What makes you middle class ?

[toddlerdanger]

Inspired by another thread. Just for a bit of fun.

MN is obsessed with this. Let me start- I am not originally British - so I wasn't born into this system. But I understand it somewhat. But I would like to understand what it is that makes you middle class.

Here are my thoughts, gathered from 20 plus years of living here, please correct me if I'm wrong. I don't want to offend, I find this topic fascinating, especially since reading so much about it on here:

• speaking in an RP accent, so not in a regional accent

• living in a period property or cottage ( an old house basically )

• playing board games and scrabble

• loving puns and word play

• having read all the classic books because you grew up with them and your parents showed you/ talked for you about them since you were young

• having parents who don't do manual jobs/ are entrepreneurs. Middle class parents seem to work in academia or in the corporate world in general.

• having parents who have a degree

• having parents that have been to private school

• having been to private school ( but not 100 percent necessary )

• having a degree yourself

• not driving flash cars, think more like a Volvo rather than a Porsche

• shopping at Waitrose

• not piercing your child's ears until they're in their teens

• not having too much flashy designer stuff. The odd bag is OK. But not constant flashing of designer stuff. More understated

• the Christmas lights things. Not too many colours, but more subdued. Think warm white vs ice white lights

• antiques in the home

• not into football, but more into rugby

This is all I can think of right now.

@murasaki yes perhaps I do. The wonderful middle classes getting shitfaced at no. 10 Downing Street springs instantly to mind but as long as its the 'right' wine..

Yes, I agree that there is a confidence thing in how you carry yourself which could be said to be a sense of entitlement. I think I come over as scared I'm told it's not so. Maybe that's entitlement coming through

I’m not sure I agree with the football thing. Almost everyone here is into football, working class or not.

Angels, I am as furious about that as you, and as public sector (university) worker who has had to switch things from In person to online and back again, while not being an it person, I am both sad and angry. And tired. I think we kind of agree ona bit of it.

There's another side to it, I that I feel I have let my parents down re my job. Maybe I should be better. But I shall sleep on that. Given dp was made redundant today my job, which is not bad st all, is all we have.

@Staffy1

I’m not sure I agree with the football thing. Almost everyone here is into football, working class or not.

I'm working class and I find football utterly tedious. My elderly dad is a lifelong football fan - he's a Mancunian and has supported Man City for 70 years - but it's just never interested me. My working class DH, thank goodness, would rather do a crossword than watch a football match.

I love a cryptic crossword and a footie match. Can't we all appreciate that there aren't clear boxes we fit in as we are strange humans and all that comes with that.

Just to add, my Man City supporting DF is ticking one of the OP's boxes because he has a degree; as does my mum - but getting degrees didn't mean my parents had to move into another 'class'.

My stockport County dp is judging your Df, or he would be if he hadn't gone to bed, ;-)

To be fair, he'd admire 70 years. I hope your df is keeping well.

@murasaki

My stockport County dp is judging your Df, or he would be if he hadn't gone to bed, ;-)

Oooh! Well, my mum is a Macclesfield lass, so is nearer to Stockport than Manchester, but she's similarly football-immune so passed on her love of crosswords to me,.

@murasaki

To be fair, he'd admire 70 years. I hope your df is keeping well.

He's not so bad considering he's nearly 80 - hope yours is too!

I hope he keeps well, its always good to hear of the older generation and their foibles, even if they àre City based. All good wishes to him!

@Bloodybridget

That's a funny list, I guess you don't mean people who consider themselves middle class can tick every time item? Or would just a percentage be enough? Social class is so complicated. I see myself as MC now but don't have a lot in common with most of my MC friends: Accent tinged with south London Live in Victorian terrace like millions of other Londoners Used to love Scrabble but only play online now Have read some classics, but only Austen, Brontes and a very few Dickens basically. No Russians! My mother never really read books, my father did, but didn't "introduce" me to classics. Parents were musician and dancer before I was born but then low-level civil servants, my DM did childminding when I was little. They both left school at 14. I went to state schools and I don't have a degree. Our car is a 12yo Ford Focus and we shop at Sainsbury's mostly I don't have children but if I did, I wouldn't have been at all keen on piercing before teenage at the earliest. Have never had designer anything. Multicoloured Christmas lights every time! Don't think we have any antique furniture, DP brought some old brown stuff to the house which I don't like. No interest in football or rugby.

I would describe you as working class. But close to the border

My dad , a mere 74, bemoans the ďays the fifties when ýou could bundle the keeper in to the net with the ball.

@murasaki

I hope he keeps well, its always good to hear of the older generation and their foibles, even if they àre City based. All good wishes to him!

Thank you . He was a loyal supporter all through the years when they were in a low division, so it's nice that he can enjoy them being in the top division in his twilight years

Yes, that's lovely for him.

Does it matter?

Are you in need of placement for a comedy sketch?

@blyn72

I thought most people played board games, including scrabble.

Well you would be wrong.

@ConsiderablyRicherThanYow

It's not hard to understand at all. If you need a wage or salary to survive you are working class. The clue is in the name. You are middle class if you don't need your wage or salary to survive. As in, you own property, land or businesses, you have substantial savings, investments or inheritance you can access. The vast majority of people that call themselves middle class are just working class on a higher salary.

The behaviours and purchases don't mean very much.

That's not middle class, it's upper class.

I guess I was born into it.

YABVU it's not fun and how many times can this question asked?!

I think it's a self definition thing. If you think you are middle class you probably are. If you think you are working class you probably are.

I'm not sure it matters.

I think I agree with the shower before/ after work comment - at least in that it's partly a type of job thing. If you are a lawyer/ teacher/ university professor: accountant/ executive, then you are probably middle class. Unless you grew up a different class and still feel that it defines you.

Fwiw I am definitely middle class and enjoyed living in a new build for 9 years.

Class in the UK is built on establishing a full picture of a person and thet full picture amalgamated together rather than a single rule.

For example

Swearing - screaming swear words in a street, using c..t using swearing in a cras way or at your children or at a stranger would be considered working class. However, a posh accent said in known company and it being f..k that is used could be an upper or middle class person.

Wealth - having zero money and renting a house on an estate would be working class. Having zero money however owning an estate would be upper.

Class is nuanced in the UK, as with everything else we are tricky.

Working class- low skilled job, labour trade workers
Middle class- degree worth professions
Upper middle class- degree worth professions that earn much more than MC such as company directors, doctors etc with 6 or 7 figure salaries and more
Upper class- no need to work due to investments in businesses or own plenty of land/properties and still don't need to work, just need to show a presence every now and then.

You can perhaps come from a working class background but financially live a life like Upper Middle Class by simply having a successful roofing business but it's how you carry yourself, the way you experience life which can determine your class. Also growing up, if you live a life where you can make choices to get a education or pursue a adventurous career path or if everything fails, you still have a safety net to fall on provided by your parents for you to start all over again would catergorise you as mc.

My parents were working class and had to get a job as soon they were able to however, they have provided me the safety net I was going on about in terms of pursuing my interest and encouraging me to get a degree and paying for my masters. I'm currently married to a man who comes from a mc family but both us live a life like the upper middle class due to our salaries. So what class are we technically?