Neighbour’s aggressive dogs

[Tsc2011]

Hi, I wondered if anyone had any advice.

We own a small field at the back of our house which our children (4 and 6) use to play in. It’s alongside a neighbour’s field which also runs along the back of our garden so we’re pretty much surrounded by his land. We got on really well with him (although the constant peering in to our back garden was getting quite annoying) but then in lockdown he got two German shepherd puppies.
They’re not socialised and he disciplined them by hitting them and pulling their tails (awful to see). It’s resulted in the dogs being VERY aggressive!
Whenever we go out on to our land they go crazy, running at the 4ft stock fence, barking and growling. They track our girls as if hunting them and they stick their heads through the wire on to our land trying to bite us. It’s terrifying.
He reassured us he was going to get behaviour training for them and get them neutered but he’s since said that the vet refused to neuter them because they were too aggressive to have in the vets!
He’s said he likes them aggressive so he’s not going to do anything about it.
They’ve bitten him twice to the point he’s needed stitches and they bit my partner really badly, breaking the skin and causing swelling and bruising.
Since then someone (not us) has contacted the police about them. He’s decided it must have been us so he’s being very hostile with us now.
He admitted to the police he should have done something about their behaviour and he said they’re now jumping our fence. He told the police he’d replace the fence with something bigger but has since told us he won’t and we have to do it (the quote was £10,000!!).
We’re now not sure what to do. Does anyone know if thick hedging would keep them out (gorse/ hawthorn etc). The 4ft stock fence has to stay (he won’t let us replace it) so the hedge (would eventually grow to around 2m) would be in front of that.
Any advice about fences/hedging and how to deal with our terrible neighbour welcome!

OP do you have a dog warden (we no longer do in our area, sadly)? They can be more effective than the police, or might get someone in the police to listen. You could also see if there is a local councillor who has contacts in the police.

Also do you know what vet said they wouldn't' deal with the dogs? They might also be prepared to talk to the police.

Could you make an appointment with the Police and Crime Commissioner? Here is the North Yorkshire one: www.northyorkshire-pfcc.gov.uk/how-can-we-help/commissioner/

You could ask her why the police are refusing to act on a complaint of dogs dangerously out of control on private property when it was 2013 that the law was changed.

www.gov.uk/government/news/dangerous-dogs-law-changes-cover-attacks-on-private-property

Unfortunately we don’t have a dog warden so we have to rely on the police.

I’ve just spoken to my MP’s office who are going to call the Chief of Police and Environmental Health to ask what they’re doing about it.

I’m starting to think a fence/hedge/any barrier won’t be enough and we’ll have to deal with it by nagging the police.

In response to an earlier comment, we’re already very alarmed. I’ve lost many nights sleep over this going through the potential horrific scenarios.

Keep going OP. It sounds horrible and I appreciate the situation isn't as black and white as it can appear to people here.

Keep your kids inside until this is sorted.

Report to the police over and over. Do you have any photos of the bite?

This is terrifying. I feel sorry that he has made the dogs this way, however I'd have no compunction about pushing to get them put down if they were posing a threat to my family.

Jeez, I hate irresponsible dog owners. Those dogs need removing before they kill a child. And when they do it's always excuse after excuse. Report him to the police and RSPCA again and video their awful behaviour.

Put electric deer fencing beside the fence.

www.electric-fence.co.uk/voss-farming-deer-fence-with-tape-50m-12v-mains.html

Costs about £200

Apologies but which solicitors did you speak to?

@LittleMissTake

Put electric deer fencing beside the fence.

www.electric-fence.co.uk/voss-farming-deer-fence-with-tape-50m-12v-mains.html

Costs about £200

I wouldn't trust any fencing that has not been specifically designed with dangerous dogs in mind, it could give you an entirely false sense of security.

I spoke to Cooper & Co Solicitors (Dogs Law) who a couple of people on here recommended.

you are not taking this seriously enough... they bit your DH - they WILL savage your kids.

report them and keep reporting them, they are dangerously out of control - who is next?!

Where did they bite your dh? they should be reported

High chain-link fence should be a great deal cheaper?

@GettingItOutThere

you are not taking this seriously enough... they bit your DH - they WILL savage your kids.

report them and keep reporting them, they are dangerously out of control - who is next?!

Where did they bite your dh? they should be reported

Absolutely this; if they managed to get free, which really wouldn't be that difficult, they would potentially kill your kids. Awful awful man your neighbour is. Keep pushing and don't give up.

Don't rely on electric fencing. While it works for some animals, I've had horses, dogs, cows and sheep that don't give a fuck and will run though it, roll over it, jump it or in some cases just push straight through it not caring about the shock. A dog in an excited/aggressive state that can jump a 7ft wall won't pay a blind bit of notice. My lurchers would get through hedges, electric fences and over walls. While these things MIGHT keep the dogs out you will never be able to rely on them not figuring out a way to get through. Digging under won't even take long and with an owner that slack I wouldn't trust him to keep an eye on what they were doing. You will always be on edge while outside. You need to keep reporting and get any other neighbours to do the same. You need to make it difficult for him to keep the dogs. I do feel for you, it's a shit position to be in.

