AIBU or are my kids awful

[legalseagull]

I'm so hurt. I have a 3yo DD and 2yo DS. They're amazing kids (obviously)

Last Christmas we spent it at my mum and step dads. Three nights. At that point the kids were JUST turned 3 and 1. Both were terrible sleepers. My eldest was also in the terrible 2's. Plus it was Christmas and a year of lockdown so the first time staying away. so over excited and stimulated. That being said, I don't think they were too bad. The break ended in the biggest argument I've ever had with my mum though. After days of little digs every time one of the whinged or tantrummed (for example when 1yo got upset that her dog stole his toy), it came to a end when they were screaming not to go to bed. They kept opening the bedroom door and shouting to come down. DH went up to calm them and DM started her "no wonder they cry if you pander / spoiling / lack discipline routine.

Fast forward to last weekend. We went again for three nights (they live far away). They're now a year older and generally much happier and calmer. All weekend they were brilliant in my view. A delight. On the last day they were obviously shattered, falling asleep etc. Step dad made Sunday lunch and the kids wouldn't eat it. "No. Don't want it". They also both threw admittedly huge tantrums when trying to leave. Thankfully my mum seems to have learnt to bite her lip. Step dad however started saying how he "didn't envy us. Kids playing up. Lacking discipline. Naughty at dinner. You need to do X Y Z"

AIBU to think they're pretty normal kids and it's just their ages, and being so close in age meaning they wind each other up?! I'm so upset that my parents ignore the 3 days of wonderful behaviour and just judge and criticise me for the bad. We don't feel welcome there at all. As soon as the kids whinge or strop I instantly feel judged and then get told all the things I'm doing wrong.

Remember Dh grandfather and child free younger brother tutting and eye rolling and doing a “kids these days” thing at dds rudeness in not thanking them properly for a present. She was about 9 months at the time.

My dad really struggled with the noise and constant on the go of toddlers - we got to stay with them. It does get better as they get older. I just used to grit my teeth and smile as its not worth falling out over.

I don’t know what it is about some mothers they seem to forget or have rose tinted glasses about how their children behaved when small. Mine still does it and she wants my asd 10 year old to learn to behave normally - I can’t argue with her she just does this flipping annoying patronising head shake and eye roll it’s so infuriating.

Toddlers are difficult, especially 2 close together and it’s quite exhausting - I have 2 a year apart (older 2 have 5 years between them then 4 between my 16 year old & 11 year old) so I had my hands full when they were small and they were pretty good but still prone to the mother of all tantrums at times.

I think you should concentrate on how good they were and if your parents bring it up if just tell them the kids were great all weekend but you choose to be negative about one half day when they were tired etc did your mother not try to help? I’d have just taken them down from the table and off for naps but I think they’ve probably forgotten what toddlers can be like. It was a strange house and bed of course they’ll get up etc.
Frustrating op but just move on - my parents live far away too and it’s handy we don’t have to visit often as it’s draining

My mum insists I never tantrummed at 2 or 3. I smile and nod, because frankly we all know that's bs!

Actually, DC1, who is now 5 never had a tantrum at 2 or 3 - not because I'm an amazing mum but because he had an incredibly placid temperament. At 5 it's a different story and he does have difficulty managing his emotions when tired. DC2 is a typical tantrumer though.

OP, I wouldn't go at Christmas, kids are more excitable then and are more likely to be exuberant when not in their own home. Your kids sound totally normal and your DM sounds like she has a selective memory.

I have kids slightly younger than yours. We stay at my parent's house when visiting. My kids behave much better than this but I think that's cus my oldest is very calm for his age. Similarly, they both go to sleep with no fuss. Having said that, my parents still can't handle it for long. It's too much for elderly people. Last couple of times, we've booked our own accommodation. We didn't argue or anything but my Dad just told me they couldn't cope which I thought was fair enough.

Maskingforit LOL best response ever!

You also see adults do it about themselves all the time, it drives me mad. They see a toddler acting up in a restaurant and say they'd have never been 'allowed to get away with that:
a) children are not the best judges of their own behaviour and how annoying (or otherwise) it is to adults
b) you don't remember being two, you're thinking about being taken out for a meal when you were about eight so it's neither surprising or impressive that you didn't act like a toddler!

The fact is young kids can be stressful to be around. I dreaded taking my kids to stay anywhere when there were young, even my own parents, because I could see that their behaviour wore people out. Book somewhere else to stay when you see them, or they can come to you and stay in a hotel.

