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Original poster

Was I in the wrong regarding overtime situation? Don't like what the staff tried to do

121 replies

Donthaveagoodusername · 14/01/2022 17:24

I'm employed by an agency and currently on a long term placement at a nursery. My shifts are 8-5, or 9-6, but usually 8-5.

According to staff here, pretty much nobody leaves on time as it has to be based on staffing numbers for children, I get it but it's not fair on the staff. People are on the rota to finish at 4 but end up staying until 6:30 a lot of the time, and they are paid £8.91 an hour. I don't really know why they put up with it but it's easy for me to say.

I don't mind doing it on the very odd occasion if staff go home sick or whatever but I'm not prepared to do it on a regular basis. 10 minutes is one thing, not 2 hours.

The other night I stayed an extra 30 minutes for them. I also have another part time evening job which I have to get to and that night I did.

So today I was on 8-5 and I told them this at 8am (the nursery staff in my room). So they knew the staffing situation from 8am.

They must have been talking about me as one of them asked 'so what's your other job?' even though she wasn't there when I had told them about it.

Today about 2pm one girl said (yes I call them girls as some are 17-19 years old) 'Oh btw do you have to get to your 2nd job tonight?' I said no how come, do you need me to stay later? And she said 'no no just wondered'. Hmmm.

Anyway I'd heard one was on until 6:30, the other 2 until 4:30 but the 17 year old cannot stay late due to being underage.

So the other girl makes comments like 'ooh well I'm supposed to go at 4:30 but I might have to stay until 6'.

Nobody at any point has asked me to stay later. Then it gets to 4:25 and the girl says 'oh we only have 8 kids so I can go now, have a great weekend guys!' I realize it would just be 2 of us until 6:30 even though I'm meant to be on until 5.

So I say 'sorry but I cannot stay past 5, I haven't been asked and it's too short notice, I have got plans'.
Then the girl says it's fine, yet I see her and the other one give each other that pissed off sort of glance.

So I figured they were just planning to let me stay 1h30 extra without even asking or telling me at all. Just assuming I will do it probably as I'm agency and I'm quiet. I'm not putting a stranger first, especially one who does that to me. I don't force her to do overtime.
I think I was assertive and hopefully did the right thing? If someone had asked me earlier on and been honest that's different, but they said nothing.

OP posts:
Flowers500 · 14/01/2022 17:43

@vodkaredbullgirl

So you not happy in either of the jobs your agency give you.
Yeah you're right, OP should be THRILLED to be on last minute hours that prevent her having a life and that they're possibly not paying her for Hmm why not send those toddlers up the chimneys too while she's at it! Bring back the days when a crust of bread a week was called 'minimum wage'!
gettingolderandgrumpy · 14/01/2022 17:45

@Donthaveagoodusername

On an hourly rate yes, higher than theirs but because my umbrella company takes so many fees out I end up with minimum wage net salary

It was the sneakiness all day 'soo what's your other job?'

'soo do you have your other job Tonight, just wondering?'

It’s nothing to do with them what you do after work , honestly speak to your manager about this arrangement what’s the point of setting shifts if your needed longer . Is this a cf way of managers not paying for longer even though the children are there past 6pm ? .
goawaystormy · 14/01/2022 17:48

I don't force her to do overtime.

Except you literally did. By refusing to stay past your 5 finish you forced her to stay 2 hours after her 4:30 finish. And no one was being sneaky, you're reading into what is essentially work small talk far too much. Why are you entitled to leave at your scheduled finish time more than her? She could've literally walked out at 4:30 because her shift was done and at that time all ratios were accounted for (which is exactly what you did at 5)

Your anger is massively misplaced here. This needs to be approached with management of the nursery and your agency. Rather than being angry at these women (not girls because you said in your OP that the underage girl couldn't stay late so the people you're talking about are women) talk to them about how it's unfair on you all, you're going to talk to your agency and they need to talk to their management, because both employers have to be dealt with for this to be remedied.

Zombiemum1946 · 14/01/2022 17:48

Keep a time sheet and make sure the agency clarify that you're being paid for the extra hours. The other girls maybe assuming that because you're agency you're getting paid more than them, and making excuses for leaving on time. None of this is your fault. I certainly wouldn't volunteer for extra without being asked, paid or getting time back. This is on management and the other staff need to sort this for themselves. You have a life outside of work.

ldontWanna · 14/01/2022 17:51

It sounds like a really shit place to work in. I wouldn't blame the other staff as they obviously feel the same way you do and have the same issues. The problem is management and I presume their cost cutting practices.

I'd have a chat with your agency and explain the situation and see what they say. Definitely put in the extra hours you worked as well and the agency should invoice them accordingly. They'd definitely take notice of that.

JDaytona · 14/01/2022 17:54

You need to speak to your agency and the nursery manager.

Don't get shirty with the young girls, it's not their fault.

CatRatSplat · 14/01/2022 17:55

Yes it wasn't nice it was assumed you would stay. You need to talk to the nursery manager and get the facts on pay / hrs from there. You need to talk to your agency on pay / hrs from them. You really should try and find a non umbrella pay scheme, they take complete advantage of you (from personal experience). Work out what you want to do and possibly take to cab / ACAS on what is permissible.

The underhanded way isn't really your probably sadly, its the whole staff being taken advantage of and you need to protect / arm yourself.

