To think pregnant women should get the vaccine

[HopefulRose]

This is controversial but had a lively debate with a family member about this today. I’m currently pregnant and double jabbed and hopeful I can get my booster soon. I’ve been quite surprised and tbh annoyed at the number of pregnant women refusing to get the vaccine.

Pregnant women who are unvaccinated end up getting much more sick from Covid than those who have the vaccines. And those who are getting ill end up taking up resources in hospitals which causes a knock on effect to the care of other pregnant women who are vaccinated. A friend recently was supposed to have a home birth but had to go into hospital because there weren’t enough midwives due to this very problem.

Perhaps it’s a failure on the government/ DHSC’s behalf for not communicating this strongly enough. I understand if there are genuine concerns but most of the people I’ve spoken to who don’t want the vaccine don’t appear to be interested in the medical or logical arguments and their decisions come from ‘feeling’ (or Facebook) rather than reasoning.

I only got the phizer as they have tracked 100,000 pregnant women and the pregnancy loss rate is the same as pre Corona. There is a in lot of top fertility drs backing the use of it now and they wouldn't want a jab messing with their stats. I did it after seeing the midwife and had more side effects getting the flu shot which has been OKed for pregnancy for ages.

This attitude annoys me OP and could possibly backfire and have some pregnant women doubledown on their refusal.

Pregnant women aren't all one mass. They will have their own reasons. And gut feeling is a good a reason as any other. People have to make their own choice if they want to have medical treatment or not. And if they are now also responsible for another life it can add extra weight to that decision. Not to mention it was unclear at the start what women wanting to get pregnant should do re vaccine.

@BillyBarryBoo

This is perhaps the overbearing paternalistic condescending attitude towards pregnant women coming home to roost. Pregnant women have been told to avoid coffee, alcohol (even though a small amount is safe), paracetamol (most recently), shellfish, deli meat, soft serve ice cream, eye drops, paté (Vitamin A overdose, fair enough but I doubt a bit on a cracker is going to harm anyone) brie/goats cheese/soft cheese/raw cheese , the list goes on.

But here is an untested vaccine with NO POSSIBLE long term data because it's only been around for a months in the single digits. Inject that into yourself. More than once. And have a booster. It's probably fine. But not definitely. Don't have a lemsip though.

Massive cognitive dissonance

Exactly this.

Their body, their choice

@GetTheFlockOutOfHere absolutely, I’d be fuming.
@BillyBarryBoo great post, it’s madness when it’s all laid out like that!

BillyBarryBoo
This is perhaps the overbearing paternalistic condescending attitude towards pregnant women coming home to roost.
Pregnant women have been told to avoid coffee, alcohol (even though a small amount is safe), paracetamol (most recently), shellfish, deli meat, soft serve ice cream, eye drops, paté (Vitamin A overdose, fair enough but I doubt a bit on a cracker is going to harm anyone) brie/goats cheese/soft cheese/raw cheese , the list goes on.

But here is an untested vaccine with NO POSSIBLE long term data because it's only been around for a months in the single digits. Inject that into yourself. More than once. And have a booster. It's probably fine. But not definitely. Don't have a lemsip though.

Massive cognitive dissonance
Brilliant post!

Soooo much stuff is 'BAD' for you when you're pregnant, and women get barked at by judgy fuckers for DARING to do - or consume -ANYTHING.

And yet some people are insisting they are injected with some new, untested vaccine with no long term data, and no WAY of knowing if it will harm the unborn child.

Fucking batshit.

👏👏** Agreed

And unless the researchers tracked the women lifestyle full for six months pre and after a vacation. They can't put it down to the vaccination. Hormones are effected by our diet , exercise, stress, environment. At times we like to blame a outside source than look at our own behavior it would rely on participants being incredibly honest over their life which would be incredibly intrusive. That's why studies have looked at pregnancy loss post vaccine compared to normal rates of pregnancy loss. We are individuals but I'm sure if you looked at the into the lifestyle of 1000 pregnant women will find a similar rate of stressors.

My understanding was that they told pregnant women not to get the vaccine initially as they did not have any data, however they since have data to show that there are no immediate/short term negative effects.

