To be FED UP of inconsiderate drivers towards horses

[SaltAndVinegarIsTheBest]

I know this thread has been done to death, but I just needed to rant sorry

I’m sick of drivers who just don’t give a shit about horses on the road. Most people are lovely and try their best to give space and drive slowly and it is so much appreciated unfortunately there’s a minority who don’t. I’ve had cars go right up to about a foot away from my horse. I’ve had cars speed past without slowing or giving any space. I’ve been shouted at and called every name under the sun for daring to be out on the road with my horse. I think most riders have experienced similar and try to avoid hacking where possible.

Why can’t people appreciate the dangers involved in horse riding and that if you spook the horse it could have disastrous consequences? My horse is 16.3 and if he rears and I end up crushed, I’d be lucky to even survive.

I’ve been there. I’ve been stuck behind a tractor or cyclist whilst late to work. I know how frustrating it is! But ultimately if a 5 minute delay was enough to make me late, then the problem lies with my timekeeping more than anything else.

And before anyone says anything, horses have every right to be on the road. I avoid it where possible as the risks are too great, but sometimes it is necessary and at the end of the day it is allowed. Blaming horse riders is victim blaming as we should be able to safely hack out without fearing ending up in hospital.

Thanks to everyone who is considerate around horses on the road. To those who aren’t, remember that horse riders want to get themselves and their horse home safely- don’t be the reason that doesn’t happen.

@user1471504747

You really think the average person drinks a £10 bottle of wine a night and that is all they’d have to forgo to sort out riding lessons etc?

Never change mumsnet

One memorable thread ‘we’re poor but maintain a horse.’ If someone claimed to be poor but had helicopter flying or sailing as a hobby they’d rightly be torn a new one! These can actually be cheaper than keeping a horse.

Also I wasn’t equating class with poverty.
Merely that ‘working class’ seems to be shorthand for deprivation.
Anybody who can afford such an expensive hobby certainly isn’t deprived, even if they have to work ‘extremely hard to pay for it.
Same with the people driving ‘old bangers’ and kids in private school :D

@bobbiebo

I always make sure to pass horses slow and wide and people shouldn't be deliberately spooking your horse however I have to a agree that they shouldn't be on the road.

If your horse is going to be an unpredictable hazard walking along a road where people are driving the speed limit then quite frankly it shouldn't be there.

On a lot of country roads which are NSL, it's the drivers trying to achieve the speed limit that are the hazard. On many, many roads it is not at all safe to drive at the speed limit. Around me, driving at speed means driving around blind bends on single track roads at 60mph. If my horse is all you meet around that bend, you're bloody lucky, because I will have put my horse as far off the road as I possibly can. A tractor or another car around that corner won't be able to get out of the way and there will be a serious accident. This happens on a semi-frequent basis round here when non-locals use it as a cut through to avoid traffic / roadworks. The speeds at which you can safely overtake a horse are actually not far off the speed you should be doing on many of these roads anyway.

@bobbiebo

I always make sure to pass horses slow and wide and people shouldn't be deliberately spooking your horse however I have to a agree that they shouldn't be on the road.

If your horse is going to be an unpredictable hazard walking along a road where people are driving the speed limit then quite frankly it shouldn't be there.

Thank you for passing slow and wide it’s greatly appreciated!

But cars are also unpredictable hazards at times. They can skid and lose control. Or a driver could suddenly take unwell and the vehicle is out of control. But we can’t ban cars from the roads. We just have to accept unfortunately there will always be small risks involved with driving.

The speed limit is the road with ideal conditions. But due to weather, other road users and other factors the speed limit isn’t always possible. Do you continue doing 60 on a country road round a sharp corner? No, you slow based on the road conditions. If I drive on a road that’s a 30 and there’s a learner driver doing 20, do I insist on doing 30? No, I accept that due to the road conditions (ie a learner driver) we will have to drive a bit slower than the speed limit. And that’s fine.

If not driving to the speed limit for the entire road causes people to be late then perhaps they should leave a bit of extra time. Learner drivers exist. As do horses. As do weather conditions. As do tractors. As do a million other reasons that driving at the speed limit isn’t possible.

You're only BU in expecting a thread on MN to change anything. If a driver is inconsiderate then complaining on MN isn't going to make a difference ... and especially not on a Friday night.

There are a few riders who live near us. One of them has a horse that is particularly skittish. I pull over and stop my car till it passes because it's so nervous. But it worries me that on the narrower roads or with less considerate drivers, it might bolt or rear.

YANBU
We used to ride when I was a teen and commented we wouldn’t feel safe now.