SchrodingersUnicorn · 14/01/2022 17:56

But the other girl wasn't a manager was she? And it sounded like she was rota'd to stay until 4.30, so she was perfectly within her rights to leave then, as much as you would be in your rights to leave at 5.
The problem is the manager not rota'ing enough staff - there should never be less than two so this is entirely on them, not your colleague.
If she was rota'd to stay until 6, she was being unfair. If she wasn't, she has as much right as you to refuse to stay.

Foolsrule · 14/01/2022 17:57

@goawaystormy - she didn’t force anyone. The other staff members could have also refused and then the manager would have had to step in.

1smallhamsterfoot · 14/01/2022 17:58

You all need to start just leaving. Management get paid to come in and cover if they haven’t rota-Ed enough staff in. I’d be out that door spot on.

Getyourjinglebellsinarow · 14/01/2022 18:03

It's not your colleagues that are the problem it's management not planning for having enough staff for the kids. Are the hoping a few parents get off work early every day to reduce the numbers of kids? Ridiculous.

MilduraS · 14/01/2022 18:03

Are you not completing timesheet? When I worked for an agency I had to complete a time sheet every week. I put my exact hours down and any breaks so they would have paid for any overtime.

Original poster
Donthaveagoodusername · 14/01/2022 18:05

Yes agreed it's not entirely them but still they knew I'd have to stay and didn't even ask or check if it was ok

OP posts:
BendingSpoons · 14/01/2022 18:10

Did you check they were able to stay late? It goes both ways and maybe they were frustrated you always leave meaning they have to stay. It doesn't make it OK in the manager's behalf, but it's not necessarily the other workers being sneaky. They have as much right to finish on time as you do.

goawaystormy · 14/01/2022 18:10

But you didn't ask or check with 4:30 woman either! You just assumed she would do 2 hours overtime! There was no communication any direction - you're all as bad as each other. How can you not see it's exactly the same thing!

But none of you are as bad as the management!

Stop being angry at the other staff and 4:30 woman for doing exactly the same as you (leave at the end of her shift, damn to anyone else, with 0 communication among staff). And be angry and the people forcing you into this position in the first place.

Original poster
Donthaveagoodusername · 14/01/2022 18:11

It's my agency that deals with timesheets, at the nursery you write down your 'overtime' on the signing in sheet next to your name for each day, just seems like it could easy get missed or mixed up

OP posts:
Original poster
Donthaveagoodusername · 14/01/2022 18:12

I did check, I asked at 1pm, do you need me to stay later? And they said no.

OP posts:
1smallhamsterfoot · 14/01/2022 18:12

Why would none of you mention this to your boss???

Original poster
Donthaveagoodusername · 14/01/2022 18:13

I stayed later the other night and I've only been there 8 days so far, been in other rooms too so not always with them. But I agree it's the manager who's mainly at fault, I don't think anyone should have to sgay

OP posts:
Original poster
Donthaveagoodusername · 14/01/2022 18:13

I'm sure the boss is fully aware of it if she takes one look at the signing in sheet

OP posts:
goawaystormy · 14/01/2022 18:16

@Donthaveagoodusername

I did check, I asked at 1pm, do you need me to stay later? And they said no.
Well that's a drip feed and a half!

And you shouldn't be asking them. They're not your manager or boss, it's not on them to figure out who might need to stay late when. They're equal to you - you need to all work it out between yourselves (I see only on persons on till 6:30 but realistically we're gonna need 2 people to stay till then, who can/wants to stay late) not accuse them of being sneaky like they're all scheduling behind your back.

Blueeilidh · 14/01/2022 18:17

Maybe I'm missing something here but it doesn't sound like the fault of the girls you were talking about. The responsibility was with the manager. Why should they stay if they were supposed to leave at half four?

BobLemon · 14/01/2022 18:18

You’re not wrong that overtime that’s just scribbled down on a piece of paper would likely get lost!

I’ve been agency and discovered at one job that a rumour was circulating that I got £12/hour. Did I fuck. They were correct that I was being charged to the employer at £12/hr, but my pay was no different to theirs after the agency cut. It was only through getting close to someone I discovered this. No wonder there had been an atmosphere.

Your overtime will be much more expensive to the management as well I’m sure! I take it no mangers were in when a colleague tried to nominate you for overtime?

Do you have a good relationship with your agency? Mine were lovely and if I had a problem (I wasn’t being given notice before asked to do overtime, I was being expected to do a carshare with someone, etc etc) I’d call my agency and they’d smooth whatever it was.

BlueStripedTowel · 14/01/2022 18:21

I think i'd be very worried sending my child there!

goawaystormy · 14/01/2022 18:22

This 4:30 woman was actually very accommodating to you.

At 4:30 she could've left, her shift was done and ratios were fine so she was well within her rights to leave. Even if you'd said 'hold on I'm leaving at 5, there won't be enough people' she would actually be well within her rights to go 'sounds like a 5 o'clock problem' and walk out. Then when it got to 5 you'd have to make the choice to either leave, leaving not enough staff to child ratio and possibly get reprimanded for it (as I'm sure all childcare places consider keeping ratios correct as an extenuating circumstance where staff have to stay and would be deemed irresponsible early years practitioners if they didn't), or stay and do the overtime.

This is 100% a management problem. She was actually very accommodating to you staying at that point, she facilitated you being able to leave on time by her staying. No one needed to facilitate her leaving because at that point in time everything was fine for her to leave, and as she's not management, thinking ahead and planning isn't her job.