Page 4 | To be really worried about the NHS this winter

LibrariesGiveUsPower45321 · 31/10/2021 20:24

But also if you’re actually ill don’t put off going and get worse in the meantime.

Franklin12 · 31/10/2021 20:26

Chiff. As I understand it health spending has increased by 40% in last 10 years. The only government in power has been the Conservatives. How much more would you like chucked at it? Regardless of who is in power we need a proper discussion the way forward. And I 100% agree with a PP. Keeping the very elderly going with very little quality of life just because we can is wrong.

My DF is in a care home. The people there are well cared for but they are just waiting for the grim reaper and every time I visit I cry in my car for many of the people and their quality of life. My DH has talked about wanting to die and yet they throw everything at him when something happens. That all costs and although he is paying his own care home fees the NHS is funded by others.

I would love to see a cross party white paper about the NHS that would involve some co paying for those of us that can afford it.

LibrariesGiveUsPower45321 · 31/10/2021 20:27

Also take medicine doctors give you as they prescribed them, not what you think you know better. The amount of asthmatics I know who won’t take steroid inhalers then end up needing A&E is just silly.

Mossstitch · 31/10/2021 20:27

I've worked in the NHS for many years, as do two of my children & I can't agree with the majority here. Yes there are the time wasters that present at A&E regularly (in my book, having had a bad back damaged at work and it taking 20 minutes to get down my stairs, if you can get in your car to present at A & E with one then you don't need to be there!) but the majority of people are really grateful and thankful for the treatment they receive and don't mind waiting to get it. I myself had a breast cancer scare and have nothing but praise for the treatment I received. People moan about how much tax they pay to receive it but if you look at the cost of any hospital stay then the majority of people's taxes would fall short of paying the bill!

NoDecentHandlesLeft · 31/10/2021 20:36

The NHS has been underfunded for decades, covid has brought it all home to roost. If the government cared, they would have addressed it.

kowari · 31/10/2021 20:37

Buy the best food you can afford. Be active. Don't smoke. Pretty much just take full responsibility for your health as if you are free climbing a cliff and there is no safety net. If you are unlucky enough to need medical help then ask for it, be assertive or find someone to advocate for you.

Cuck00soup · 31/10/2021 20:38

Yeah, let's let the NHS fail.

Let's pay more in insurance premiums in the private sector than we ever do through NI.

Let's choose between medicines when we are ill because we can't afford all of them.

Let's let the wealthy & those with good jobs access healthcare and not worry about those in low incomes or people with long term conditions who cannot afford premiums.

Let's have a society where medical bills lead to bankruptcy.

The NHS has major problems right now, but let's not pretend we want a US style insurance system. Instead let's campaign for adequate funding and better access to GPs.

And yes, let's use pharmacists when we can. Why wouldn't you?

julieca · 31/10/2021 20:39

Don't vote Tory.

megletthesecond · 31/10/2021 20:40

yy kow.

frumpety · 31/10/2021 20:40

As I understand it health spending has increased by 40% in last 10 years

Taking out the money for Covid related stuff, do you have the actual figures, because I am fairly sure that isn't correct.

julieca · 31/10/2021 20:42

@Mossstitch

I've worked in the NHS for many years, as do two of my children & I can't agree with the majority here. Yes there are the time wasters that present at A&E regularly (in my book, having had a bad back damaged at work and it taking 20 minutes to get down my stairs, if you can get in your car to present at A & E with one then you don't need to be there!) but the majority of people are really grateful and thankful for the treatment they receive and don't mind waiting to get it. I myself had a breast cancer scare and have nothing but praise for the treatment I received. People moan about how much tax they pay to receive it but if you look at the cost of any hospital stay then the majority of people's taxes would fall short of paying the bill!

I agree. I have an appointment with a consultant next week after a 6-week wait that included a test, for gallstones. I am fine as long as I don't drink alcohol, so not urgent at all.

lljkk · 31/10/2021 20:42

I had it in my head that 40% of government spending is health & social care. UK/England is in danger of becoming primarily a health/social care service with a few sidelines into things like education, environmental protection and military defence.

HereticFanjo's points are good ones.

julieca · 31/10/2021 20:43

Social care bill is enormous. It includes kids in care, foster placements, disabled young adults - care can be very expensive.

rwalker · 31/10/2021 20:44

Funding is just one of the problems the NHS face and I wouldn't say it's the major one.

Thing is we all want more funding but WE don't want to pay for it so no win situation

julieca · 31/10/2021 20:45

@Cuck00soup

Yeah, let's let the NHS fail.