As a driver I will often meet horses and love the sight of them and always go so slow when see them ; they often are on winding country lanes where we live and hard to see coming. I look out for them the way I also look out for unexpected deer we have lots of too; a visiting car from outside the area wouldn’t always know to be so vigilant and it’s quite scary
(Incidentally I see so many deer sadly killed on side of road and seen how they come out of seemingly nowhere )

@sanbeiji

Also I wasn’t equating class with poverty. Merely that ‘working class’ seems to be shorthand for deprivation. Anybody who can afford such an expensive hobby certainly isn’t deprived, even if they have to work ‘extremely hard to pay for it. Same with the people driving ‘old bangers’ and kids in private school :D

What i was trying to get across is that not everyone who has a horse is entitled. It's what I and lots of other 'working class' people choose to spend our money on. I can still afford to feed my family and heat my home but I work bloody hard to pay for what I enjoy. It keeps me fit and sane and I have the most amazing bond with a beautiful animal.

The whole point of the posters thread was a polite request to just pass slow and wide when approaching a horse. I'm pretty sure if it was a police horse then people wouldn't dare speed up on purpose.

Why drivers feel the need to 'cause' an accident on purpose is beyond normal thinking. All it is is a simple request to pass wide and slow end of.

I see your point but driving a sensible speed for a country lane is still going to spook a horse.

Yes other drivers are a potential risk as anything can be but I don't have to slow to 5 mph every time I see one and worry about it getting scared and leaping into oncoming traffic or something.

Horses can't cope with normal traffic therefore I don't think it's fair to take them on the roads.

Just to add that most responsible riders will also pay insurance that covers them on the road and it is a condition of that insurance to have hi viz both on rider and horse regardless of weather and light conditions.

Horses that are not traffic proof shouldn't be on the road to that I agree. What we are trying to put across is that in order to avoid an accident is to pass wide and slow. My horse doesn't bat an eye at any sort of traffic however the unplanned could always happen. Someone could turn on lawn mower for example and this could cause a horse to jump....if you're driving like a dick up the horses arse then the combination of both could then result in something happening.

Regardless of the above, it is now law to pass a horse at 10mph and I for one will thank the drivers who do so thus keeping everyone safe.

I don't think any horses are 'traffic proof'.

I could use the same argument for taking my toddler cycling down a country lane. If everyone was patient and passed wide and slow it would be fine.

Do you think toddlers should be allowed to cycle on country lanes or would that be an unnecessary risk?

@bobbiebo

I don't think any horses are 'traffic proof'.

I could use the same argument for taking my toddler cycling down a country lane. If everyone was patient and passed wide and slow it would be fine.

Do you think toddlers should be allowed to cycle on country lanes or would that be an unnecessary risk?

I do see your point re some horses not being traffic proof, but by traffic proof what we mean is a horse that’s very unlikely to spook and is usually considered safe. Yeah there’s always a small risk of spooking because ultimately animals are unpredictable, but as I said before, there’s an element of risk with cars too (skidding, driver becoming incapacitated or unwell suddenly) but unfortunately there will always be a bit of unpredictable risk with everything. Horses have as much right to be on the road as cars so if we banned them from the roads for being unpredictable then the same logic should apply to cars too.

We just have to act as safely as possible to reduce the risk as much as we can.

@bobbiebo

I don't think any horses are 'traffic proof'.

I could use the same argument for taking my toddler cycling down a country lane. If everyone was patient and passed wide and slow it would be fine.

Do you think toddlers should be allowed to cycle on country lanes or would that be an unnecessary risk?

And no, unsurprisingly I don’t think toddlers cycling on the road is a safe idea, because we have things called pavement which would be much safer for a toddler to cycle on.

When horses are allowed on pavements too please let me know, I’d be delighted to get off the road and away from the small number of inconsiderate drivers that ruin it for everyone else.

But in the meantime while horses don’t have the option to go on pavements, I’ll have to stick to the road unfortunately!

Well looks like we will have to agree to disagree.

Horses are legally allowed to be on the highway and there are laws that both the rider and vehicles must adhere too. I for one will be purchasing a body cam now in view of the ignorant assumptions I've read on here.

I wouldn't for one ride an unpredictable horse on a highway hence why I bought a horse suitable for hacking....what you choose to do with your toddler is down to your own risk assessment.

@Postivepants

Just to add that most responsible riders will also pay insurance that covers them on the road and it is a condition of that insurance to have hi viz both on rider and horse regardless of weather and light conditions.

Yeah it’s an insurance requirement that high vis should be worn when out from the yard/out hacking. Not sure about your area but in ours not enough people wear it though, I don’t understand why fellow horse riders wouldn’t want to keep themselves and their horse as safe as possible!

@bobbiebo

I see your point but driving a sensible speed for a country lane is still going to spook a horse.

Yes other drivers are a potential risk as anything can be but I don't have to slow to 5 mph every time I see one and worry about it getting scared and leaping into oncoming traffic or something.

Horses can't cope with normal traffic therefore I don't think it's fair to take them on the roads.

You seem strangely adamant that horses can't cope with being on roads. The advice is to pass at (a maximum of) 15mph with 2m distance. Driving above 20mph on the windy, narrow, single track roads around here is bloody stupid, whether horses are on them or not. Horses can very much cope with traffic driving appropriately for the conditions.

