Should he stay with his elderly mother?

[badspella]

I am caught between two very strong sets of opinions with respect to a situation relating to the care of my elderly mother in law.

MIL is 89 and has the early stages of dementia. She is not poorly enough to need daily care, but my husband (her son) pops in to see her every day, and her husband (husband's stepfather) receives daily care for chronic mobility problems (help getting up and dressed etc). The carers also check on MIL.

My husband's stepfather had a nasty fall yesterday and he has broken his hip. He is now in hospital and will almost certainly need an operation. It is estimated that he will be in hospital for about two weeks, if no complications set in. It is also likely that complications will set in because the poor man has had several episodes of sepsis over the past five years.

MIL would like my husband to stay with her until her husband returns home. She lives in a very rural setting, and, although she is quite healthy, she is 89, walks with a stick and there is a risk of her falling. She is very afraid of being on her own, particularly at night,

My husband and I do not live together and he has no work commitments. My husband is adamant that he cannot stay with his mother. He states that they do not really get on and that his mother constantly follows him and asks him repetitive questions. He stayed with her for a few days when his stepfather was in hospital last year, and it ended with my husband leaving abruptly (to put it mildly) and upsetting his mother. He will, however see her every day.

Yesterday, my MIL called me and pleaded with me to try to persuade my husband to stay with her. She did sound quite upset. I talked to her and told her I would speak to my husband, and that he would see her every day whatever the case. My husband, however, is vehemently opposed to staying with his mother, even for a short time.

I would stay, if it was possible. However, I am the sole carer for our young adult son who is in MH crisis, I do not drive, and I could not work from my MIL's property (no Internet). Furthermore, it is my husband whom she wants to stay. We get on well, and speak every day on the phone, but she wants her son to stay.

On one hand, I feel that as long as my husband sees his mother every day, and her care needs are met, there should be no problem, and this would be better than my husband losing his temper or storming off.

On the other hand, I feel really sorry for his mother, who is very old, very worried about her husband and very scared.

What should I do in this situation? I really feel for my MIL, but I am aware of what happened last year.

"I am puzzled as to what his role is in life as well. Does he have mental health issues?"

Because we were only put on earth to work or parent and if you don't do either you're mentally ill

Sorry OP not related to your problem but just mind boggling some of the rubbish posted on here.

Killjoys I boggled at that one too!

Loving s the people who think you can just phone upan agency or 2 and book care just like that. Believe me, unless you are very lucky, it doesn't work like that right now. It's get a list from social services. Phone round to be told "sorry, no capacity, fully booked" by all of them. Google to see if there is anyone not on the list. Try Facebook for recommendations. Go through the list again with the same result. On repeat. Same eighcate home places. Even the NHS and councils are struggling.
I can't say it often enough. If you have elderly parents planning for all eventualities and plan early. Get care in place before it's critical. If you wait for a situation like this you are stuffed. And pray that you have parents who understand because most resist until it's a crisis. Speaking as the daughter/DIL of 4 between 83 and 94 all with major issues and the owner of several crisis tshirts.

A lot of self-righteousness on this thread...

Looking after an elderly person with dementia, especially 24 hours a day, is not an easy task. If someone has stated they are unable to do it, for whatever reason, then this should be respected and there is no point of trying to force or guilt trip them into it.

It would be unsafe anyway for the elderly person to be cared for by someone who have stated they won't be able to deliver what is needed for a sustainable period.

We also know nothing about the relationship between then and it is unlikely that someone will want to care for a relative they don't get on with/don't have affection for.

Instead what needs to be done is look at what practical alternatives are available and involve social services now that it is clear there are no other options.

It sounds like in this situation it is simply no longer possible for the person to remain at home and live independently.

Of course this is not what his mother will want to hear but there also needs to some realistic assessment done rather than just thinking that another person should simply just give up their own life and independence for theirs....

Don't do anything further. It's for them to sort out. I'm questioning what their relationship was like growing up. I have a strained relationship with my mother due to lots of crap/trauma when I was growing up. For that reason I really doubt I'd be prepared to suddenly drop everything to care for her full time if I was faced with a similar situation regardless of whether I actually could. Visiting on his terms seems reasonable. If it's not enough care then he'll need to look into alternatives.

@badspella

Are you coming back OP?

Thank you everyone for the responses. I think the range of responses does reflect the complexity of the situation.

I will just provide a little more context. My husband is 62 and we do not live together because he has additional needs, and he could not cope with our sons' additional needs. Our eldest son is now happily living in supported accommodation, and our youngest lives with me. They are both young adults.

On reflection, and after reading many of the posts on the thread, I really think that the main issue is that MIL will not accept formal support from anyone but my husband. We have contacted Adult Social Services and Age Concern in the past and MIL has refused the services. She has turned away a visit from the fire service who would arrange a free safety check, and she even refuses help such as attendance allowance and a reduction in council tax due to her husband not being able to use the upstairs bedroom.

As I stated, I have real sympathy for her, and there is a part of me that believes my husband should stay with her for a couple of weeks. However, as others have said, this is a situation that is not going to resolve itself, and care needs are likely to escalate.

My own mother is 93 and broke her hip last year. She lives on a farm with my brother (who is her primary carer). Her dementia is a little more advanced than my MIL's. Yet, she is willing to accept whatever care is available and I believe this is what we enable her to live in her own home. My brother could not care for her on his own.

I think perhaps we could use this situation as a way of helping MIL and her husband to think about supported living somewhere closer to amenities.

Thanks for coming back OP the scenario sounds all too familiar. With your DHs additional needs in the mix as well he probably needs to stand back and call social services. If he stays this time she will continue to reject suitable help.

On one hand, I feel that as long as my husband sees his mother every day, and her care needs are met, there should be no problem, and this would be better than my husband losing his temper or storming off.

