Page 9 | Boris Downfall Part 5

TomPinch · 01/02/2022 07:25

Probably because students make a lot of noise and then don't turn out to vote, comparatively speaking.

Alexandra2001 · 01/02/2022 07:26

@itsgettingweird Those that have been to Uni/College will now have to pay back tuition fee's sooner than before as Johnson sneaked out freezing the student loan threshold.

But as always, its getting people to vote that matters.

jgw1 · 01/02/2022 07:26

@TomPinch

Probably because students make a lot of noise and then don't turn out to vote, comparatively speaking.

Maybe Boris' behaviour will change that, certainly if I was standing for election I would be trying to get in to talk to the local sixth forms about the importance of voting.

jgw1 · 01/02/2022 07:27

[quote Alexandra2001]@itsgettingweird Those that have been to Uni/College will now have to pay back tuition fee's sooner than before as Johnson sneaked out freezing the student loan threshold.

But as always, its getting people to vote that matters.[/quote]
Please just call it a tax rise for that is what it effectively is.

LoudSnoringDog · 01/02/2022 07:30

He is a disgusting human being. A gaslighting, bullying sociopath.

Alexandra2001 · 01/02/2022 07:33

No, the Tories are a tax cutting party, they would never increase taxes, they introduce levies, freeze thresholds but never taxes......

Florianus · 01/02/2022 07:38

According to Adam Fleming on R4 this morning, tory MPs expressed their support for Johnson at a meeting he had with them in parliament last night - he claims that 54 MPs have NOT sent letters to the 1922 committee. How he knows that beats me - but the claim could be read in more than one way!

Apparently the MPs were convinced by the PM's promise to publish SG in full when the police investigation is finished and by statements in the SG report that "There were failures of leadership and judgment by different parts of No 10 and the Cabinet Office at different times" and that "The leadership structures [at No.10] are fragmented and complicated and this has sometimes led to the blurring of lines of accountability. Too much responsibility and expectation is placed on the senior official whose principal function is the direct support of the Prime Minister."

(Whether we should expect an apology from these senior and cabinet office officials is, I suspect, highly unlikely).

Peregrina · 01/02/2022 07:46

It's not just young people - there are lots of groups that have been angered by Johnson's behaviour and won't forget in a hurry. I was thinking of Catholics denied a Church wedding because they wanted to marry a divorcee. Now you can blame the clergy of Westminster Cathedral for allowing a twice divorced man to pretend that his other marriages weren't real marriages, but any other person wouldn't be so brazen as to even try it on. This sort of behaviour rankles, it doesn't get swept under the carpet.

littledrummergirl · 01/02/2022 07:46

Raab on bbc1 right now thinks we are all idiots. We are able to read, listen and understand. How dare he presume to tell me what conclusions I should be drawing.
Arrogant fucking insulting ...

BucketOfPlumbers · 01/02/2022 07:51

Re photos.
Interesting that they exist and that

They didn't appear before by someone leaking them, I wonder why? Many motivations to either leak or not leak, depending on your side, but wither way, hundreds of photos bot a single one leaked. I find that interesting.
that they were, however, handed over to sue, who has no 'powers' of arrest, forcing them to hand them over etc, Is this a way of getting them.out there with plausible deniabikuty, riding both sides if the fence, with no trace back to who did it? I cant articulate well so hopefully that makes sense!

Notonthestairs · 01/02/2022 07:58

Raab on LBC saying IF Sue Gray comes back with the report Johnson will publish.

IF? Why wouldn't she come back with the report.

Whatever is in that report it must be terrible because they are wriggling like mad.

ENoeuf · 01/02/2022 08:02

He’s due on R4 at ten past. Might have to switch off this is terrible for my blood pressure.

CryingAtTheDiscotheque · 01/02/2022 08:06

Reading between the lines of Raab interview : Johnson had to backtrack and undertake to his MPs to publish the “updated” SG report. So now he will be trying to find a way of preventing SG from producing said report.

If it never comes into existence there’s noth8ng to publish.

I guess the met saying they need a year to investigate forms part of this strategy too.

ClaudineClare · 01/02/2022 08:07

I had to switch Raab off. I can't stand it.

