To not want this sleepover?

[ChemistryBoggle]

Ds 16 yrs wants his gf to sleep over. Previously it was an easy no as she was 15 and I could use the excuse of not encouraging under age sex.
They are now both 16 and itnhas come up again.
I am uncomfortable with it. When insaid this to ds he said my discomfort should not impinge on his freedoms/rights/enjoyment.
Should add, ds also shares a room with other ds. 14.
I can't articulate why it makes sense uncomfortable in a way he understands.
He raises the point that if either other dc wanted a sleepover then i would say yes no hesitation, which is true, but they're 1) younger (but still teens) 2) not in a relationship 3)the same sex.
On point 3) ds points out that he is bi, so would I say no to another male sleeping over. No, probably not, but again, if in a relationship then yes?
I don't know. Aibu?
Please help me make sense of the reluctance!

If they don’t plan to have sex there’s no need for a sleepover eh

But in all seriousness, it’s your house and you’re not comfortable with it, that’s enough for a no.

You don’t have to convince your son, just tell him.

I actually really agree with ShineySparkley, you are allowing him to manipulate you. Yes his autism will make it harder to say no and stick to it but allowing him to dictate everything because he doesn't see the "value" in your argument is setting him up for a lot of trouble long term.

He needs to be taught that everyone has the right to say no and he needs to learn respect other people's choices. The fact that he said he would kill himself if he didn't get what he wanted in regards to another issue is hugely worrying and really needs to be addressed.

Nope.
No chance.
Pigs would be taking off from Heathrow Airport before I'd ever ever allow that.

I'm sorry but I'm on the other side of the argument. I disagree with the 'your house, your rules' argument, because it is also his house, he lives there too and at 16 should be allowed to have these discussions with you. I also wouldn't respond well if someone told me no with no explanation or opportunity to support my argument.

At the age of 16, if they want to have sex, then it is going to happen regardless. I personally would rather they did it somewhere they had privacy and dignity, rather than knowing they are potentially having to do it in a field somewhere.

I do agree that it shouldn't be in the same room as his 14 yo DB. Gross. But surely there must be some compromise. Me and my partner lived with his parents while we saved for a house. I can't imagine how that would of worked if we couldn't stay at parents houses. Your son is now a young man and is in a long term relationship. I think there should be some compromise on both sides

Im concerned that your ds wont acceot your authority on a major point. No she cant stay over because they are too young and its your family home. End of.

The issue is the little brother in the room, it's not fair on him at all so on that basis I'd say no. It's completely inappropriate.

bardos,

"I disagree with the 'your house, your rules' argument, because it is also his house, he lives there too and at 16 should be allowed to have these discussions with you. I also wouldn't respond well if someone told me no with no explanation or opportunity to support my argument."

Yes it's his home, and when he starts paying lodge money he can have more of a say in what goes on.

"At the age of 16, if they want to have sex, then it is going to happen regardless. I personally would rather they did it somewhere they had privacy and dignity, rather than knowing they are potentially having to do it in a field somewhere."

If they want "privacy and dignity" they can go to a hotel. I notice the girls parents aren't allowing sleepovers over there.

It's not about compromise, it's about a child not accepting authority.

"Your son is now a young man and is in a long term relationship."

The son is a child who's brain isn't fully-formed yet. He can't respect authority, which doesn't bode well for the future.

"Me and my partner lived with his parents while we saved for a house. I can't imagine how that would of worked if we couldn't stay at parents houses."

Presumably you were both working and contributing to the family budget?

I would really like to know where the father is in all this and what his input is?

He shares a bedroom ,fuck no
And don’t get pressured in to giving him your bed ,or the lounge .
Stand firm ,say no

I don’t understand autism but like hell as a parent would I be scrabbling around to justify my perfectly reasonable parenting decision to some cocky teen. No - end of. Don’t even enter into a discussion it’s not up for discussion.

So where would you prefer them to have sex?