I think as well that elderly people do tend to forget what small DC are like .SD is getting on in years, and has knocked himself out cooking a nice dinner for you all .LO decides he would rather have fish fingers! SD probably a bit tired and feels his efforts not appreciated. Small DC are unreasonable at times ,Thats how they are .Maybe try a premier Inn nearby or similar next time .You will be able to go to hotel in the evenings ,chill and see them the next day .Perhaps at the park ,Beauty spot or wherever DC can run around .

@TheYearOfSmallThings

My mum insists I never tantrummed at 2 or 3. I smile and nod, because frankly we all know that's bs!

I would sort of love this. Whatever atrocity DS commits, my DM laughs and says "Ha! That's NOTHING! You were much worse than that!". Which I am certain is untrue.

Haha whenever my DD is doing something particularly exasperating in front of my mum she laughs and says ‘sorry but this is karma!’

I think attitudes to parenting have changed a lot. My mum was horrified that I breastfed on demand rather than restricting my baby to feeding every 3-4 hours, even though I told her multiple times that healthcare professionals advise it. She was much stricter on us when we were young so yes, we probably were better behaved. I’m more relaxed with my son and sometimes her negative comments do bother me but at end of the day my son’s happiness is my priority.

@OwlinaTree

In my experience, some people with grown up children become very selective about how their children behaved when they were young and what sort of parent they were.

We are also programmed to forget all the difficult bits and focus on the good bits!

My parents love their grandchildren to bits and are actually very supportive, but I know they get a bit worn out with the noise as they are not used to it.

It will get easier op. Your children don't sound unusual to me. It might be easier for the parents to come to you perhaps while they are so young.

I would agree with this comment. Sometimes either the grandparents forget or they view it all through rose tinted classes. Or sometimes they are just out of the habit of dealing with toddlers.

There may also be other factors at play due to your historical relationshiop with them. Jealousy even.

I had one of my grown up siblings voice criticisms about my toddler even though she had never had kids of her own. No idea of how that tiredness/hungry/unfamiliar environment/excitement thing can play out with toddlers and disrupt their routine, especially on special occasions like Christmas where expectations generally run high anyway with all concerned, and where to be honest there is usually a lot of sweets/sugary food involved which tends to hype them up anyway.

I also used to get a lot of flack for trying to limit their sugar intake on such occasions. Some but not all granparents see it as an act of love to give sweets etc.

Not so much for the parents. I totally noticed throughout DD's younger years that her behaviour was always more hyper when she ate party foods, or too much sugar. Occasionally of course it is fine, but a parent can't be blamed for wanting to stick to a routine because they know it works best.

Outdoors helps. But then again older folks (and I now class myself as one of those) may be reluctant to brave the weather.
With toddlers though, it really helps for them to burn their steam off outdoors...

So as a mum you have got a whole load of different needs going on there and a mismatch.

If you ask me that is where the arguments come from.
Hungry/not right types of foods as Christmas
Expectations (too high on their part and possibly yours_

It's like that thing that people say going on holiday with kids is never a holiday. (Except perhaps if it an extremely child friendly hotel where everything is organised, you can be outdoors and it is a kids club) and adults can have a few hours off.

Just something that looking back on it all I wish I had worked out earlier.

But parenting doesn't come with instructions or a manual. Therefore even more important to exchange on here so that you don't blame yourself.

Just the way toddlers are.

what the dgs are saying is 'I feel tired and cross because your children are screaming and I will try and generalise this in to a wider point to validate those feelings".
they're old and grumpy. my lovely df was the same, making no allowances for dc at all.

re the stay: imo it's always a day 3 thing when things go wrong....could you reduce your stay length?
also it gets easier when the dc get older. very sadly my df didn't get to see this.
your kids are lovely!

I think you're right about the age gap, mine were never like this. Dd2 was a bit trickier but dealing with one is easier. My brother had 2 close in age like yours and your description describes every visit as toddlers. They'd set each other off constantly and I'd often say rather you than me. As teens though they are a delight, close and barely argue. Mine hate each other and the constant arguments are so stressful - I'd rather the toddler tantrums.
3 days is a long time to stay with others with dc that age though and nerves are bound to get frayed all round. Perhaps stay elsewhere next rime and visit for the afternoon etc

Ugh my mum and MIL were like this, critiquing and commenting on every little thing. At times I ignored it, other times I blew my top.

They would smugly regale me with stories of their own children's exemplary behaviour which was all total crap of course. Grandparents have a VERY selective memory about their own stellar parenting techniques. Also don't forget that for our generation it was common place to be smacked. Lots of parents controlled their kids through fear. We can obviously don't do that anymore!

Some people are just not ‘children’ people.

My son is more or less grown up, but when he was little, he had his good days and bad days of course.

Regardless of what my child was like, I can’t bare spending time with other people’s little kids. I hate the tantrums; the clinginess; the mess; the whinging; the crying; the bumps; the giggling etc etc. I can’t tolerate it.

