Please look at this and voice your thoughts

[DoubleTweenQueen]

Ok, so, it has come to my attention lately that gender-questioning is becoming more prevalent - particularly with pre-teen and teen girls.

DD2 seems to be questioning her own identity - doesn’t surprise me. Consider it a normal part of painful adolescence, particularly how women are portrayed and treated.
She has just turned 12. Was bullied when she was 9. Developed GAD; changed schools. Felt better, made new friends, more relaxed with life.

Then the pandemic - fear, worry, social isolation, introduction to tech for education and contact, her older sister succumbed to an eating disorder which has been a source of pain and more worry, and continues to be.

DD2 got into minecraft and you tubers who did minecraft. From there she has acquired quite a grounding in the toxicity of gender politics, mostly from the US it seems.

She seems to have been facilitated by school in her new thoughts about herself - she says she is demi-female, wants to change her pronouns to ‘they’ and her name. This is the first I’ve heard of it, by accident. No-one has mentioned anything about her questioning her identity or any upset from her at all. School have not talked to me at all regarding what else might be going on in her life - first term of senior school. I have filled them in. They are backpedaling.

What I have learned very quickly is that schools appear to be counselling children who are gender questioning, by affirming their thoughts through counselling in school - which is confidential and not shared with parents because the current thought seems to be - once a child questions their gender, they are identified as a ‘protected minority’ and supported and affirmed. Some schools are also enabling children to change their pronouns and name in school - step towards social transition.

This is counter to current thought regarding providing a safe neutral space for children to question and grow, without enabling or influence a move in a trans direction, and one they could feel unable to renege upon at a later date.

More worrying, there is a bill currently being drawn up in Parliament regarding the ban on ‘conversion therapy’ - heavily lobbied for by LGBT+ groups.
This wouldn’t seem to be an issue, apart from this does actually impact the field of child psychology in that when a gender-questioning child goes for therapy or support, the counsellor or psychologist may not look for co-morbidities, i.e. delve deeper to question whether the gender-questioning is a symptom of some deeper issue - anxiety, trauma, neurological-diversity. This is just bonkers! But look at what happened at The Tavistock clinic.........

I aam posting here, because most (including me) were blissfully unaware of the stealth by which this ideology is creeping into our schools and soon nurseries - under the guise of inclusion and anti-bullying. That our children have just gone through two years of difficulty and over-exposure to tech and social media. That their mental health has truly suffered.

If you have older children in secondary school - ask them if they hear of students declaring they are non-binary, interested in changing name or pronouns, interested in Communism and vegetarianism - it seems to go together.
It is very common now. Social contagion as bad as eating disorders, and potentially as damaging, if enabled to move down the pathway of puberty blockers, hormones, surgery!

Please look into this, and make yourselves heard!!

www.transgendertrend.com/conversion-therapy-legal-opinion/

Also - look at Genspect, and the Bayswater Support Group.

These are children, who are vulnerable and neuro-plastic. They are influenced heavily by SM. Please make yourselves aware, before this becomes law, and when your gender-questioning child goes for any sort of counselling, they will be met not with in-depth discussion about what has led them to their belief about themselves being wrong, or weird, or ‘other’ (so normal for adolescents!!) - but affirmation of a trans identity, and not looking for co-morbidities, because it will be against the law

Thanks for reading.

Put here for traffic, but MN can move wherever they like.

I would like to see MN also look into this, as an important parental issue (if they dare )

Vote - YABU - you’re hysterical
YANBU - you might be on to something

But as a socialist vegan I assume I meet the criteria for your red flags.
So it's not fool proof is it.

@jellyfrizz Would it surprise you that gender is being ‘taught’ in schools?

Look at Google, look at Canada and the US, ask your schools what they teach and what resources are used.

Look at this:

www.transgendertrend.com

safeschoolsallianceuk.net

genspect.org - and listen to the recent webinar on ROGD (Rapid onset gender dysphoria) and talks by long-standing experts in the field: genspect.org/conferences/

I have zero truck with everyone expressing fully their own way of being, and am 100% for supporting just that.

What I will challenge is potentially confusing and influencing children - however inadvertent and well-meaning - who then become deeply distressed by physical dysphoria as a result, underpinned by the state removing safeguards and actually potentially criminalising parents and child psychologists through the current bill under consultation, and also by the removal of parental rights to consent or not to the prescribing of puberty blockers to under 16s:

www.theguardian.com/society/2021/sep/17/appeal-court-overturns-uk-puberty-blockers-ruling-for-under-16s-tavistock-keira-bell

So I will advocate strongly for this to be kept in AIBU, as it’s important - potentially critical - for all parents to be aware and share their views.

@Goldilocks99

But as a socialist vegan I assume I meet the criteria for your red flags. So it's not fool proof is it.

You really don’t, but clearly determined to take personal offence. There’s not much I can do about that really.