I'd rather my kids had in the safety of a parental home. My DH would rather the problem would go away. Unfortunately it doesn't.

I was never allowed sleepovers'
So vowed to be more liberal with my kids.
So I can see your ds point of view - setting aside his 14 year old brother

That can't happen.
I mean that's your answer really .
No you share a room.
But Anyway dh was having none of it.
When the youngest wanted a gf to stop over at 17 she slept in the spare room. Only happened once as they split up and then went to Uni.
At 25 he came back for the weekend and brought serious gf.
I offered him a choice of gf having spare room (opposite his) or staying in his room - whatever gf felt comfortable. Gf is quite religious.
And my wonderful, respective son asked if his Dad would allow this.
I explained yes as at 25 with a 2 year relationship was different to one at 16.
She did stay in sons room. It was especially special for her as future wife to know he didn't have loads of women over before her.
My friend used to let her son have sleep over with gf at 16 - she got pregnant. And I know that can happen anywhere but they were every night - just saying.

Longer term commuted relationship over 18 yes. Anything else no. Don’t get the argument “they will do it anyway” well they certainly will if you facilitate it! Also it’s you endorsing it too. Would you lay out lines of cocaine too so they can do that in a safe environment?

I agree with ShinySparkly.

I have 3 dc, all have ADHD and two have ASD. They are still expected to behave reasonably and learn that compromise is essential when people live together. It does them no favours to be pandered to if they 'kick off/meltdown'. When they are out in the world they will need to learn to negotiate and compromise, and abusive behaviour is still abusive, whether it's caused by disability or not!

Eldest dc is 21 and her bf stays over occasionally when she's home from uni, but dc (12), who she shares with when home (very small house!), kips down on our bedroom floor when her bf stays over. Dc (12) very happy to do this as loves to sleep in a 'nest' on our floor and views it as a bit of a treat 😁!

"I'm sorry but he's 16. Autistic or not, that's old enough to understand and accept that sometimes he'll be told no for the simple reason that someone else's opinion trumps his. This is one of those situations.

He needs to learn that 3 days of WW3 because he can't get his own way or an explanation that he agrees with for why he can't get his own way, is entirely inappropriate. If he doesn't learn this, he's never going to have a long term successful relationship, because his behaviour is going to amount to domestic abuse every time he can't get his own way or disagrees with his partner.

So all he'll have is a constant string of people who leave him. People who'll have their own lives messed up by him. You're not doing him or his future partners any favours by pandering to this desire for an explanation. He simply needs to learn that he can't always have what he wants, that exploding in a rage (or whatever form his meltdowns take) isn't ok and he needs to find ways to cope with whatever he's feeling.

A sulky/angry person that people have to tiptoe round and cave in to their requests in order to avoid drama or justify their no with an explanation of why, is still being abusive even when there's a medical issue behind it".

I think you need to stick to the line that you, your son, and other adults in the household have a legal responsibility to ensure that children are not exposed to sexual activity.

GF clearly can’t stay over in a room shared with a younger child.

Living room won’t work either, because younger children also access that room.

I’d avoid any judgments about the maturity of your 16yo completely, and reinforce the law about protecting children.

I'm sorry but he's 16. Autistic or not, that's old enough to understand and accept that sometimes he'll be told no for the simple reason that someone else's opinion trumps his. This is one of those situations.

He needs to learn that 3 days of WW3 because he can't get his own way or an explanation that he agrees with for why he can't get his own way, is entirely inappropriate. If he doesn't learn this, he's never going to have a long term successful relationship, because his behaviour is going to amount to domestic abuse every time he can't get his own way or disagrees with his partner.

So all he'll have is a constant string of people who leave him. People who'll have their own lives messed up by him. You're not doing him or his future partners any favours by pandering to this desire for an explanation. He simply needs to learn that he can't always have what he wants, that exploding in a rage (or whatever form his meltdowns take) isn't ok and he needs to find ways to cope with whatever he's feeling.