In my mind, all of the children are a pain in the bum and when friends with kids visit, I can’t wait for them to leave again.

I appreciate it must make you feel pretty rubbish when it’s your mum and your children. If it’s any consolation my mum refused to have mine over until he was about 11 😂

I’d perhaps book a Premier Inn or something next time I visit, so everyone has a bit of space and privacy. And then you don’t have to listen to the remarks which make you feel like a failing parent…because you’re not…you are normal.

They’ve just forgotten and lost their tolerance.

I have memories of my children being the politest , well mannered children ever . In reality they were little bastards at times They are now the most wonderful caring adults

You are not alone

oh yes kids can be bloody awful! I am a nana, my dgs is adored by both me and dh, we had him last night, he is 6, at 4.45 this morning my darling whispered in my ear that he 'really really needed a bowl of those tiger cereals' stupid stupid me had left the new box out on the side and he saw it! He is not allowed Frosties at home, so they are a treat that nana gives him The little darling must have been dreaming of them all night! I am bloody knackered now and need a little kip.

Seriously, most kids play up/trantrum ect when little, usually just when you need them to behave like the angels you know they can be I think OP your mum has just forgotten this fact!

@Yourstupidityexhaustsme

Babies HORRIFY me and I had my own not so long ago.

People forget what it’s like to have children of a certain age and automatically think they’d do amazingly in your place.

You’re doing NOTHING wrong. Little kids are AWFUL. They don’t reason, they don’t rationalise, they don’t behave, they are miniature little narcissists who know EXACTLY what they want and woe betide anyone who gets in their way.

They are like that now, they were like that in the 90’s, 80’s, 70’s….. they don’t eventually grow out of it. Their parents TEACH them how to be nice and how to behave etc.

Your kids are better behaved this time? Fucking go you! You taught them that!

Ignore your mum and step dad. Raising kids is a different world now. When we were little we didn’t cry at bedtime, if we did we got shouted at/smacked and put back to bed. Your kids know you’ll come and listen when they cry.

They don’t like a roast dinner? Often we had to sit at the table until we cleared our plates.

Parenting is different at every generation and because it differs from how your parents raised you don’t let them convince you you’re doing it ‘wrong’.

Would you put a baby face down in a cot surrounded by bumpers covered in a woollen blanket? No. Because times and parenting and ‘what’s best’ changes.

You do you, parent your kids however you want and fuck what anyone else thinks.

I love this post.

I'd just stop visiting and say why

My PILS definitely have selective memory qbout what kind of parents they were. They were aggressive, shouty and uninterested parents. My husband says his ehole childhood was sad. Now they are older they have become saintly gentle grandparent types but when my children are even slightly disagreeable or overly tired they always have a disparaging comment to make. Makes me so mad!!!!

Your kids sound totally normal, fuss over food and fuss over leaving are par for the course at that age. Kids get tired and fed up especially when they are on adult territory and being expected to sit quietly while adults converse etc. And as you say yours are close in age so wind each other up.
Sounds like your Step dad was offended that the kids didn't want his food so he reacted to that = he probably didn;t mean it, it would be him being childish in the moment and forgetting not to take everything small kids say seriously. If I had a pou d for every time one of mine said they didn't like me or I wasn't their friend, I'd be rolling rich by now. I certainly wouldn't get offended over any kids not wanting to eat. (I wonder if they'd had to wait longer than usual for their meal because SD was faffing around being the Cook, so were over tired and over hungry?)

Anyway, I'd avoid visiting at over stimulating times like Christmas, I'd limit time spent together so kids don't get fed up. And I'd ask your Mum and SD why they don't praise when the kids are good when they are so quick to criticise if they make a mistake ?

@MaskingForIt

Practice this in front of the mirror: “ tinkly laugh gosh Boomer, you must have forgotten what having toddlers is like”

But OP seems like a normal nice person, and not an unmitigated cunt. Why would she want to do this?

Toddlers are awful...that's normal. I think people totally forget what they're like once their kids grow up. Also people get used to their quiet life so being around very young children for a significant amount of time is a shock to their system.

There’s an element of it that all of us become inured to our own kids’ behaviour, so we see as “perfectly normal” things which others might see as awful (or amazingly good, on the other hand). And it’s hard for anyone to give you an outsider’s view on the Internet! The fact you’re questioning it yourself suggests that you’re not completely blind to your own kids, though - so if your balanced view is 80% good, 20% tantrums, then that’s probably what it is. And as most people have said, that’s what most kids are like! In any case, if you find your mum and stepdad hard work, then I’d spend less time with them.