DD wants to do different interest badges at Brownies, but can’t AIBU?

[TheLoveOfBrownies]

DD is 7, started Brownies in September and recently done her promise.

She did Rainbows for a year before that.

The interest badges that are done at home, DD wants to do different ones to the ones offered but Brown Owl keeps saying she can’t, she can only do 1 interest badge per term and she must do the badge suggested by Brown Owl, Rainbows was the same, she was not awarded any interest badge she did that was not the one suggested. So for example she wanted to Animal Lover, Drawing, Fruit and Veg, Nature, Recycling and Book Lover at Rainbows and they made her do Construction, Agility and Family Tree.

It feels really restrictive and not in the spirit of Guiding, especially as I as her mum am giving up time for her to do the badges outside of the meetings.

I’ve offered to pay for the badges and was told they can’t stop me but they won’t be verified or given out in her meetings, I offered to help with the meetings, and was told yes but they have a programme they follow so can’t change the badges they offer, I even offered to have a small group of the girls and do an interest badge with all of them but was told no, it has to be the badge for that term only.

DD loves Brownies so I won’t take her out but it does feel unfair that the interest badges are supposed to be pick and choose and we don’t get that option.

I’ve heard the other Rainbows and Brownies Groups locally are the same and don’t let you choose your interest badge. So changing groups won’t help.

It just feels a bit restrictive, surely she should be able to do 2 badges per term (1 each half term) at least? Especially as we've been told that there will no sleepovers or camps until at least October 2022 so she won't get those badges towards her theme awards either.

AIBU? And are all Guiding groups the same now?

@00100001

The only rule we had for interest badges, is you couldn't do them "by accident"

Let's pretend there's a badge called "learn a new skill". And you'd started gymnastics,and had just learnt how to do a backup. You weren't allowed to just flip through the book and go "oh well I l learned to backflip last month I've earned that badge".

You'd have to do it the other way round. See that the badge exists, check the clauses, then resolve to learn the new skill (even if it is a backflip in gymnastics).

Kind of made the girls take it a bit more seriously, and consider their choices, rather than a way to 'blag' their way to an award.

The only one she could of done straight away with little evidence was Animal Lover for Rainbows, all the other she'd have had to work for, there are some badges she has no chance of getting like the Growing/Nature stuff as we have no garden but if we can we'd skip those.

Not little evidence with little effort is what I mean, as she helps with our cat daily. She has tasks daily associated to those.

Ours was a un official rule, and we used it maybe .... Five times in 10 years???
But if your DD could show she liked after an existing animal etc that's fine. We wouldn't have expected her to get a new pet for example!

My daughter gave up brownies and moved to scouts precisely because of this sort of thing. Compared to other brownie packs in different areas hers did very little and we’re very restrictive . Lovely leaders but there was never a sleepover, trip or anything. Just decorating biscuits, cards, crafts etc and badges that could be got from those. She felt it was like a club aimed at a very particular type of girl stereotype which was fine but dull for her.

Scouts on the other hand is brilliant! Exciting even over zoom, plenty of variety and opportunities to do activities and badges. Same area and same local resources but very different attitude on our area.

I'm Brown Owl. No overlap with scouts (in terms of badges), we have overlap in our village as we share stuff, premises etc.

I think you might be confused with interest badges and skill builders.

So, the girls can do any interest badges when they want, eg baking, archeology, dancing etc.
We then do the skill builders eg first aid, camping in the meetings

BUT they also have to do the unit meeting activities - 3 hours for that colour in order to get that theme award - to qualify for the bronze/silver award.

So this term in my unit we are doing (mainly) - Green have adventure theme award:
So in order to get the theme award for the section (to put towards the bronze/silver/gold award) they need to do three things

1. Al skill builder (at BrowniesC) we 've done aCmp 2 (fire fighting stuff, tent building and torch games)
2. 3 hours of Green UMA (at brownies) connected to that theme - we've done a night hike, fire building, first aid, hedgehog huts and space stuff.
3. A Green connected interest badge at home - so Aviation, Space, Archeology

I agree, it is unnecessarily complicated, I'm used to doing presentations and I struggled to get across how it worked to the parents>.

Even that's not clear! So they have to do 3 hours of green activities and then green skill builder + a green interest badge to get their theme award for that section.

OP pm me and I'll call you if it's not clear.

Try cubs. Way more flexible that that.

As other leaders have said, your unit is doing it wrong. She can do any interest badge she likes at any point. Wish I could get mine to do interest badges!!

I found when the new programme came in, leaders decided to pick and choose what they wanted to do. Some do the program correctly, 👏 others won’t even look at the current interest badges anymore, and use unofficial badges bought from other units who sell them to fundraise.

This might be ok to some, but it’s a bit of a pisser buying the official badge book at £8 as a parent only to be told they don’t do those badges and don’t care what GG say. Also results in a bunch of randomly sized and designed badges.

*pressed post too quick

What I’m saying is leaders aren’t bothering to keep to the programme, which has been implemented long enough now. Everyone’s doing things their own way and it’s frustrating the girls & parents.

Yep. I remember this at brownies when I was a kid in the early 2000s. I barely got any badges because they didn't let us pick them and tbh it felt like we were there just to mess around and make cards 🙄 I must've got maybe 5... in 3 years.

If we'd been allowed in scouts back then I'd have opted for that.