I've ridden horses down bridlepaths on the edge of roads with traffic doing 60+ beside me and they've coped just fine because they're used to traffic and they're not scared of it. I've had horses clipped with wing mirrors, revved at, squeezed off the road, sped past - I even had one guy drive his 4x4 up the arse of one horse till he literally had no choice but to sit on the bonnet. None of those incidents were caused by my horses being unpredictable and none of them elicited any significant response from the horses because they're trained and mannerly and can very much cope with being on the roads even when drivers seemingly can't cope with their presence there.

That doesn't mean that it's OK for drivers to speed past any horses or deliberately try to startle them because it's asinine and illegal and the driver can't possibly know how the horse will react - just as it's not OK to squeeze past cyclists at speed because bikes can hit pot holes / wobble into the car's path too. You shouldn't be speeding past pedestrians in the road either because it's intimidating and dangerous.

@Postivepants

Unfortunately this type of thread always brings out the idiots, just like the ones who drive past horses without a single consideration at a 100mph.

Oh and us horsey folk are not rich and entitled, some of us actually don't have a 5pm wine habit that then enables us to actually afford our hobby. Imagine a bottle of wine a day costing a tenner, well add that up over week and that's what it costs me to keep my horse on diy livery.

I just hope none of you ever end up with a horse through your windscreen through driving too close and too fast. Take a look at the new highway code rules for information.

You really think most people are spending £70pw on wine?

I always see the “not all horse riders are rich” trotted out in this threads but it’s just absolute bollocks. If your livery cost is £350+ then I imagine the actual horse cost is closer to £500 per month if not more ? Most people can’t imagine being able to spend that much money on a pet.

Yes on my yard its a rule that you have to wear hi viz and riding hat. They also have a light on a timer that once it's deemed unsafe due to it going dark to hack out you cannot leave the yard on your horse if its lit.

@LewittDee

YABU. Unless they're working horses, they're an archaic luxury that you're imposing on the rest of us. A tractor is different, they're participating in agriculture, not a hobby.

Cars shouldn't behave recklessly, However, complaining that they may "spook" your horse -- if you are putting a massive animal that spooks easily onto a public road, you're putting others in danger. Then wanting to blame others for imposing a safety hazard on the rest of us!

Unless your car is actually being used for work rather than pleasure on any given journey, it's an archaic luxury that you're imposing on the rest of us. Sheer volume of cars causes far more jams than any horse.

@LewittDee

YABU. Unless they're working horses, they're an archaic luxury that you're imposing on the rest of us. A tractor is different, they're participating in agriculture, not a hobby.

Cars shouldn't behave recklessly, However, complaining that they may "spook" your horse -- if you are putting a massive animal that spooks easily onto a public road, you're putting others in danger. Then wanting to blame others for imposing a safety hazard on the rest of us!

Unfortunately the bridleway network has been whittled down to almost nothing and even if you're lucky enough to have one near your yard, you usually have to go on the road to get there.

Well I for one was not born with a silver spoon and endless ponies growing up. Yes I choose to spend all my spare cash on my "pet" and that's my business. I go without in lots of other areas because of my "pet" and not just spending on wine but also no designer clothes, no fake nails, no fancy shoes, I don't smoke or snort anything up my nose and I along with other riders do not deserve to be driven at by arse hole drivers just because we have a bloody horse.

@LewittDee

So it's just fine to take young, inexperienced riders on a road where you can't pull to the side safely even if there's an emergency.

Again, you're creating a public safety hazard for the sake of your hobby. Really unreasonable.

Young, inexperienced drivers are on the road all of the time. How would anyone become experienced in the first place if they couldn't slap the L plates in and go out under the supervision of someone who is experienced?

@Ohbotherpiglet not a horse person here but I think the people who have horses that aren’t the typical rich horsey type just tend to go without other things in order to have their horse. I can think of loads I know that definitely aren’t rich but still keep a horse and would have that over holidays, meals out etc. It’s just prioritise. Certainly wouldn’t be my choice!!

OP I fully take on your response to my reply. I agree there’s definitely risk involved for all road users! We all need to trust that we are doing one best to be as safe as possible and that should definitely apply to car drivers as much as horse riders.

YANBU - and I’m horrified by the number of YABUs

[quote Lovinglavidaloca]**@Ohbotherpiglet* not a horse person here but I think the people who have horses that aren’t the typical* rich horsey type just tend to go without other things in order to have their horse. I can think of loads I know that definitely aren’t rich but still keep a horse and would have that over holidays, meals out etc. It’s just prioritise. Certainly wouldn’t be my choice!!

OP I fully take on your response to my reply. I agree there’s definitely risk involved for all road users! We all need to trust that we are doing one best to be as safe as possible and that should definitely apply to car drivers as much as horse riders.[/quote]
I completely agree with you, I honestly think if we were all just a bit more kind and considerate to each other then the roads would be a much safer place for both cars and horses. And that goes for fellow horse riders too as there is a minority of riders who are rude and inconsiderate, just the same as there is a minority of rude dangerous drivers. Here’s hoping one day it will be safer for everyone to be on the road

Thanks again to everyone who has said they slow down and pass wide for horses. It’s very much appreciated