To think this rebate announced today is a total con

[Viviennemary]

So this so called rebate has to be paid back. It isnt exactly a rebate then is it?

We're on an E band so will get nothing (moved in after property extended/property was rebranded). Attached next door to neighbours in a C band (they extended and never moved) who will get the rebate. So not only do they pay two bands less council tax, they get money back too now and we get zero.
Maybe the winter fuel allowance could be means tested, ie just given to those on pension credit and redistributed to those who actually need it, not just dished out simply by virtue of age.

@NettleTea

I really dont trust a system that enforces a 'loan' onto the poorest in the country, with no option to opt out, and very little details as to exactly what being indebted to them will entail. I dont trust them. I dont trust them at all. What are they going to want in exchange for their loan.

I know right.. its like an unauthorised loan being forced on everyone

How would a council tax rebate work for those getting council tax support?

Can this be legal?
Don't you have to agree to a loan?

@FlyingFlamingo

I want to opt out, I hope the energy companies give us the option to do so? I don’t want to be in debt to this bunch of self serving shysters

Same.

@MiniatureHotdog

I don't understand how this will work....I fixed last summer for 2 years. So my bills won't go up at all in April or October, so why on earth would I want £200 off my bill which I then have to pay back when my fix has ended and I'm paying more?!

They're bailing out energy companies and trying to make out they're doing consumers a favour.

Same here, I'm also on a fix, until autumn 2023, and live in a small flat with fairly low bills, so don't need or want this £200. I'd rather it went to someone who actually needs it.

I don't think I really like the £200 bill loan idea. I don't totally understand how it will work and I don't like being in debt if I can help it. Certainly not when I have no control over it in any case.

The council tax rebate is welcome though. I live alone on a small wage - but just to high to qualify for any benefits, so feel the increased cost of living acutely, but usually don't qualify for any help. For a simple broad brush approach, this seems reasonable.

I believe councils also have extra funds to distribute to those struggling, so extra help on top of the rebate, or for those in higher band properties who have a lower income etc.

I believe councils also have extra funds to distribute to those struggling, so extra help on top of the rebate, or for those in higher band properties who have a lower income etc.

Unless the funds are ring fenced for that specific purpose I wouldn’t hold my breath.

Yes this kind of funding is what my LA only make available to support those on a very, very, very low income - think FSM level.
I am band E - so As well as higher council tax / higher utilities/ NI increase etc. I do not qualify for any rebate!

The extra council funds are like old crisis loans. I just looked at my council they don’t have to be paid back but you have to have pretty good sob story ready with evidence and be willing supply all bank statements etc to back up your story. It’s feels very much like old workhouse handouts come to a panel, we will judge your story how well we think you should be coping and check bank systems to for what you may or may not have been buying. If we think it’s worthy you may get some cash when your desperate. Many will be put off by that it’s not even like social workers or Gp or teachers who know family can authorise a one off payment from the pot.

And for those people living in a HMO or split into flats where the electricity is paid by the landlord and they individually have a meter to pay the landlord back, get nothing because a) their electricity is paid by the landlord (not them) , so despite being disabled/cannot work so minimal income, they cannot claim any help or grants with heating.

cptartapp

We're on an E band so will get nothing (moved in after property extended/property was rebranded). Attached next door to neighbours in a C band (they extended and never moved) who will get the rebate. So not only do they pay two bands less council tax, they get money back too now and we get zero.

Snap - we are band E as a run down 4 bed and the house directly next are extended from 3 so 5 bed and one with a new annex but not reassessed so will get the rebate. Never have the Tories done anything for us.

If it's £200 off your bill, how will people on pre-pay meters receive that? They're usually the lowest income households too

@Mundra

If it's £200 off your bill, how will people on pre-pay meters receive that? They're usually the lowest income households too

Martin Lewis has covered this, it's not been sorted yet but will be in the form of a voucher or cheque most likely. You won't miss out on it but no idea how it would be paid back!

@Mundra

If it's £200 off your bill, how will people on pre-pay meters receive that? They're usually the lowest income households too

Sunak is probably unaware such things exist, and therefore hasn’t considered them.

@Mundra

If it's £200 off your bill, how will people on pre-pay meters receive that? They're usually the lowest income households too

I was wondering this too. When we moved in here we realised it has pre-payment meters and couldn't be bothered to change them. Likely they'll take off the repayment of the loan every time you top up. I'll pass on that thanks. Depending on how business is (I run my own business), how much I can afford to put in the meter fluctuates. I'd rather not be paying off a loan I didn't ask for.

Conservatives sell themselves to the voters as the low tax party (pardon the pun) All are a bunch of liars without a clue how to govern. We know they can't even organise a p... up in a brewery although they can every Friday in 10 Downing Street. This loan is a ridiculous idea and doesn't help anyone

@VivX

It is total rubbish. Sunak needs to use a dictionary. It is not a rebate nor a discount. It is a loan.

