursuit is both ignorant and offensive to the millions of people who work extremely hard in various fields of equine work.

What about when horse riders are also using the roads for transport? I’ve as much right to be on the roads with my horse as you do with your car. Neither of us have any greater right than the other. That’s not an arguable point that’s literally the law.

You're definitely not being unreasonable and I'm quite shocked that 36% think you are! Perhaps the same people convinced that horse riders are all upper class & very well off?

The world would be a much nicer place if everyone could have a bit more consideration for everyone else, even if their background, interests and way of life differ to your own.

I don't think he would deliberately drive badly or fast to spook a horse, but a friend of mine had the attitude of 'I pay vehicle-tax for my car in order to use the road, do horse-riders pay to ride their horses on the road?'.
I thought this was an appalling thing to say, but he wouldn't be persuaded to have any other point of view.

OP, not long ago I passed two riders with horses so left loads of space and drove slowly. I love horses and I didn’t want to make them jump. Also quite like looking at them trotting happily along - possibly irrelevant. One rider gave me a big thumbs up. I thought that was unexpectedly nice until I saw the way someone behind me overtook them. Loads of music, engine noise, acceleration, so close. Those poor horses. If you deal with idiots like that regularly, no wonder you are annoyed. Now I get that the thumbs up was gratitude simply because it must be common to get given no space on the road.

You are right that people need to be mindful and careful when following or passing horses.

You are wrong to imply that if people stopped quaffing wine, they too could enjoy horse ownership. The vast majority of people who own horses for leisure are wealthy. It is a simple fact that horse ownership is expensive and most are owned by those with money. Pretending otherwise is simply ludicrous.

@cansu

You are right that people need to be mindful and careful when following or passing horses.

You are wrong to imply that if people stopped quaffing wine, they too could enjoy horse ownership. The vast majority of people who own horses for leisure are wealthy. It is a simple fact that horse ownership is expensive and most are owned by those with money. Pretending otherwise is simply ludicrous.

I didn’t actually say that, it was another poster, but I don’t think they literally meant that giving up a bottle of wine would mean people could afford a horse. I’m guessing that it was said in jest as it is frustrating to hear the rhetoric of how all horse riders and rich and snobby. That’s not the case and it’s an ignorant assumption.

And yes, many riders are very wealthy. But many are very poor. I know someone who goes without the basics to pay for her horse. She isn’t paying for her horse on top of a car and mortgage and holidays- it’s instead of all these things. She’s not wealthy at all. The money that other people spend on their cars or iphones or holidays, she just spends it on her horse instead. Some people with cars are wealthy but some are not. Horse owners are the same.

Horses on the road do generally annoy me when driving, especially on tight country roads, but like you said, you have every right to be there. And as a sister of a horse rider, I'd never want to cause a horse to spook as I've seen the damage they can do to the rider!

Nobody needs to defend why horses are on the roads - it’s a legal entitlement same as for car users, cyclists and runners/pedestrians. All OP is asking is to be treated with respect in the process.