If she feels or is unsafe/anxiety at being left overnight and there's dementia present then her care needs are not going to be met unless someone suitable is with her over night.
She has had support from carers up until now, even if that support wasn't official and wasn't technically supposed to be happening, it has been. She also had someone there overnight which isn't happening now. Therefore her care needs are unmet because of the change in circumstances.
If DH is unable or unwilling to provide the care she needs then he needs to arrange someone else to do it, or he'll be dealing with the concequences of that should they happen.
Unfortunately arranging care, as others have said, isn't easy, even if you're self funded, because of the shortage of workers to actually deliver the care.
I don't think though, that any of this is your issue to deal with, though I appreciate that you probably feel some responsibility/duty of care to your MIL. All I could suggest is that if DH doesn't take steps to address her care needs and you feel you need to, you contact SS yourself and explain that you're concerned for MILs welfare and why.

My MIL only wanted her DS to look after her and she also rejected professional help. My DH really struggled to give her the support she needed. He's not a natural carer, he's never had a great relationship with his mother and she become more demanding and more unreasonable. Family members judged him for not doing more and even had a go at me for not looking after her. As I said, she only wanted her DS, who she felt she could order about as required. Any input from me was met with a lot of hostility. My DH used to come home from seeing her, very upset. When I told the family members how upset he would get, their response was to tell me that my MIL also got upset. So it really wasn't working.

Withdrawing help was what really sorted things out. Without any sort of help MIL couldn't cope, which is when the District Nurse had her admitted. This was such a relief for us all.

The situation you outline @badspella, sounds impossible. My heart goes out to you and your family. We've been through it and we know how difficult it is, to do the "right thing" for elderly relatives, whilst remaining sane yourselves.

I think perhaps we could use this situation as a way of helping MIL and her husband to think about supported living somewhere closer to amenities

From what you say, things are well beyond that point. I doubt any supported living would accept them. They need residential care. Your Mil’s refusal of support is an excellent illustration of the importance of setting up powers of attorney when people still have capacity. She’d be getting attendance allowance and a council tax reduction then.

Huntswoman "Withdrawing help was what really sorted things out."

Sadly this does not surprise me.

Your MIL may need some time for the reality of her situation to sink in. Does she have an emergency alarm? I guess she's alone at night now.

I really feel for you. It's important that you don't do too much else you'll break under the weight of it.

@Blossomtoes

I think perhaps we could use this situation as a way of helping MIL and her husband to think about supported living somewhere closer to amenities

From what you say, things are well beyond that point. I doubt any supported living would accept them. They need residential care. Your Mil’s refusal of support is an excellent illustration of the importance of setting up powers of attorney when people still have capacity. She’d be getting attendance allowance and a council tax reduction then.

Power of Attorney was discussed with my MIL. She said that hell would freeze over before she would sign anything of the sort.

Until you have a very difficult elderly relative to care for, it's very impossible to understand what it's like. My MIL wasn't any easy woman at any time but towards the end of her life she became a nightmare.

Until you have a very difficult elderly relative to care for, it's very impossible to understand what it's like

I completely agree but even my very difficult 99 year old dad had the common sense to agree to powers of attorney for him and my mum. Particularly since it was their trusted solicitor who told him he’d be mad not to.

We got POA in the nick of time as my mum resisted so long. It was dad's declining health that convinced her but her dementia that made it necessary. Another couple of months and it would have been too late. I was fighting that battle for years. Sadly ILs resisted until it was too late for MIL.

Sadly @badspella I think you are coming to the time when you (well your husband and his family) will need to start thinking of more long term care arrangements for his parents . It is probably unlikely that your FIL is going to be able to fulfil the role of carer again for your MIL.

I really sympathise with you all, early dementia is difficult when the person who has it is not able to recognise their limitations . What is the family financial situation like in terms of your PIL being able to afford additional carer support to keep them at home?

My own parents were in a similar situation whereby my father acted as 'carer' to my mother in the early times of her dementia. It was his hospitalisation that precipitated us having to increase professional care . I stayed with my mum whilst dad was in hospital for the first couple of weeks , but there comes a time when you have to realise that what was intended as a stop gap can't be long term.

We were lucky in that I already had financial POA and my parents had savings. I arranged a live in carer which enabled them to remain at home for a further 6 months . I know staying in the home was what they wanted and I was glad they were able to do this, but after they eventually moved into residential care, I would acknowledge so many good things about the care home that would probably have benefited my parents had they been willing to move earlier.

Given your update on your DHs own issues I think it would likely be madness and cause a lot more issues for him to go and live with her for 2 weeks or more.

Have the hospital said his SD will actually come home? My grandfather in a similar position was told he could not return home as my grandmother could not deal with him if he fell. He went from hospital to a residential home.. my grandmother moved in with us whilst he was in hospital but refused to go with him into the home. My mother then returned her home as we could no longer cope with her (she also had dementia) and had to 'prove' to her that she could not cope before she gave in and joined him in the home - for which she blamed my mother for.

My mother has now started the 'don't you dare put me in a home' nonsense and has been told with no hesitation that I would as I could not care for her as she proved when we had my gran at home.... caring for relatives is hard work!

It's quite common for people in this situation to not want "strangers" coming to the house to provide care. My late MIL was like this. She grudgingly accepted it as we lived 150 miles away, and SIL wasn't able to provide the 3 times daily care that MIL needed.

No he shouldn't. And surely pre dementia and with a rational and unselfish mind, she wouldn't expect this of him!? What were their plans for coping with day to day living as a frail elderly couple choosing to live in a rural location?
Time for social services to step in, or as they've probably 'scrimped and saved all their lives', now's the time to spend the rainy day money on buying in or sourcing residential care.