Not personal offence. I think a lot of people will write off what you say if you continue to do so. I'm not the only one who has said so.
I do think it weakens your argument and I don't think that is a good thing.

@Goldilocks99

Not personal offence. I think a lot of people will write off what you say if you continue to do so. I'm not the only one who has said so. I do think it weakens your argument and I don't think that is a good thing.

It will weaken the whole thread if you keep insisting on focussing on the comment out of context.

Double tween, dh is vegetarian and I totally understand what you mean without feeling dh is being involved into something sinister

I have had some real issues with dd and I deeply appreciate your bringing this further stuff to my attention. It is doesn't come from the nowhere and my dd for instance does watch a lot of mine craft stuff on u tube.
Her school has been absolutely rife with this sort of thing.

I care not one jot if my dd feels when she's an adult that she would like to change sex or become a lesbian
But I would like her to come to the those decisions in her own time and under her steam.

Not pushed into it because its fashion!!

Yy to keeping this here as well, I wouldn't have noticed it elsewhere.

If it’s a useful heads-up to anyone at all, I will be content with that.

Thank you @DoubleTweenQueen- this has prompted me to fill in the consultation.

I'm blown away that they're considering banning experts talking about the possibility there might be other things making you sad than automatically being trans.

I'd have been all over non-binary when I was 14. 100% would have been in a binder. It was nothing to do with positively transforming into my true self, it was all to do with escaping the shame & negative feelings about my body not conforming to the very narrow expectation that at 14 I should be thin.

Banning talking therapy means only the most biased affirmative agenda is left, surely?

Excellent thread, @DoubleTweenQueen. I know what you mean about vegetarian / extreme socialist activism online - it's all (when combined) part of an online culture where genderism is particularly heavily pushed.

The Minecraft thing is interesting - I have a niece who has gone through baby lesbian, demigirl pansexual to transboy in the space of 15 months who is heavily, heavily into minecraft and anime which is the other major red flag. There are some other issues at play including parental divorce and loss of a pivotal grandparent, plus moving schools and some desperation to find her tribe at play. Unfortunately I only know all this because she has confided in my DD who at almost 12 thinks this desperation to label and confine oneself is silly and so tells me about it. I've no idea how much her parents know although she has said she isn't ready to come out at home so I think she has at school. Such a worry as I'm sure they will be affirming away with no consequences for them.

@LimpLettice

These are exactly the children who need careful qualified psychologists/psychotherapists to explore these feelings and worries in a safe space. If these professionals are criminalised by this bill, where are these vulnerable kids going to get their advice and support? Social media and captured schools?

@endofthelinefinally it's such a minefield. At the moment, as far as I can see, her support is LGBTQLMNOPQ obsessed NQTs and Tiktok.

After much deliberation I haven't spoken to her dad who I'm related to. I know he thinks the anime / minecraft obsession is fabulous because he is of that generation of geeky boys (70's baby) who don't realise how different and sexualised mainstream anime is to the stuff we watched as teens. He's also dealing with the loss of his mum and is in a new relationship. I've contemplated speaking to an actual aunt (I'm more distant) but she is NHS / birth industry /pronouns/ rainbow lanyard mad and I think she will push affirmation even harder. Now thinking that parents and medical professionals will face issues with exploring all her other problems instead of affirmation is horrifying.

Schools are not bloody qualified, and given the 5000% increase in girls doing this, the Tavis own admission that there are always comorbidities and often abuse involved, the sheer homophobia of current gender ideology, this bill is such a huge issue for parents.

Don't beat yourself up.
As a vegetarian of 30+ years, I get it. Part of the ancient box-ticking exercise of 'right on' causes teens and young adults show growing interest in.
'Wolfie Smith' except recorded forever, on social media.
I remember being that sanctimonious bastard myself

(Re: Minecraft - Please tell me isn't Smallishbeans, LDshadowlady, Seepkay(sp.) or Joey Graceffa!)

I worry why it is all girls and very few boys - indicates it isn't social acceptance but rather social contagion. After all, who wouldn't prefer to grow up to be a man in this society? We devalue women so much, they get a really crappy deal.

I'd be a man if I could TBH. However it isn't possible so I just have to get on with it. I certainly don't want a life on medication and surgery to pretend that I'm a man.

Every parent should read "Irreversible Damage" by Abigail Shrier. It is a clear, concise and easy read.

@LimpLettice

Oh shit my dd well into anime why is that another red flag??

I think there definitely need to be questions asked about 'always affirm'. My oldest, assigned female at birth, is like a few of their chums, identifying as non-binary. I have explained my feelings about they don't have to rush to identify gender/sexuality and that we can object to sterotypes without identifying out of gender, but I'm respecting their choices and I'm also relieved to hear they are happy with their body and they don't think they are male, and I'm keeping channels open so that it doesn't become us vs peers.