I had both vaccines when I was pregnant because I decided to make my decision on what is known now. What is known now is that I was much more likely to die if I got Covid pregnant and that would mean leaving and existing child behind and potentially losing the one I was pregnant with. I couldn’t take that risk. i would have been prioritising some unknown long-term effects which felt like a gamble. It’s not an easy decision to make but it’s seemed the most logical one to me. So whilst I agree that pregnant women should have the vaccine I don’t agree that it’s an obvious decision to make or an easy decision to make because those what ifs when you’re talking about your child are pretty powerful.

@BillyBarryBoo

This is perhaps the overbearing paternalistic condescending attitude towards pregnant women coming home to roost. Pregnant women have been told to avoid coffee, alcohol (even though a small amount is safe), paracetamol (most recently), shellfish, deli meat, soft serve ice cream, eye drops, paté (Vitamin A overdose, fair enough but I doubt a bit on a cracker is going to harm anyone) brie/goats cheese/soft cheese/raw cheese , the list goes on.

But here is an untested vaccine with NO POSSIBLE long term data because it's only been around for a months in the single digits. Inject that into yourself. More than once. And have a booster. It's probably fine. But not definitely. Don't have a lemsip though.

Massive cognitive dissonance

Brilliantly put.

I didn't get the vaccine when I was pregnant. I'd been told not to in the first instance so when we were suddenly told it was ok I'd already made up my mind that I wasn't having it. The thing about it affecting your periods spooked me too. And additionally, I took a very strong adversion to any type of medication when pregnant. I was given all sorts and told to take it for this and that. Almost all of it is still in my medicine cupboard. I didn't get the flu jab or the whooping cough jab.

I'm not anti jab or anti medication - I've since had both my covid vaccines. Something just came over me when I was pregnant and I rejected the whole lot of it.

@BillyBarryBoo

This is perhaps the overbearing paternalistic condescending attitude towards pregnant women coming home to roost. Pregnant women have been told to avoid coffee, alcohol (even though a small amount is safe), paracetamol (most recently), shellfish, deli meat, soft serve ice cream, eye drops, paté (Vitamin A overdose, fair enough but I doubt a bit on a cracker is going to harm anyone) brie/goats cheese/soft cheese/raw cheese , the list goes on.

But here is an untested vaccine with NO POSSIBLE long term data because it's only been around for a months in the single digits. Inject that into yourself. More than once. And have a booster. It's probably fine. But not definitely. Don't have a lemsip though.

Massive cognitive dissonance

THIS.

When I was 5 months pregnant a pharmacist wouldn't sell me a packet of strepsils for a sore throat, but yes let's all push women to have an experimental drug with zero long term data that they don't even need because the majority of women will have a mild flu like illness and then go back to normal after a few days in bed.

I only got the phizer as they have tracked 100,000 pregnant women and the pregnancy loss rate is the same as pre Corona. There is a in lot of top fertility drs backing the use of it now and they wouldn't want a jab messing with their stats. I did it after seeing the midwife and had more side effects getting the flu shot which has been OKed for pregnancy for ages

It's not just pregnancy loss that would be my concern though.

What data is there on any physical or mental impact on the baby at 3 months? 6 months? 5 years? Beyond?

None, for obvious reasons because it's a brand new medication. And despite all the reassurances of it being 'old technology' - it's technology that's never before been included in vaccines in humans, let alone pregnant humans.

It's unlikely to cause any long term impact in babies. Unlikely. But no one knows. And anyone that offers you a guarantee that there will be no long term impacts to the baby is flat out lying to you.

I can totally understand why some pregnant women are unhappy to risk it, however low the risk is estimated to be.

Gettheflockoutofhere absolutely no need to be like that. I offered my opinion. I am still allowed one. But for what it is worth I don’t lecture anybody. In fact I don’t get involved at all. I just do my job of scanning.
I am just relaying what the Drs and midwives are telling me. It their job to give patients information and their job to encourage patients do what is safest thing for their baby. It is utterly ridiculous that people seem to think that health professionals can’t even advise people and i do feel for the midwives who must feel like they are banging their heads against a brick wall when patients are coming in having already made up their minds and refusing to actually listen to what they are supposed to tell them.
Perhaps you should maybe also just be a little bit appropriative of that fact that we lowly health professionals are also putting ourselves at more risk working day in day out in close contacts with unvaccinated patients and getting no thanks for it.
So no you get off your high horse!