Absolutely correct!

@Ariela

And for those people living in a HMO or split into flats where the electricity is paid by the landlord and they individually have a meter to pay the landlord back, get nothing because a) their electricity is paid by the landlord (not them) , so despite being disabled/cannot work so minimal income, they cannot claim any help or grants with heating.

That's a very good point.

So, many of the very poorest and most vulnerable won't get desperately needed help.

I don't think it's a completely terrible idea. The basic premise, at least. But it clearly needs some tweaking.

A lot of people will find it more possible to pay off £40 in instalments rather than one big bill in one go.

And also the council tax rebate is a good idea... I think. Not if it means taking away yet more money from very cash strapped local councils. Public services will be cut even more if that's the case.

If only some of the furlough fraudsters had a moment of guilt, and decided to donate their ill-gotten gains to a cost of living fund.

@LakieLady

I'm fortunate in that I was able to fix my energy costs early and I won't see a rise till Nov 2023. My energy bills are low anyway (£80pm), because I live alone in a well insulated house .

I don't need the so-called rebate, and I certainly don't want to have the repayment added to my bills when they're likely to be rising anyway, because my fixed-rate deal will be ending. If an opt-out was possible, I'd go for it.

The council reduction is welcome though. At £120+ a month (after the single person discount), it's my biggest bill by quite some distance.

I am in the same boat. Annoying but welcome the council tax discount on my one bed flat which is £120

Essentially they're putting the entire adult population in debt by £200. Those who can afford their bills and then some likely won't notice the repayments to any great extent.

Those who already struggle to pay their bills will struggle even more when they have to pay this back. What then? They get further into debt. The credit score they might've been working on for ages goes to shit again. Then with non payment it's sent to debt collection. Then it's a CCJ or bailiffs at the door.

If that's how this pans out, the conservatives have done what they always do - made the poor, poorer.

What do you expect the government to do, pay your energy bills? The government aren't a bank, all their money is derived from the population of tax payers so if it's handed out for utility bills it won't be spent on health, social care or education.
High energy prices are a long term issue and will not be fixed by short term handouts.
It would be better to ensure people use energy more efficiently and insulate homes.
I understand keeping warm, cooking and paying bills is a big issue for everyone but it's nieve to think the government can just hand out cash ad-infinitum to see us through. This needs a much better approach to a very big long term issue.

@Tealightsandd

If only some of the furlough fraudsters had a moment of guilt, and decided to donate their ill-gotten gains to a cost of living fund.

Hmmn, I think HMRC are chasing the wrong people one of my friends works as a part time self employed cleaner due to caring/helping her mother (not disabled enough to get carer benefits) and having pre school kids. She lost all her customers in the first lockdown as they were home and did it themselves, and only managed to gain a tiny bit back around May time last year as she has fairly specific hours she can work due to her OH's job so it's been tricky to find stuff to fit in with the children, plus there's been a glut of cleaners trying to pick up additional work as so many put their cleaners off. She tried to get a job in a local shop but they were too inflexible on hours, she tried to get other jobs but didn't manage it. She's always paid a tiny amount of tax/NI - we're talking less than £500/year, so she's only just over the tax threshold, but it's money they need to run their household. So naturally she claimed 2 I think (not all) of the the offered SEISS grants to survive. However she had a letter back from HMRC saying as she hasn't traded in 20/21 she needs to pay back the SEISS grants AND moreover, she had to pay half the SEISS grant in 'tax on account' in January and pay again the same again in July - and because she paid no tax in 20/21 , she cannot ask for the amount to be reduced as she can only ask for it to be reduced if she thinks she will earn less. You can't earn less than £0. When she rang they just said because she didn't manage to earn anything, then her self employed business is considered closed, which is why she has to pay the grants back. She's had to borrow several thousand off her dad.

@saleorbouy

What do you expect the government to do, pay your energy bills? The government aren't a bank, all their money is derived from the population of tax payers so if it's handed out for utility bills it won't be spent on health, social care or education. High energy prices are a long term issue and will not be fixed by short term handouts. It would be better to ensure people use energy more efficiently and insulate homes. I understand keeping warm, cooking and paying bills is a big issue for everyone but it's nieve to think the government can just hand out cash ad-infinitum to see us through. This needs a much better approach to a very big long term issue.

A lot of people on this thread are just saying they’d rather just pay the £200 at the time rather than spread out. They aren’t saying that they want all their bills paid, literally no one has said energy should be free, just that they don’t want a compulsory loan they don’t need. Even interest free, why would I want or need a £200 loan when I could just pay the £200?