I totally believe people are trans and that a tiny number of people are non-binary, but I also think that rather than giving kids an impression that it's all a spectrum, we should be clear that being trans is not really that common, and that disliking your body/self/wondering about your identity is normal adolescent behaviour and not a sign you are trans. And that exploratory therapy is not 'conversion therapy', but checking whether there's trauma, whether there's anxiety and depression created by societal expectations of gender and leaving things open to find the right solution. Which may be transisition, but more often will be getting support to accept and love themselves.

The ban on conversion therapy is not entirely linked to the issue of not investigating causes or co-morbidities of gender dysphoria. That started decades ago when constraints in health care meant the process to investigate alternative diagnosis is often not gone through properly. Mental health care has been badly affected by this, but so have many other areas. Banning conversion therapy might have consequences in this area, but conversion therapy has long had very terrible consequences so I'm not sure how to weigh up the risks there. I know some who have had benefits with online courses for Acceptance and Commitment Therapy and/or emotional processing or ones like courses.therapynutshell.com/, but mental health care, particularly for teenager, is a big issue well beyond this.

Problem is, schools are running on a shoe string and a prayer being asked to cover all concerns of society and those groups put themselves forward for filling in that gap. On top of that, it's seen as 'good' inspection-wise to develop connections with external partners and for some there aren't many options they can afford. Many schools are putting in stricter measures now with the amount of visibile backlash, but it's difficult while dealing with all the shite going on right now.

The headteachers I know try to be as neutral as possible, do the recommended watch-and-wait and are against pushing a child to make any sort of fixed decision; however, when a child comes in using a different name - what would you like schools to do?

I mean, even way back in the sands of time of my childhood, most schools allowed kids to have a "known as", I for a few years had multiple ones. Being the reckless child with suicidal ideation, my using one name for PE and another for maths was likely the least of their concerns. No one taught me to do that, no one talked to my parents about it, no one really talked to me about it even being lucky enough to have in-school therapy and group therapy, no one tried to stop me doing it other than my some of my peers mocking me, but I wouldn't say I was enabled, I was just left to that. Looking back, I can see I was a child with a lot of trauma response dysfunction and this kind of fresh name, fresh start idea had it's good and bad points that I've had to rego through as an adult.

I agree there is an issue with lobby groups like Stonewall providing resources and giving talks for schools, and I recommend getting involved in schools to know and be part of discussing things like PSHE policy; however, many kids I know by secondary age are mocking what is going on in PSHE and I have far more concerns about kids getting isolated in social media and social shifts coming through that than I am what's going on in schools. Schools to me are the end symptom of wider social issues and messages going on, they're fire fighting what's going on everywhere else and many of the things listed as concerns like name changes is for me another symptom. The way identity has become wrapped up in pain and this ideal of a true self identity and enjoyment being something to individual own, control and to build for others to consume & that 'best true self life' is little different to the idea that a fresh start fixes everything that hurts when more often than not, that is very temporary relief and when it comes, it's onto the next change to a fix. The very individualistic identity concepts ignores much of how identity form and how we cope with life's suffering and accepting that suffering is a normal part of life. There are many trends that have involved a solution for that which an individual can get if they just change enough, and it's largely harmful if understandable.

@Imdreamingofapeacefulxmas keep an eye on what she is watching! So much of it is is horribly sexualised, with some really extreme stuff - lots of trans characters, but lots of hentai which is monster porn, paedo porn, horrible stuff. Lots of the tra crowd online use anime avatars, are really active in anime communities and have extensive crossover with the furry crowd. Naming no names have a look at Glinners pages on certain ex lib dem members and their husbands writing porn about child Digimon characters and posing in nappies as little girls.

It is really worth watching James Esses on the Graham Linehan video. He explains that conversion therapy (in the sexual orientation context) is really extremely rare in this country. What there is generally takes place in certain religious and cultural groups who are often covered by religious exemptions that may well not be included in the proposed bill. The whole subject needs much more careful thought and examination, not to be rushed through in order to reduce scrutiny by the public generally and parents in particular.

[quote LimpLettice]@Imdreamingofapeacefulxmas keep an eye on what she is watching! So much of it is is horribly sexualised, with some really extreme stuff - lots of trans characters, but lots of hentai which is monster porn, paedo porn, horrible stuff. Lots of the tra crowd online use anime avatars, are really active in anime communities and have extensive crossover with the furry crowd. Naming no names have a look at Glinners pages on certain ex lib dem members and their husbands writing porn about child Digimon characters and posing in nappies as little girls. [/quote]
This. Keep an eye on any adverts that pop up. I got a really revolting anime one a year or so back when this subject was being discussed on FWR (shudders).

Oh shit.

Bloody hell.

Is there any series in particular?

Just googled glinner pages and nothing came up, perhaps someone could pm me please

TMWI with James Esses.
If you put this in google search it should bring up The Mess We're In video link.

@endofthelinefinally Thanks- I will look at that x