That's crap, I'm no longer in a unit, but still have my Leadership Qualification and can award badges.
I'd give her the interest badge as long as I saw the evidence!
A friend of mines DD had a Brown Owl who was a bit militant an arsehole and wouldn't award her certain badges due not 'fulfilling the criteria' she did, and was so upset at not getting her final badge, friend was telling me this over a glass of wine one night, I asked to see what her DD had done.
I took a look that weekend and awarded her the badge myself (lucky enough to have a GG shop nearby) and signed her badge book. Apparently BO was furious but tough, I can certainly award them and will do! I'd do the same in a heartbeat for other Brownies.
When we attended some local events with other leaders, we'd always come away a bit shocked at how some of the older ones treated their units. Yes I know their volunteers but that's never an excuse to be a miserable arsehole to young girls, and then wonder why they struggle to maintain their numbers :(

@LSLLM

*pressed post too quick

What I’m saying is leaders aren’t bothering to keep to the programme, which has been implemented long enough now. Everyone’s doing things their own way and it’s frustrating the girls & parents.

You should complain.

They can do 20% off program time, but with the younger units,they actually struggle to fit the programme in sometimes as meetings are often shorter than Guides, and Brownies/Rainbows are absent more often, because they're oftentimes not in as much control about their attendance.

This doesn't sound right to me and not in the spirit of the programme at all. We have the opposite problem... I have a stack of badges that I need to sew on to DD's brownie blanket!! The owls take a genuine interest in the girls as individuals and jump on any opportunity to encourage them to achieve badges in addition to the ones they work on during meetings.

Ok this is the extreme version, but I think I’d go rogue and push the case up the ladder if need be. Let the leaders explain to their structure why they are limiting opportunities. Honestly this is why I think Girl Scouts suck (I’m in the US but it sounds similar). Too stifling.

The whole point is to let the girls grow and learn and become independent women. But honestly the programs are geared toward some weird feel good, everyone else’s feelings at your own expense, mushy, #bekind experience.

It should be about independence, personal growth, and skill building.

Ughh sorry this is a huge pet hate of mine.

When i joined Brownies, the first badge they made me do was House Orderly. It had a picture of a broom on it. We had to do lots of types of cleaning and housework. My mum was horrified!

So she can do them, just not get the public acclaim? I'd crack on and do them then.

Girls should have free choice for interest badges. That's kind of the point!
Ask the Leader to make sure DD hasn't misunderstood. If you're sure it is, then escalate it up until you get a sensible answer. If the Leader us restricting it and refusing to award badges she's running it wrong.

Has anyone posted this link? Their unit leader needs to read this! www.girlguiding.org.uk/what-we-do/our-badges-and-activities/programme-for-every-girl/interest-badges/

Blimey, Brownies has got a bit militant since we were kids, hasn't it??

That's such a shame that your daughter is effectively having her interests stifled because the badge she wants to do isn't on the "approved" list. If she's wanting to do extra badges alongside the ones approved for that term, then what's the problem?? If anything they should be giving her a badge for going above and beyond in her dedication to Brownies!

When I was a kid, I did loads of additional badges alongside the ones we did as a group in Brownies.

In fact, I once famously took on the Gardening badge whilst knowing absolutely nothing about gardening and when the Brown Owl asked me to name some common weeds, I shrugged my shoulders and said, "I don't know the actual names for them but if you took me out into the garden, I could point out which ones are weeds". Still got the badge! I swear, 7-year-old me was an absolute riot 😂

I’m a guide leader and if BO is running it like that she’s got the need programme training very wrong.
Your little one can do the interest badges however she wants, she could get all the take action ones if she wants, just only one will count towards theme, bronze, silver, gold awards.
I just want to check she’s not attempting to do skill builders at home, because I know in the rainbow and brownie books they have quite big descriptions for them in the book and we had brownie/rainbow parents come in and tell us Flossy had done this badge at home when they were instead pointing at a skill builder and not a interest badge.
Your leader should be doing a varied programme over the year hitting all areas, we try and take a balance and will do one skill builder per term and then a couple of unit meeting activities (UMA) in the same colour but also mix it up with off programme activities, UMAs from other colours, trips etc.
I will back up not running residential yet, the paperwork is very restrictive and we do this on top of our jobs. Secondly I cannot afford the time off work if exposed to covid and the risk is higher on residential vs socially distanced meetings, therefore we won’t be looking to run residential until summer term this year. Also residential with brownies is hard due to the adult to child ratio. Units always need more volunteers perhaps you’d like to join and look at leadership and then you can have an impact on how your daughters unit is run!
I would say stick with girl guiding as single sex spaces are really important for young girls and as she gets older there are some incredible opportunities to travel the world with her county or national groups!!

"Blimey, Brownies has got a bit militant since we were kids, hasn't it??"

Not really.

The OPs leaders aren't running their units correctly.

My experience of brownies was similar in the 90s. After 2 years I had a whole six badges on my sash. I used to love reading through the book to find out what badges you could get but never had the opportunity to get them. My cousin went to scouts and was learning new skills all the time but I can't remember any of the activities we did at meetings. I think we mostly played and socialised.

[quote PaperMonster]Has anyone posted this link? Their unit leader needs to read this! www.girlguiding.org.uk/what-we-do/our-badges-and-activities/programme-for-every-girl/interest-badges/[/quote]
Yes, but they still won't get the theme award for that section without the corresponding 3 hours of UMAs..

Im a Guide leader, for a start she shouldn't be dictating what the girls can and cannot do. Guiding focuses on involving the girls in decisions and choices. I would definitely expect someone to complain about this to my division commissioner or Girl Guiding if this is how we ran our unit.

Each half term we discuss with the girls which theme they'd like to do. We then suggest that they do one of the interest badges relating to that theme (whichever one they want) so they have the opportunity to earn three badges each half term and a chance to earn their bronze/ silver/ gold award. If the girls decided to do different interest badges or do the ones we suggested at a later time this would never be a problem. Essentially it's their choice.
This has really rattled me to be honest and I think this Brown Owl needs to pipe down or get a different volunteering role where she's not inclined to become Kim Jong Un.