Neighbour’s aggressive dogs

[Tsc2011]

Hi, I wondered if anyone had any advice.

We own a small field at the back of our house which our children (4 and 6) use to play in. It’s alongside a neighbour’s field which also runs along the back of our garden so we’re pretty much surrounded by his land. We got on really well with him (although the constant peering in to our back garden was getting quite annoying) but then in lockdown he got two German shepherd puppies.
They’re not socialised and he disciplined them by hitting them and pulling their tails (awful to see). It’s resulted in the dogs being VERY aggressive!
Whenever we go out on to our land they go crazy, running at the 4ft stock fence, barking and growling. They track our girls as if hunting them and they stick their heads through the wire on to our land trying to bite us. It’s terrifying.
He reassured us he was going to get behaviour training for them and get them neutered but he’s since said that the vet refused to neuter them because they were too aggressive to have in the vets!
He’s said he likes them aggressive so he’s not going to do anything about it.
They’ve bitten him twice to the point he’s needed stitches and they bit my partner really badly, breaking the skin and causing swelling and bruising.
Since then someone (not us) has contacted the police about them. He’s decided it must have been us so he’s being very hostile with us now.
He admitted to the police he should have done something about their behaviour and he said they’re now jumping our fence. He told the police he’d replace the fence with something bigger but has since told us he won’t and we have to do it (the quote was £10,000!!).
We’re now not sure what to do. Does anyone know if thick hedging would keep them out (gorse/ hawthorn etc). The 4ft stock fence has to stay (he won’t let us replace it) so the hedge (would eventually grow to around 2m) would be in front of that.
Any advice about fences/hedging and how to deal with our terrible neighbour welcome!

Go back to the police to report them as dangerous dogs. As above, you only need to feel threatened by them for them to be dangerous. List the issues, including that they have bitten and a vet won’t see them.

If the police refuse to act, check to see if you have legal cover on your house insurance. If so, contact them for advice. This is so dangerous for your girls and family.

The man being hostile is up to him, but I would rather live with a hostile neighbour than the risk of my family being attacked by two aggressive dogs.

Goodness how terrifying, I would be on edge the whole time.

I would keep reporting it to who ever I could until something is done about it.
Neighbour sounds vile and should be banned from pets for life.

A hedge Wouldn’t give you the protection you need, German shepherds are great dogs when properly trained they are very clever a hedge wouldn’t stop them getting through they would find a way.

Have you had quotes all roughly the same figures? Would the neighbour not consider paying half? Doubtful I know but might be worth a try?

Also have you taken videos of how they react when you and your family are in the garden and shown the police?

A motivated dog will push through a linked chain fence and can scale a fixed welded fence if the space is big enough to get it's paw into. GS are used in search and police work because they are agile and motivated. The hedge is always weakest at the bottom so I would not trust that a young hedge will hold back two dogs.

If the police wont act an alternative long term plan is to make food friends with the dogs. It sounds as if the dogs are mishandled. Puppies have to be taught not to use their mouth to harm. And biting in most dogs is a stress/fear reaction. Get 2 Tongs and nice snacks. Whistle them when you go out, always go up to the fence and feed each a snack, move back a few steps, stay and talk until they calm a little, then more treats. They start to see you as a good thing and movement from your house is an opportunity for food.

I'm the owner of a dog with a few issues of his own, so I can usually see things from both points of view but in this case I'm horrified.

A hedge will be no match for a determined dog - I certainly wouldn't bet my child's safety on it.

The police are very out of date on their law - a few years ago the DDA was changed to cover private land after a teenager was killed at her friend's house by 5 dogs.

Trevor Cooper www.doglaw.co.uk should be able to advise and write a solicitors letter if required.

Given his irresponsibility I'd be going through the police.

PS the neutering is a red herring - dogs are invariably aggressive because they're scared, and this would fit with them having no socialisation. Such dogs benefit from the confidence boost that testosterone brings. There's no impact either way from spaying bitches though.

Are you in England? There is a lot which is unusual about your post. Its not your responsibility to keep the dogs on his land by fencing, its his....you say that the dogs are "jumping your fence" but then you say he says that the stockfence has to stay. so who owns it? him or you. from what you have said, the man has done enough to be prosecuted under the DDA so I can't see why the police have said they can do nothing.

You're not taking this seriously enough.

If they get into your garden when your children are playing, £10,000 will quickly seem like nothing & encouraging wildlife ridiculous (compared to your children's lives)

Go higher up the police, dog warden, solicitor, whatever the fuck you need to do, to get these dogs removed from this absolute twat. Hopefully get him in some trouble too for encouraging dogs to be dangerous.

Hopefully the dogs will be trained & rehomed, but should they be PTS, it's still better for them than being kept by this absolute wanker.

The relationship with your neighbor is already beyond repair (his fault) and he’s a cruel animal abuser so I would keep reporting him to the police.

I feel for you and your family but also for those poor dogs. I know from experience that shepherd breeds can be amazing dogs, also with kids, but they need guidance and training, definitely NOT human agression. My grandmother was a widow and had a very well trained and lovely shepherd dog and this dog was treated with ‘much love but strict rules’ as my grandmother worded it but was never fysically abused because that will turn them into nasty dogs as she said.
For everyone involved here it would be much better if the dogs would be rehomed with a responsible owner that knows how to train these dogs.