A sulky/angry person that people have to tiptoe round and cave in to their requests in order to avoid drama or justify their no with an explanation of why, is still being abusive even when there's a medical issue behind it.

All of this is so, so important. Keep hold of it in your mind to focus your strength. You need to teach him how to be able to hopefully have good, respectful, well balanced and healthy relationships. And you need to teach him that life is actually much more about responsibilities than rights (barring human rights of course) - ultimately he will be much better able to cope with the real world if he internalises that.

"When insaid this to ds he said my discomfort should not impinge on his freedoms/rights/enjoyment."

When he has his own house he can please himself. Whilst he lives in YOUR house he can abide by YOUR rules, whatever they are. Especially if it is something that makes you uncomfortable. Cheeky little sod

Exactly what LawnFever said.

I’m very flexible with my kids and give them an awful lot of free rein but this would be a hard no at 16. 18 when back from uni is a different matter but I think 16 is still very young.

Yanbu to just say no. You don’t have to justify yourself. And he shares with a sibling so you have to think of them too.

@ChemistryBoggle I always say on these threads - you need to channel Judge Judy: ‘as long as you live in my house, I own the air you breathe!’

It’s really a very important part of growing up, understanding that things are not always going to go your way, and one that I think too many people aren’t learning at the moment. Don’t feel bad - you’re doing him a massive favour and whilst it’s hard right now he will thank you for it in the future, as my children did when they were old enough to understand.

And that’s coming from a mother who was very flexible, very relaxed about most things and anything but an authoritarian parent. I was authoritative though, and sometimes that means enforcing rules and making sure that your children respect them and you.

He’s 16. It’s a clear no from me. At 18 in a long term relationship I’m happy to open the discussion but even then only with very clear boundaries. It’s my home, I pay the bills and I don’t want anyone staying over regularly in my space plus I don’t think it does any harm for them to have to sneak around a bit.

No, how awkward for your younger son.
Can’t he stay at her house? (probably not!)

@youvegottenminuteslynn

Tell him you and his dad are married and wouldn't have sex in the same room as him, so why does he think you should put him in a position where he might have sex in the same room as his brother? How would he feel (honestly) if his brother had a girlfriend stay in his bed in their shared room overnight?

Your house, your rules.

This. Omg.

It’s your house, so you can say no. I would be most concerned that he shares the room with a younger sibling who cannot be exposed to sexual activity, whether your son & a boyfriend or girlfriend are above the legal age of consent or not.

It’s great you have some good dialogue with your son (being open with his sexuality) so I think he’ll understand the legal issue surrounding a partner staying over with him with his brother in the room.

I allowed my kids at 16 to have friends sleepover, but only after we had open discussions about keeping safe (both with pregnancy and STIs) consent & how to access free condoms, sexual health checks & other contraception.

With my son being 4 years older than my daughter, we did talk about appropriate behaviour in the home outside of the bedroom. He also asked his sister for consent & respected her wishes if she wasn’t happy with the situation & didn’t want it to occur. Sometimes she wasn’t happy & her brother respected that.

My reasoning has always been, they’ll do it anyway & anywhere, so we offered a safe space where if they were going to experiment with sex, they knew there was open communication to talk about anything they needed to, without judgement. And that included the consent of their partners & us talking honestly to their parents too.

I had a violent, extremely strict upbringing so went a little boy mad at 16 (I think just to feel affection & loved) having liaisons here, there & everywhere. And discussions about contraception & safe sex were banned in the house (I was thrown against a stone fireplace by my father when I asked my Mum for advice one day), so we’ve always worked towards open, honest conversations with our kids. I had my son as a teenager & I didn’t want my children to go through that struggle.

It’s all about communication (I think I say that here a lot 😂).

It’s a safeguarding concern for the younger brother. If the school heard her was in the room with his older brother having sex in front of him, that would be a huge concern. That’s enough if an answer.