Expectations of adult step children

[PerfectlyImperfectme]

Hi.
I wondering if me / my family are out of touch here or my partner & his adult children are.
Been the ptr 5 years - his 'boys' are 21,23 & 25.
Background - I will say now I think they both (ptr & exw) have babied the boys & as a result there's a level of entitlement I'd not expect to see in anyone over mid teens. I'm not ow & when we meet up / they come over we get on great. But they require collecting and dropping back. Mom doesn't like them getting public transport & so they are not familiar with it. They all have licenses but no car, mom has car but doesn't want them driving to ours in it or late night.

My problem. Their mother still buys card for them to give ptr & buys token gifts, all v obvious as generic from m&s. All sign the one card. 2 eldest have Gfs of 3+ years.
I'm yet to make it onto the Christmas card he receives.
Ptr is a bit upset by there lack of effort but hadn't spoken to them & continues to make excuses.
I know some boys are a bit slow on the uptake of adult life & making time or putting effort into things but I know they do it for their mother & gfs. All down tools & come home from work / uni on her birthday.
I feel ptr needs to talk / show them the way he expects to be treated. I think by the time you get to 20 you should be able to buy a card & post it to your Dad on his birthday without mom prompting or all 3 having to sign the one card.
My family for info - we all were taught the importance of making people feel loved & special on their day & Christmas. We sent our own cards by 16, granted my brother needed reminding but he stil got his own. We starting giving small gifts from ourselves around the same age.
I don't want to keep mentioning as my ptr is aware but how do I / can I influence change ?
I'm a bit too blunt & my answer would be to send them a single Christmas addressed to all, same with gifts and see if the penny drops lol... But I guess that's mean.

Sorry it's so long & rambly - I don't want to cross swords with anyone but I'd like my ptr treated more fairly as an equal parent

Missing point of thread... but NT men in their twenties unable to get a bus or drive in the dark? And they've managed to sustain relationships for 3 years?

Sounds fairly standard tbh. Think you're being a bit dramatic

Well, the boys sound pretty horrendous but agree with others - it's not really your problem. I grew up in another country and am nearly 50 and I remember a LOT of my male friends were like you describe your stepsons. Come to think of it, so was my brother. (except for the car - it was the opposite in that the rest of us would have to walk/take public transport because the boys always got first dibs).

It comes from a sense of entitlement. Possibly generational? I don't know. The good ones will eventually grow out of it (my brother did, but not without quite a lot of kicking and screaming). The less good ones will probably land up divorced and bitter. But at this point there is nothing you can do. Your DP should be telling the boys he's not going to baby them but if they won't listen then not much anyone can do.

@Outnumbered99
That's the thing. They are capable of travelling abroad, up & down the country on holidays but not across the city to us. Mom feels we should pick n drop back. I'm happy if working near or time allows to collect but as we'll be having a drink or maybe going to work after depending on the day we think it's not unreasonable to travel back on public transport or taxi

@maddy68

Sounds fairly standard tbh. Think you're being a bit dramatic

People really do have low expectations of (young) adult men, don’t they?

It IS depressing that anyone thinks that a 25 year old whose mum dictates his transport choices and does his Christmas shopping for him is ‘fairly standard’ and, therefore, ok. It might be pretty common, but it’s shit. As mothers, we should be insisting that our sons take basic responsibility for themselves.

My grown up kids come to me on my birthday and spend more time with me over the Christmas holidays.

Because I give a shit and I’m interested in them and have been for years. I’ve done the grunt work of parenting and I’ve put them first. I’ve taken them and picked them up from nights out. Hosted their friends. Supplied money when they ran out at uni. Knew who their friends were, what was going on in their lives, who liked and disliked what food.

My ex has been disinterested and uninvolved and now they don’t bother much. And his wife complains. Boohoo.

My ex has two female cousins who are 20 years younger than him. Whilst they were growing up it was natural they were named on their parents' cards, even as young adults. However, one then moved out to live with her bf and got married and she and her DH were still listed on the parents' cards! I was brought up that once you had your own household you were responsible for your own cards etc. It was always left to me to send them cards so I used to include the non-resident cousin and her DH on the family card to make a point, so she never had a card from us for her own house. Petty I know but it used to annoy me a lot.

DP needs to get over the leaving guilt and tell them to step up. You are obviously a loving partner and want to help him out, but unfortunately if he keeps letting them treat him like this, they will. They are way old enough to manage this better. I have a cousin who still does this for her son who is in his 30s. I have no time for this kind of fuckwittery.

You're absolutely right but I'd try to keep out of it. Can't see anyway you can improve the situation. The boys sound really wet.

So you came into their lives when they were 16, 18 and 20, so all virtually adults?

I'm afraid that I agree with others that it isn't something you need to concern yourself with other than to sympathise with your partner, if you're so inclined. They had done most of their growing up, under the care of two parents, by the time you came along. It is really up to them how they handle it.

[quote PerfectlyImperfectme]@Outnumbered99
That's the thing. They are capable of travelling abroad, up & down the country on holidays but not across the city to us. Mom feels we should pick n drop back. I'm happy if working near or time allows to collect but as we'll be having a drink or maybe going to work after depending on the day we think it's not unreasonable to travel back on public transport or taxi[/quote]
Clearly this is just a weird dynamic through which their mother has always asserted her status as ‘most important parent’. But your partner has allowed that to happen.

If he wants to change it, he could and would. He doesn’t - for whatever reasons.