I would record how they behave, report your husband’s injury and gather evidence to prove that this man is completely unsuitable to be the owner of these dogs and hopefully the police will step in. You’re simply no longer safe on your own land, I would be seriously concerned for what could happen if one day they jump over the fence. I hate to say this as it’s not the dogs fault but if they do and attack your children, keep something like a baseball bat near your door so you can step in. If you wait for the police it will be too late. And never let the DC out of sight in the field. This might sound extreme but this is what I would do. Again it’s not the dogs fault but because of their shit owner they’re practically killing machines and should be dealt with as such in case of an attack.

I have a German shepherd and she could easily get through any hedge if she wanted too.

Although expensive I think honestly a 6ft closed fence is the best option. It would block the view from the dogs.

It sounds as though he’s not going to do anything about it!

By the way YouTube has numerous videos of German shepherds jumping 6' fences. The closely related Belgian Malinois is the one used for police work and they're... well... watch this video

In the US they have something called coyote rollers on the top of fences to stop coyotes hauling themselves over and eating the family cat. They can also work for escape artist dogs.

We put up a high fence to stop deer coming onto our land. We just used an additional run of stock fencing, higher up the posts (we probably had to add taller posts too, I forget. Might this help?

I know fencing is very expensive but in this situation I think you need to step back on what you are doing to your house and get it sorted, for your family's safety.

That sounds awful. I would kick up a massive, massive fuss with the police, RSPCA, possibly media. I would try to get the vet on record.

I would say to the police - you know that there's 2 dangerous, out of control dogs living right beside small children. Are you absolutely sure that if the worst was to happen that an investigation would show they had been responsible and proactive enough?

Your relationship with your neighbour has gone, you just need to protect your children now.

Those poor dogs, failed by their owner like that.

If they get into your garden when your children are playing, £10,000 will quickly seem like nothing & encouraging wildlife ridiculous (compared to your children's lives)

Agree, I am very pro dogs but this has made me very uncomfortable. How can you let the children play when aggressive dogs track them behind a four ft fence?

I don't agree with the feeding them either, all that will do is encourage them to get into your garden.

Hedging/ fencing is not a solution. Clever but brutalised dogs will find a way…. Keep complaining and further the report of the bite to your DH. An angry dog and a child could result in a serious mauling/ death. I’d be taking no chances, doing everything to have those poor animals rehomed and the dangerous idiot next door fined and shamed.

Agree the hedge won't deter a determined dog. I watched mine go through hawthorn for his favourite ball before I could stop him. Huge bloody spikes on it too. [shocked]

We have hawthorne hedges around a lot of the farm. They are about 2m but very thick. It is to keep cattle in, we also have electric wires. They are thick, spikey and you wouldn't want to walk through it!! But they look nice enough and attract lots of birds

Would a strip or two of electric tape above the height of the current fence be cheaper/work? Hopefully high enough so the kids can't reach but be enough to stop the dogs jumping over

Report the bites and the dogs. Log every incident of fence jumping and aggression. You’ll need some form of fencing and plant a hedge in front I’d suggest. I love dogs (I have quite a few) but this is unacceptable and you could have those dogs put down for the biting.

@ABCDEF1234

Would a strip or two of electric tape above the height of the current fence be cheaper/work? Hopefully high enough so the kids can't reach but be enough to stop the dogs jumping over

I've seen foxes get through electric fences when they are determined enough, I wouldn't put it passed a GSD

You are minimising the risk IMO. Sod the wildlife plans (temporarily), you need to protect your children from this threat, they may unfortunately be unable to use that field for the time being.

I would see a solicitor and ask for advice about what to do re. the whole situation and specifically the bite. Do you have records of the bite, photos and evidence of medical treatment?

I wouldn't count on neutering as a way of making a dog more peaceful if the reason is pack behaviour (littermate syndrome) and generally absolute failure to socialise the poor animals.
These are working dogs and need socialisation, training and mental engagement, otherwise they get bored. I feel very sorry for them but they should either be retrained and rehomed or, if it doesn't work, put to sleep.

I would say to the police - you know that there's 2 dangerous, out of control dogs living right beside small children. Are you absolutely sure that if the worst was to happen that an investigation would show they had been responsible and proactive enough?

Agree with this. Also approach your local councillor and your MP with the same message.

Unfortunately rehoming just moves the problem on. Once dogs are dangerous it takes real expertise to sort it out, and ongoing vigilence. Most people are not up to it.

Just to be sure, did you report the bite when your husband was attacked by one of the dogs, at the time or since?
I think you need to get pushy either way. My next door neighbour has an aggressive (‘she’s just silly!’) German shepherd who has bitten me before, but seeing as I was in my neighbours home at the time and it didn’t do too much damage as neighbour had her by the collar the whole time (fat lot of good that was!) I left it but the dog, while roaming the yard as she is allowed to, had since attacked another neighbour’s dog twice. That neighbour contacted the police, possibly more than once, and aggressive dog has now been ordered to be on a lead accompanied by a responsible adult any time she is out of the house. Any more incidents and she’s to be put down. I think you need to push harder with the police, show footage, evidence of the previous bite etc.

Short term can you ask him to let you know when dogs are going to be there? Def need to heighten fence.