Alexandra2001 · 01/02/2022 08:08

@BucketOfPlumbers

Re photos. Interesting that they exist and that 1) They didn't appear before by someone leaking them, I wonder why? Many motivations to either leak or not leak, depending on your side, but wither way, hundreds of photos bot a single one leaked. I find that interesting. 2) that they were, however, handed over to sue, who has no 'powers' of arrest, forcing them to hand them over etc, Is this a way of getting them.out there with plausible deniabikuty, riding both sides if the fence, with no trace back to who did it? I cant articulate well so hopefully that makes sense!

The photos may be stills from security cameras or from party loyalists who when confronted by possible legal action, handed them over.

Withholding evidence or perverting the course of justice is a lot more serious than breaking a LD restriction.

As 2 MP's found out when they tried to avoid FPN's for speeding but ended up in jail.......

CryingAtTheDiscotheque · 01/02/2022 08:08

Sue Gray is 63-64 according to Wikipedia
Due to retire soon? Before the met complete investigations perhaps?

ClaudineClare · 01/02/2022 08:11

@CryingAtTheDiscotheque

Sue Gray is 63-64 according to Wikipedia Due to retire soon? Before the met complete investigations perhaps?

Retirement age is 60 for civil servants to get their full CS pension. Gray has clearly chosen to keep working. I think she will stay to see this to the end.

ENoeuf · 01/02/2022 08:15

I’m so sick of the bloody corruption. What fresh hell can we expect from the next lot with the bar set so low.

romatheroamer · 01/02/2022 08:18

One of the things this scandal has exposed is how poor some of the ministers are. Talked about Dorries already...someone called Paul Scully on Newsnight garbled, kept turning his head, just didn't make any sense at all. Then there's a terrible creep called Conor Burns who keeps popping up, talking about his friend the PM in reverential tones... a saint, our saviour...

Alexandra2001 · 01/02/2022 08:18

@CryingAtTheDiscotheque

Sue Gray is 63-64 according to Wikipedia Due to retire soon? Before the met complete investigations perhaps?

I read something the other day on SG, in which a source close to her said that the decision she had to make wasn't on the #partygate but on whether she wanted to keep her reputation intact.

So far looks like she chose her rep.

Florianus · 01/02/2022 08:20

@Peregrina

It's not just young people - there are lots of groups that have been angered by Johnson's behaviour and won't forget in a hurry. I was thinking of Catholics denied a Church wedding because they wanted to marry a divorcee. Now you can blame the clergy of Westminster Cathedral for allowing a twice divorced man to pretend that his other marriages weren't real marriages, but any other person wouldn't be so brazen as to even try it on. This sort of behaviour rankles, it doesn't get swept under the carpet.

As widely discussed at the time, the Roman Catholic church does not recognise the validity of non-Catholic marriage services.

ClaudineClare · 01/02/2022 08:26

It is clear that the Tories are cherry picking lines from the report and twisting them so that they aim the blame at civil servants and Spads. The government are a bunch of gaslighting, lying scumbags led by a sociopath. There are Certain Posters who today will be trying those same tactics. I suggest ignore, ignore, ignore.

Anyone who has ever been a civil servant knows how these sorts of reports are produced and written and how the language is very carefully crafted and deliberately restrained(unlike mine!). Bearing all that in mind, the report is damning and I can feel Sue Gray's wrath between the lines.

Notonthestairs · 01/02/2022 08:26

Raab refusing to repeat the smear against Starmer without the benefit of parliamentary privilege. "Normal cut and thrust". Dreadful interview. Absolute charlatans.

ClaudineClare · 01/02/2022 08:32

I wonder how the victims of Savile felt about that smear?

Florianus · 01/02/2022 08:34

@AdamRyan

I am disgusted he said that about Starmer and Saville. Just for lurkers www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-britain-savile-idUSL1N2RP200 So noone can call Johnson a liar in the commons, but he can make outrageous smears like that.

A lot of people think that there is just as much need to thoroughly revise parliamentary procedures as there is to revise those of No.10.

Personally, one of my greatest annoyances is the system of traipsing through the lobbies to vote, so each vote (and there is often a succession of them) take 20-30 minutes. MPs in other countries press a button and the vote is over in seconds.

Then there is the ridiculous business of MPs having to remember whether the member they are addressing is an Honorable or a Right Honorable - and if they can't recall, they have to remember the name of the MP's constituency - but don't dare address an MP by his or her name!

Then there is the farce of PMQs, which is nothing more than an opportunity for juvenile playground behaviour ...

I could go on (and on and on) but had better not.