To ask what we vote for now? (Anti Tory thread)

[Imposter1]

I have voted Tory in the past. It was more lack of sensible other options. They seemed the best of a bad bunch.

I will never vote for them again though. The nail in the coffin for me was MP admitting that life was a struggle on £82k. And he “had childcare to pay for” so needed 2nd jobs beyond being an MP. They have been slowly pissing me off for years and it’s just tipped over for me.

I’m done. But what else is there? I’m not sure where I fit in.

Things that are important to me are:
-women’s rights (I’m not a fan of the current narrative of deleting women… e.g. “pregnant people”, allowing trans people into women’s prisons etc)

• women’s safety
• childcare- making it more affordable and easier for women to return to work after kids
• bring back family centres that were closed down
• giving adequate funding to NHS, police, education (and proper front line funding, not a bunch of made up jobs that pay ridiculous amounts for being a “manager”)
• someone who cares about the environment and doesn’t just make promises that never come true

Is there actually a party that would suit me?

If you're pissed off with the Tories, and have a Tory MP, then vote for the candidate most likely to oust the Tory.

Politics isn't pick'n'mix and there's never going to be a party with a set of policies that matches exactly what you want, so you might as well vote against the one that's cocking everything up.

I'm a left-wing Labour supporter, and in some ways I'm relieved I live in a Con/LD marginal. It means I don't have to wrestle with my conscience to decide whether or not to vote for Starmer's pale shadow of what Labour used to be.

Who else can we vote for at the moment other than Tory? I'm not even a Tory myself but let's face it - Labour have fucked themselves up and Liberal have done fuck all.

@TrickorTreacle

Who else can we vote for at the moment other than Tory? I'm not even a Tory myself but let's face it - Labour have fucked themselves up and Liberal have done fuck all.

I can't take this seriously. This kind of "thinking" is exactly why we have a shit government most people (who even bothered to vote) didn't vote for.

How the fuck can anyone say "I'm not a Tory" and vote Tory? That is being a Tory - you ARE a Tory if you vote Tory.

@LakieLady

If you're pissed off with the Tories, and have a Tory MP, then vote for the candidate most likely to oust the Tory.

Politics isn't pick'n'mix and there's never going to be a party with a set of policies that matches exactly what you want, so you might as well vote against the one that's cocking everything up.

I'm a left-wing Labour supporter, and in some ways I'm relieved I live in a Con/LD marginal. It means I don't have to wrestle with my conscience to decide whether or not to vote for Starmer's pale shadow of what Labour used to be.

Agreed - on all points.

I totally agree with you but I’ve no idea how we fix it - in my view we want MPs (from all parties) to have more ‘real life’ experience - and certainly cabinet & shadow cabinet need to have a track record of management, and ideally some experience in the sector of the office they’re asked to deal with. Kier Starmer has this in spades but the rest of the shadow cabinet are, well, not great and I’d trust them less than the Tories😬 (politest description I can come up with🙈).

The lots of new parties you're asking for just serve to split the non Tory vote and make a Tory win even more likely.

My advice? (why you would want that though, I am not sure :-) )

Isolate what is most important to you, and choose a party that covers that area. As mentioned, short of starting your own party, you will almost certainly never find a party that actually provide exactly what you are looking for.

For me - it is voting methods. Our FPTP system for General Elections is what allows a minority government to rule, and effectively ignore the wishes of the majority. Note that this is NOT just a Tory failing - even though I am (broadly) centre/left wing, I resent the Blair years for this aspect as well. I will vote for a party that supports a degree of electoral reform. Even then - I know if it ever went through, it would not be perfect, but it WOULD be an improvement on what we have now!!

I’d trust them less than the Tories

And there's the problem. We have a government that repeatedly demonstrates they are a gang of corrupt liars but for some reason the opposition are still seen to be worse? WTAF? My dog could be comfortably less corrupt and incompetent than the current Tory lot.

@Kendodd

The lots of new parties you're asking for just serve to split the non Tory vote and make a Tory win even more likely.

Exactly - due to our shit electoral system.

Is there actually a party that would suit me

Not if women’s rights is anywhere on your list of important issues. Certainly not Labour, Lib Dem’s or the Greens, anyway.