@Tsc2011

Thanks for your comments. Unfortunately, the police response has been that because they’re on private land (albeit their heads aren’t!), there’s nothing they can do. The law actually says that it’s an offence if a dog makes someone feel threatened but they’re disputing that with us and said it’s unenforceable - they’ve been utterly useless!

Umm they've bitten your partner! So surely you have proof they're dangerous Why haven't you reported it?

@MorningStarling

I looked up poisoning, apparently the maximum you can get for poisoning a dog is six months. Not sure whether it would be doubled for killing two dogs? Either way that's the maximum sentence not the starting point. Shouldn't really have to come to doing that but realistically the owner won't do anything and the law won't do anything until the dog seriously maims someone or worse.

Well, if we're going down the start-raving-bonkers route, I'd be more inclined to er, treat the cause, not the symptom, if you catch my drift.

Granted, the stakes are a bit higher in terms of possible jail term, but if you poison the GSDs, he'll probably just replace them with a pair of Rottweilers.

The police are right that a report of the dogs threatening someone won't be enough, there has to be reasonable fear of injury and dogs behind a fence with no evidence that the dogs can get out of that fence, isn't reasonable.

Proof that the dogs can get through/over/under that fence WOULD make the 'fear of injury/feeling threatened' aspect reasonable so get that proof.

There is fencing that would do it - deer fencing to 6ft, hedge in front to stop dogs seeing through/stop kids poking fingers through - but that really should be the owners cost to bear, not yours.

Unfortunately you may well have to take it all the way to court and have the courts impose a control order which very much CAN include insisting he puts up a fence, what type of fence etc etc, and if he doesn't he could see the dogs seized and destroyed (there are other consequences leading up to that of course).

You really should have reported the bite, can you do so now?

People on here saying about contacting the police, dog warden, rspca etc because they are out of control have never dealt with this and though not their fault don't realize how few and far between it is that anything is done about dangerous dogs even after they have bitten or even fully attacked someone.

I do because my neighbors have 2 pit bull type dogs. Even though they are a banned breed here, have attacked a man causing him to need surgery because of a prolonged 10 minute attacked where the dogs wanted to kill, they have tried to attack my toddler by breaking down our fence 3 ! times, they are locked up over 14 hours a day in a room with no daylight then shoved out in the garden which is full of dangerous debris the rest of the time...they have still be allowed to be kept and nothing has been done. This even went to court because of the attack on the man (a passing stranger) and nothing came of it. His injuries were horrific.
There are two other dogs near me who have attacked numerous dogs and consequently their owners trying to protect their pet and nothing has or will be done.

Nothing happens to dangerous dogs unless they actually kill someone.

I have stopped using my garden as its too risky. Il have to wait till the dogs die or I move. I can't let my children out.

My advise to you op is to move or stay inside, these are your only two options. Nothibg will happen by you reporting this.

www.rspca.org.uk/getinvolved/campaign/bsl/dda

From the RSPCA website - includes incidents on private land since 1991. I would get a second opinion, maybe from a recognised dog trainer or vet to back you up that these dogs are dangerous and this is not some neighbour dispute (which the police may be thinking this is).

The Act includes incidents on private property
Since 1991 it has been illegal for dogs to be 'out of control in a public place'. In 2014 the law was amended to include incidents on private property - so inside your home and others' homes, including front and back gardens.
Your dog is considered dangerously out of control if it:
Injures someone
Makes someone worried that it might injure them

we have a very secure fence around our land to keep wildlife out. concrete post and small chain link.

if you can imagine, it is designed in a backwards Z shape.

the bottom of it, which is pegged to the ground, is about 2 ft long which prevents digging under

then you have the height, ours is about 5ft

then the top of it is curved towards your neighbours so whatever tries to climb it can't get a leg hold on it, you might find them listed under otter fencing on google. I'll try and post a picture of ours later.

he's since said that the vet refused to neuter them because they were too aggressive to have in the vets!

That sounds like an absolute load of cobblers to me. Vets have ways and means of dealing with aggressive animals.

@Arren12 that's an horrific account and shows why we have so many tragic deaths and injuries caused by dangerous dogs. The law needs to change!

@UnexpectedItemInShaggingArea yep its awful. The man they attacked was just minding his own business walking past and they broke out and their rubbish owners could not get them off. The poor guy eventually gave up fighting and told me he resigned himself to death. The injuries he sustained were so bad he will be scared for life. If it was a child or even smaller weaker person there is no doubt they would be dead. The dogs are in kill mode day in day out. Even before the attack i had reported them trying to get my toddler in our own garden. The police even told me its unlikely anything will get done and even after the attack they are still not pts and kept in exactly the same way.

Its not a one off either. The law does nothing in dangerous dog cases.