My suggestion would be to ignore it, but do not take on the effects of it. Don’t do the picking up and dropping off. Don’t not have the drink or change your working pattern to accommodate it. If your partner chooses to allow his ex to dictate his movements in this way, that’s his choice. Leave him to experience the consequences.

Maybe he’ll decide to change something. Maybe he won’t. But it should be him that feels the effects of letting his ex decide how their 25 year old travels between houses.

It is very rare for adult children to have perfectly equal relationships with their parents especially if the parents divorced at some point

Do you have children? If your partner had an equal relationship he would feel he has a voice - it would be natural to bring it up. Is there also a "man thing" going on, such as the boys don't get other men cards? I bet they don't give cards to their mates.

If after 5 years this is the only issue then I think you are fortunate. Re transport, less young adults have cars due to high costs however if I shared a house with non drivers I would offer lifts rather than the inconvenience and cost of public transport. Especially given Covid..sounds pragmatic and kind. I imagine giving lifts has low cost to the mum so why not??

Your partner has an amicable relationship with his ex and 3 sons (who are all doing fine in life) I think you have a great setup so don't ruin it with looking for issues. His relationship with his sons is his to own.

@Leghardwareremoval

My grown up kids come to me on my birthday and spend more time with me over the Christmas holidays.

Because I give a shit and I’m interested in them and have been for years. I’ve done the grunt work of parenting and I’ve put them first. I’ve taken them and picked them up from nights out. Hosted their friends. Supplied money when they ran out at uni. Knew who their friends were, what was going on in their lives, who liked and disliked what food.

My ex has been disinterested and uninvolved and now they don’t bother much. And his wife complains. Boohoo.

Projecting a bit there aren't we.

Not at all @Getyourarseofffthequattro. It’s a constant complaint to the kids that they don’t do enough for their dad and should make more effort.

But he makes none with them. He expects them to visit him but doesn’t meet up with them for coffee or spend time watching them play their sports or make an effort at all.

His loss.

If you want a relationship it has to be 2 way once the kids are adults. What effort is the “ptr” making?

@Leghardwareremoval

Not at all *@Getyourarseofffthequattro*. It’s a constant complaint to the kids that they don’t do enough for their dad and should make more effort.

But he makes none with them. He expects them to visit him but doesn’t meet up with them for coffee or spend time watching them play their sports or make an effort at all.

His loss.

If you want a relationship it has to be 2 way once the kids are adults. What effort is the “ptr” making?

What I'm saying is that you're assuming because that's your situation, it's the case for the op and her partner too.

For all you know her partner is very involved, unlike your ex. You're assuming he's doing nothing because of your situation, ie projecting.

[quote PerfectlyImperfectme]@Outnumbered99
That's the thing. They are capable of travelling abroad, up & down the country on holidays but not across the city to us. Mom feels we should pick n drop back. I'm happy if working near or time allows to collect but as we'll be having a drink or maybe going to work after depending on the day we think it's not unreasonable to travel back on public transport or taxi[/quote]
Well, she can think and do whatever she wants. But she can’t tell you what to do.

There is no reason men cannot use buses.

I’d decline to give them lifts and unless it is an emergency. Grown men do not need chauffeurs. They need to make their own, independent travel arrangements and pay for them. That is a very, very basic skill that all adults need to have. I wonder how long the bus ban would last if they were paying for Ubers/taxis out of their own pockets.

The op doesn’t describe any involvement.

@maddy68

Sounds fairly standard tbh. Think you're being a bit dramatic

Standard?

Blimey. Your bar's set low

@Leghardwareremoval

The op doesn’t describe any involvement.

...... She does?

And presumably if there was 0 involvement she wouldn't have anything to do with them and it would be a total non issue, wouldn't it?

My first thought was, the two parents' closeness with their children may not be equal. Financial support and regular contact does not equal closeness. Maybe they feel emotionally closer to their mum so make more effort with her. Maybe she knows they don't want to get their dad a card but she makes it happen.

The travel thing does sound pretty pathetic though.

Whatever you think @Getyourarseofffthequattro

I disagree with you but I’m not going to get into a row with you about it.

The op and her “ptr” don’t sound to me, based on what she’s described, that they’re actively involved in these young men’s lives.

It’s not up to the op to manage anyway, it’s up to her “ptr” so if I was her I’d step back and let him do that

@Leghardwareremoval

Whatever you think *@Getyourarseofffthequattro*

I disagree with you but I’m not going to get into a row with you about it.

The op and her “ptr” don’t sound to me, based on what she’s described, that they’re actively involved in these young men’s lives.

It’s not up to the op to manage anyway, it’s up to her “ptr” so if I was her I’d step back and let him do that

Based on what? Can you explain what she's said that makes you think that?

I agree it's not worth ops time because they won't change.

What's with the snarky use of 'ptr'?

The card/ present thing is irritating but sounds as if it is their mum directing this. Presumably she’ll stop when they move out.

The lifts are a different story. They are all adults and need to be able to travel independently whether by car or public transport. You are entitled to not have to plan your life around their travel needs. You can’t force your DP to stop but you can stop doing it yourself. I’d set a date, then tell them (pleasantly) that you won’t be doing it automatically any more, though they can ask if they need a favour. Your DP might follow suit.

I think if the ex wants grown men dropped and collected, she needs to do it herself.

I don't think she gets to dictate to you.

Other than that I would keep out of it.