I fell pregnant in January 2021. The advice for the first 20 weeks was that it wasn’t going to be given to pregnant women.
At my 20 week appointment, that changed and they started giving pregnant women the jab. I had both in the summer.
I gave birth 6 weeks ago and I’ll be more than happy to get the booster.

However, I can understand why pregnant women are nervous about having though. Especially the ones who were pregnant in the first quarter of the year and were told pregnant women wouldn’t be having it. It’s still relatively new and their fear is not only for their own health but that of their unborn child.
I find it hard to be angry at women whose only motivation is what is best for their child.

Of course it's the woman's choice but I'm so surprised the health professionals put their own opinion forward when discussing the vaccine. It's unprofessional to say " well I wouldn't have it if I were you" and very unfair to women, who need proper, informed consent. There is a lot of data around now and the vaccine has been shown to be safe with many thousands of pregnant women: some of whom didn't know they were pregnant. The vaccine has not been rushed: work had already started on a SARS vaccine.
I understand women being wary and appreciate we know our pregnancies are extremely precious but the worry about long term data needs to be balanced against not surviving this horrible virus. Pregnant women are so vulnerable and as health professionals, it's our duty to give facts to enable women to make their own decisions or people will find information from alternative (which may be totally incorrect) sources.
Best wishes, all x

Pinkstegasaurus
I don’t get involved but I do work in a team with Drs and mindwives. I work in fetal medicine with high risk pregnancies and obviously witness the consultants interactions with patients. I witness their utter frustration. These are the people that are picking up the pieces when patients suffer the consequences of not having vaccines.

You can't blame people for being cautious there is actually no clear advice. I was told at 8 weeks when I went to get my first vaccine that I should wait and they didn't recommend it. No one seems to be very clear at all.

@olivehater thank you for clarifying your position. I am among many other posters who were initially told not to be vaccinated and then when the vaccine was approved for pregnant women are all of a sudden being pushed into something we have been told to be unsure of ‘because we say so’? Surely you can understand where the hesitancy originated.

This has me going back and forth, I am waiting for my booster shot too, and I would do anything to protect my pregnancy. But I do understand women being afraid because it has been so hard to get pregnant, I do understand the fear. In the end, it should have been communicated better.

I think the problem is pregnant women were refused the jab for several months, then they suddenly told it's ok now, take the jab! After bring told no you should wait it's hard to turn around and say oh ok I've been told it's fine now I'll go ahead. I chose to have the jab after my baby was born.

My neighbour had her first dose, but hasn't had her second whilst pregnant because her midwife said "off the record" she wouldn't advise it.

@HappyMeal564

I think the problem is pregnant women were refused the jab for several months, then they suddenly told it's ok now, take the jab! After bring told no you should wait it's hard to turn around and say oh ok I've been told it's fine now I'll go ahead. I chose to have the jab after my baby was born.

Exactly this. No WAY would I have the jab whilst pregnant.

@SingingSands

My neighbour had her first dose, but hasn't had her second whilst pregnant because her midwife said "off the record" she wouldn't advise it.

Fukin hell! Really?

@Nillynally

You can't blame people for being cautious there is actually no clear advice. I was told at 8 weeks when I went to get my first vaccine that I should wait and they didn't recommend it. No one seems to be very clear at all.

This. ^

@olivehater

Gettheflockoutofhere absolutely no need to be like that. I offered my opinion. I am still allowed one.

Perhaps you should maybe just be a little bit appropriative of that fact that we lowly health professionals are also putting ourselves at more risk working day in day out in close contacts with unvaccinated patients and getting no thanks for it.

Spare me the martyrdom. Yours is not the only 'profession' to be working day-in, day-out, in contact with unvaccinated people and getting no thanks for it. (And if it's that bad, then leave.)

And my words and views remain the same. You have NO business voicing your opinions to pregnant women who choose to not have the vaccine (whilst they are pregnant.) Just do the job you are paid to do, and keep your opinions to yourself. Pregnant women have enough shit to deal with, without unsolicited opinions and views from some random healthcare person, who doesn't know them from Adam.