To trick someone into eating vegan?

[Idonthatevegans]

Please read my question before getting into a debate about veganism. That isn't really what it is about. It has no impact on my life if someone is a vegan or not, do what you wish.

I got into a discussion with someone recently, and found out that people are often surprised when they find out that there was no meat in the beef pie/ spag bol etc she served. And she gets a kick of that fact they couldn't tell the difference. Honestly I couldn't really, not in something like a spag bol.

I have however, tried quorn a few times in my life, with AWFUL results. I am in the bathroom within 1 hour and very sick for a day after. A 100% vegan meal without meat substitutes ya I'm 100% ok with. But if someone says I made beef pie, I would take them at their word. If I knew the person was vegan I would probably enquire if it was real meat only because I know how awfully I react to it. But if I didn't know that person was a vegan I would take it at face value. Yes it happens every so often I get offered tea around a friends aunt who we popped into or something like that.

To me, a vegan passing of something as meat to people who don't know and can therefore make up their own mind is as bad as me putting chicken stock into veg soup and telling someone it is vegan friendly. Ya the vast majority in both cases won't know the difference in taste or after affect. But both people have been denied the option of having their own choice. One has been tricked into thinking they are eating meat, one has been tricked into thinking they are not. I know there are hugely different moral implications there but both have been tricked when they should not have been.

I really don't want to this to break into a vegan/ non vegan debate. That is all that I got back on my last chat. The person wouldn't actually answer my question about tricking someone, just kept on a barrage of info about how vegan is amazing and that anyone who eat meat was the devil incarnate.

BTW - it's not something I would often say I am allergic to as I usually take how food is called at their face value.

I simply want to know:

AIBU - she can call her pie beef pie, even if it is not beef pie.

YANBU - you should know what you are eating. If it's called beef pie well of course you would expect it to be beef pie

@lazylinguist

As a vegan, trust me, you do not want people unused to cooking meat cooking it for you. Guaranteed food poisoning.

Are vegans incapable of following recipes or cooking instructions?

I’ve been veggie since I was about 13 - I’ve not poisoned anyone (yet) when I cook meat, poultry or fish. I’ve had a dreadful sore tummy when I made a bean chilli once though.

it’s highly unusual to be allergic to meat substitutes
It's is not. Soy is a very common allergen

I'm a vegan and have been for about a decade, and have been a vegetarian for essentially my whole life before that, so I think I'm suitably unbiased - probably actually biased towards the vegan I suppose!

But I really think that lying to someone about what they're eating, for whatever reason they may have to do so, is a really disgusting thing to do.

@Jessicabrassica

I think I'd ask if there was anything somebody couldn't eat before cooking for them. As a vegetarian I expect the same courtesy. I think lying about ingredients is deceitful and potentially dangerous.

This. I ask and so do my vegan friends.

YANBU I'm another who has a pretty bad reaction to quorn. I'd be pretty pissed off if someone lied to me about using it in something they were serving me.

I haven't eaten meat for many years, but I remember it and veggie mince really does taste different.

I've found that meat eaters, if they're going to have a vegetarian bolognese, usually prefer one with firm dark lentils, brown or green, than veggie mince. It still tastes very different to a beef one, of course, but it's not trying to taste the same; it's just a different palette of flavour. They seem more inclined to accept it as an alternative meal and it doesn't seem to disappoint them the way an earnest fake does!

I think people should know what they are eating, but if I was going to a friend's house for dinner, I would make sure they knew in advance if there was anything I didn't/couldn't eat, so if she is unaware of your dietary requirements/restrictions then it is your responsibility to make it known.

If, for example, I made spaghetti bolognese with quorn mince, I probably wouldn't specify to guests that it was quorn. I've been vegetarian for 30+ years so I dont specifically say "quorn spag bol" in the same way a meat-eater wouldn't say "beef spag bol". It isn't about tricking someone, it is just the shorthand that you use in your own home in day-to-day life to describe the usual meals you create.

Top tip - feeding a vegan meat and pretending it isn't is NOT equivalent to vice versa, as you claim. Anyway, if you were being fed by a vegan, you would assume it was too!

I don't think you should lie about what is in good you are serving people, whether they are vegan, vegetarian or omnivore.

I was watching an old episode of Come Dine with Me yesterday where a contestant cooked a fully vegan menu full of substitutes e.g. cheese made from coconut oil, pulled jackfruit etc. The other guests were politely complimentary to her face (as they should be) but in the secret scoring she did really poorly. In her interviews she just kept trilling on about how she was 'opening their minds' about vegan food and so on and it struck me that this is what you hear from vegans a lot.

But a lot of people HAVE tried vegan food and just don't like it, or prefer food with meat in it. Is it really so hard to understand that some people like different things?

*food

My partner (meat eater) complains when I tell him if something is a fake meat substitute as he enjoys the feel of eating it more if it's meat and even when he 9 times out of 10 enjoys the substitute, to telling him before or after actually disappoints him... so no trigger earnings in this house

I’m vegan and intolerant to Quorn, didn’t realise and had 8 weeks of throwing up, becoming so ill until we realised. You should always tell people the truth about what you’re cooking or offering if they ask or if there might be some identification issue.

I thinks it’s only reasonable to be honest with people about what you are feeding them. For safety reasons alone.
I suspect she would be hugely unimpressed if someone fed her beef whilst telling her it was a veggi spag bol.

Anyone who lies intentionally when giving food to someone else is an idiot. All it would take is a bad allergic reaction to end up on a manslaughter charge because it was knowingly done.

Perhaps you could explain that to your 'friend'.

@VickyEadieofThigh

She's hardly Sweeney Todd...

No one should be "tricking" anyone into eating anything.

@EvenRosesHaveThorns

Top tip - feeding a vegan meat and pretending it isn't is NOT equivalent to vice versa, as you claim. Anyway, if you were being fed by a vegan, you would assume it was too!

Yes but if you didn't know the person was vegan and they presented something as a "beef pie" I think it's fairly normal to go ahead and assume they mean actual beef.

Also what is the difference between this and feeding a vegan meet? Can you explain why it's not the same?

I think lying to people about what is in their food is a recipe for disaster whatever form it takes.

YANBU

I'd happily eat a veggie or vegan meal, but wouldn't touch quorn for similar reasons to you and would be furious if I was served something that would make me ill.

What a tediously immature thing to do

@RedHot22

YANBU

although, most quorn isn’t vegan anyway

Was going to say exactly this! People always talk about quorn in vegan discussions but until very recently I don't think a single thing in their range was vegan and a lot still isn't - contains egg.

I'm a long time veggie, most people I know are aware, so its not something I could pull off, even if I wanted.
As long as someone's checked for any allergies, which you should anyway if you are cooking for someone, I don't see the harm in feeding someone veggies, most meat eaters would be eating veggies in their diet anyway, so I can't see the problem with it.

It’s wrong not to tell. Some people are allergic or have reactions - Quorn is banned in Canada I think. If she says it’s beef pie then it should be beef.
DD’s old school did this. I couldn’t understand why she wasn’t eating spaghetti Bolognese or cottage pie and enquired as she ate them at home. They were using Quorn to avoid need to do halal meals (about 1/3 school wanted halal). To be fair menu didn’t say beef on menu but it explained why dd didn’t like taste/texture. They stopped it as it wasn’t popular with children.

I didn't realise soy was a common allergen - good to know. I have more problems with dairy, so regularly use non-dairy alternatives and would never even think to mention it. I'll have to watch out there's no soy next time, I guess.