I was so pissed off about Brexit, I moved from Tories to Lib Dem at the last election. But it's a bloody wilderness out there in Lib-Dem land.

What I've found there is Momentum supporters licking their wounds trying to drive another party into ruin, fringe issues like Trident and trans-rights, and no clear strategy on how to handle the shit-show of Brexit. I want competition between the parties. I trust Kier Starmer, I agree that we need balanced politics between left and right (hence my LibDem membership), but at the moment the Tories are just way out in front. It's too easy for them at the moment, and that's depressing.

Sorry OP but you're on a fool's errand if you hope to find a political party that meets your requirements.

You want services to be funded properly, but this relies on taxes. People won't vote for parties that say they will put up taxes by the amount that they would need to go up by. We're not talking a few percent here and there, they'd need to go up to more like 50% of income for all taxpayers.

The promotion of women's rights will never be popular with about half of the population because more rights for women means less for men. Why would you expect men to vote themselves into a weaker position when you want women to be in a stronger one? It's nonsensical - I mean, I understand your point of view, but it's illogical to assume enough men will agree with you.

Perhaps it should be easier to get into politics

Erm, it's pretty easy. You just pay your deposit and campaign to get elected. If your ideas are as good as you think you will be able to convince people. Politics is a career you need literally no qualifications or experience to follow. Whether you succeed or not depends on your ability. Most people who complain about politicians don't want to put in the work or take the risk to do it themselves.

“Whether you succeed or not depends on your ability”

Utter bullshit. It’s no coincidence that politics is made up of the same types of people that have connections.

Are we saying Boris has a good ability at politics? He’s a terrible public speaker and is dishonest to his core. He doesn’t come across as clever.

Not any difference between Tories or Labour these days and I would never vote for either of them.

@Imposter1

Are we saying Boris has a good ability at politics? He’s a terrible public speaker and is dishonest to his core. He doesn’t come across as clever.

And yet you voted Tory.

You need to decide which of your points are most important to you.
You won't find a party that caters to all of them.
Voting tactically for anyone who threatens your current MP's seat might mean voting against everything you believe in.

OP, I'm in a similar position, but coming from the 'other side' - I've never voted Tory but feel like I have run out of options. It's depressing (and before anyone says it - I'd be a terrible politician. I just want to be able to use my vote).

“And yet you voted Tory”

At the time the alternative was worse. Corbyn and I couldn’t even tell you the LD names 😂Voting preferences can change you know.

I see this all the time on Twitter. People wanting to make a change, calling out politicians. Christ, even the Daily Mail has been running stories about corruption and sleaze!

Yet we are shot down each time “well you voted Tory so it’s your fault”

I believe the correct response should be “well xyz party offers this and this point is important to them… would you consider them as an alternative?”

@CatsArePeople

We need whoever will stand up to pharmaceutical tyranny

Amen.

Things that are important to me are:
-women’s rights (I’m not a fan of the current narrative of deleting women… e.g. “pregnant people”, allowing trans people into women’s prisons etc)

For those reasons above Labour are unelectable. Reducing women to body parts (chest feeders, menstruators, cervix havers) is the norm for Labour now.

For those saying "oh but it's inclusive language" let's have a poll on who wants MumsNet changed to any of these:

ChestFeederNet
MenstruatorNet
CervixHaverNet
PregnantPeopleNet

The issue is there is no real alternative… it is dumb and dumber!

I would never vote for any party that wants to delete women and put the rights of trans people ahead of my own. I do not want to live in a world where we give out chest binders to young girls and paint The road crossings in trans flag colours (even though it makes it hard for guidedogs to see and puts blind people in danger).

I would say women and children are at the top of my importance list. Because I think they have had a crap deal in recent years.

Assume that some parties will be out for me because some of them don’t care for women.

I don't know who to vote for in the next election, I feel politically homeless.

We need a new party made up of honest and reliable people. It shouldn't be this hard.

Everybody who beats the Tories up for starving our NHS - you do realise that it'll be 40% of ALL government expenditure soon, right? Just the increase in NHS spending is more than the entire defence budget. And yet people cry that it's not enough. Where the fuck does it all go?