Page 13 | Is using "Father Christmas" vs "Santa" a class signifier?

Flapjacker48 · 2021-12-25T09:22:07+00:00

Upper/upper middle - use "Father Christmas" Working/lower middle - "Santa" The "Santa" we use in the UK today is almost an original European export to American and has come back as a tackier and vulgar Santa.

TwinkleToppy · 26/12/2021 18:32

Working class and always been Father Christmas.

Mochudubh · 26/12/2021 21:14

@tttigress

I think it is more of a generation things.

Samiklaus went to America as a German immigrant, then returned to Europe as Santa Claus via American movies.

I think before say the 1980s, in the UK it was Father Christmas all round.

No, it wasn't. How hard is it to understand that Scotland had links to Europe going back centuries and' along with our European neighbours, took Santa Claus to the US rather that the other way round?

LilyTheMink · 26/12/2021 21:17

I call him "Sanna" in an exaggerated American accent. Its quicker than saying Father Christmas and ita what the kids all know but, but I still don't feel right with it.

Crowdfundingforcake · 26/12/2021 21:22

SirChenjins and ginger1982, your arguments are as bad as those suggesting Santa is purely an American import. Scottish for as many generations back as I'm aware of, on both sides of the family, and the man has always been Father Christmas. DH from Tyneside and it's FC in his family too.

And, tbh, it doesn't matter. I enjoyed Margaret Ball's Post - interesting.

Charmatt · 26/12/2021 21:24

Santa Claus comes from religion - St Nicholas.
Father Christmas is commercial

ecceromani · 26/12/2021 21:26

@tttigress

I think it is more of a generation things.

Samiklaus went to America as a German immigrant, then returned to Europe as Santa Claus via American movies.

I think before say the 1980s, in the UK it was Father Christmas all round.

My grandparents born 100 years ago called him Santa Claus. my parents born in 1940s called him Santa Claus. Siblings and I born late 1960s/early 70s called him Santa Claus All In Scotland

MajorCarolDanvers · 26/12/2021 21:31

If you want to call the whole of Scotland, parts of Ireland and various regions of England lower class then yes crack on.

Or you could read one of the great many other threads about this and learn that different parts of the Uk do things differently.

The big man has always been Santa in Scotland.

Missymisenthrope · 26/12/2021 22:10

I thought it was the other way round and posh people said Santa. I’m a working class brummie and have always said Father Christmas.

LoveFall · 26/12/2021 22:49

I guess I am a tacky and vulgar Canadian. The jolly fat man in red has always been Santa Claus to me. For over 60 years.

Mochudubh · 26/12/2021 22:51

@Crowdfundingforcake

SirChenjins and ginger1982, your arguments are as bad as those suggesting Santa is purely an American import. Scottish for as many generations back as I'm aware of, on both sides of the family, and the man has always been Father Christmas. DH from Tyneside and it's FC in his family too.

And, tbh, it doesn't matter. I enjoyed Margaret Ball's Post - interesting.

In a way you have kind of proved the point of both sides.

Mochudubh · 26/12/2021 22:53

Sorry, wrong thread,

StarCourt · 26/12/2021 23:05

I'm absolutely working class and it's Father Christmas in my family

IVflytrap · 26/12/2021 23:55

The same people that add in an R where there isn’t one? So they say “draw-ring”. Sounds so awful.

Yes! The people who rhyme the girls name Hannah with Spanner.

If, as this thread has correctly proven, it's unacceptable to be rude about Scottish and Irish words and culture, surely it should also be unacceptable to be rude about working class accents? Even if they are the "awful" working class accents of English people.

Bloodypunkrockers · 27/12/2021 00:00

@IVflytrap

The same people that add in an R where there isn’t one? So they say “draw-ring”. Sounds so awful.

Yes! The people who rhyme the girls name Hannah with Spanner.

If, as this thread has correctly proven, it's unacceptable to be rude about Scottish and Irish words and culture, surely it should also be unacceptable to be rude about working class accents? Even if they are the "awful" working class accents of English people.

What's rude about it

It's an observation

Father Christmas is said by the types they don't pronounce Rs where they should be and DO shove them in where they dont belong

That's not rude. That's fact

Skeumorph · 27/12/2021 00:17

SANTELLO MERDE

Skeumorph · 27/12/2021 00:18

Youm Santo Cristozzz

sydenhamhiller · 27/12/2021 00:33

@MaloryPowers

Father Christmas sound stuck up and not 'with the times'. We're not posh but not some poor country cousins either. Santa is more contemporary and we're happy to refer to the magic man as such .

This made me giggle. My entire extended family on both sides is from a deprived former mill town in the NW of England. Very working class: mining, cotton mills, cleaners, leaving school at 14.

Everyone said Father Christmas. I still say Father Christmas, with my flat Northern vowels.

I had no idea that made my relatives and me sound stuck up and ‘not with times’, I think I quite like that. 😉

LlamaParma · 27/12/2021 00:35

As my mum always says, only classless people are obsessed with class

IVflytrap · 27/12/2021 00:41

@bloodypunkrockers Claiming an accent is awful is the rude part, obviously, and something I find tiring because so often on mumsnet it's the working class southeastern English accents that people are mocking or otherwise labelling bad or wrong. I'm not in the mood to have a debate about whether my regional accent is actually real or just "bad English" yet again on MN, it's just depressing when this thread was nearly getting somewhere in terms of people accepting that national and regional differences 1. exist and 2. should be respected (with an added measure of welcome ridicule at the usual mumsnet class snobbery!).

TrashyPanda · 27/12/2021 00:57

it should also be unacceptable to be rude about working class accents? Even if they are the "awful" working class accents of English people. hmm

The people I have heard say “draw-ring” on TV were not working class. I have no idea why you would make such a presumption.

Whatwillbewilbe · 27/12/2021 00:59

I said Santy when I was a child, my children and grandchildren said Santa. (I'm Scottish from an Irish family). I don't know a single person who says Father Christmas.

Bloodypunkrockers · 27/12/2021 03:07

[quote IVflytrap]@bloodypunkrockers Claiming an accent is awful is the rude part, obviously, and something I find tiring because so often on mumsnet it's the working class southeastern English accents that people are mocking or otherwise labelling bad or wrong. I'm not in the mood to have a debate about whether my regional accent is actually real or just "bad English" yet again on MN, it's just depressing when this thread was nearly getting somewhere in terms of people accepting that national and regional differences 1. exist and 2. should be respected (with an added measure of welcome ridicule at the usual mumsnet class snobbery!).[/quote]
Yeah whatever.

It's that cohort that has Farther Christmas. If you want to be insulted, go for it

I'll just count down the 363 days until Santa blows back in (via America of course as we Scots have no minds of our own)

MissCruellaDeVil · 27/12/2021 03:21

Father Christmas = British

Santa = American, only used in recent years as it's what we see American movies / social media etc.

Furries · 27/12/2021 03:41

Grew up in the south in the 70’s. Definitely not wealthy parents. Always Father Christmas.

Have always just assumed that Santa trickled through from the USA.

Have never thought about it as a class thing - in fact, haven’t really thought about it at all until seeing this thread.

Bloodypunkrockers · 27/12/2021 03:41

Oh ffs