Let's pay more in insurance premiums in the private sector than we ever do through NI.

Let's choose between medicines when we are ill because we can't afford all of them.

Let's let the wealthy & those with good jobs access healthcare and not worry about those in low incomes or people with long term conditions who cannot afford premiums.

Let's have a society where medical bills lead to bankruptcy.

The NHS has major problems right now, but let's not pretend we want a US style insurance system. Instead let's campaign for adequate funding and better access to GPs.

And yes, let's use pharmacists when we can. Why wouldn't you?

All this. Plus I am not stupid. There is a social media campaign at the moment to soften people up for privatisation. I am sure a pr firm has been paid for this. The government have to find another way to give their rich friends more of the taxpayer's money.

julieca · 31/10/2021 20:46

@frumpety

As I understand it health spending has increased by 40% in last 10 years

Taking out the money for Covid related stuff, do you have the actual figures, because I am fairly sure that isn't correct.

An insurance scheme would mean you have no choice. Pay the co-pays or no healthcare except emergency healthcare. Instead MN would have posts asking for home remedy tips for serious health problems.

Abitodd · 31/10/2021 20:47

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn at OP's request.

IfImLyingImDying · 31/10/2021 20:53

You can’t do anything now OP. It was 5 or even 10 years ago that people needed to start doing something.

StopGo · 31/10/2021 20:53

@AtlasPine

Just that really. Lots of issues around GP access, backlogs of people waiting for treatments and overstretched A&E departments. Flu season coming, Covid cases rising, staffing problems linked to Brexit and the rise of private practices offering better terms and conditions to doctors.

What can we do to support the NHS?

Vaccinations (flu and Covid) and look after ourselves as much as possible I suppose. I can’t afford private health care like most here I suspect.

What can we do to support the NHS? I'm doing as much as I can. The NHS sacrificed my DH on the altar of Covid. I have no more to give. The NHS is fucked.

Porfre · 31/10/2021 20:56

I cant see why we cant have a system similar to something there is in any one of the countries in Europe- France/ Germany etc.

I would be happy to pay more for something that works. But I don't trust this government.

The fact that people don't want to pay more for something similar to a European style health system means we will end up with something similar to the American style system instead by stealth.

frumpety · 31/10/2021 20:57

Don't worry @Franklin12 I had a quick google

During the period of austerity that followed the 2008 economic crash, the Department of Health and Social Care budget continued to grow but at a slower pace than in previous years. Budgets rose by 1.4 per cent each year on average (adjusting for inflation) in the 10 years between 2009/10 to 2018/19, compared to the 3.7 per cent average rises since the NHS was established

chocolateorangeinhaler · 01/11/2021 06:59

Nobody has yet mentioned bed blocking. That's still a huge problem.

Remember in the early 00s primary care trusts shut down cottage and community hospitals in droves. With the biggest lie ever told that the buildings "were no longer fit for purpose". Funny how the pretty Victorian ones got sold to developers for pennies who then sold on for millions but that's besides the point. At the time we were sold the notion that care in your own home was the way forward. It never worked as it relied on cheap immigrants working in the care sector to take up the shortfall. Well now there are no cheap immigrants to do the care in the home work people who medically don't need to be in hospital take up a bed as they are not mobile enough to go home.

The investment needs to be at the end of the secondary provider production line to keep hospitals at less capacity. No point in hospitals investing in the latest technology and techniques if speeding up their throughput if it just moves the pinch point to the other end of the line.

Primary care or primary care that was needs to reinvest in convalescent (remember those) homes at the very least.

I also wish that the current government would rip up the GP contract that labour constructed in the 90s so that GPS has to provide OOH weekend and evening cover. Hospital A&E presentations shot up once people didn't have a chance in hell to see their GP.

Until you stop people going into hospitals by having a reliable GP service and speed up getting people out at the other end with community care hospitals/homes, secondary providers are just becoming dumping grounds that are expected to just deal with everything with a kick in the crotch that you have time limits or massive fines if you don't get things done in said time limit.

The above is without the idiots that turn up at A&E because they felt funny last Wednesday and thought they better get it checked out on a Sunday afternoon just incase it's serious.

frumpety · 01/11/2021 07:54

Yes to the fines ! I wonder if anyone has done a FOI request to see how much Trusts are paying out in fines ? Be interesting to see how much of their budgets are eaten up by this, money which could be spent on staffing and improved services.

Jurassicparkinajug · 01/11/2021 08:15

The NHS is one of the best healthcare systems in the world but it is becoming overwhelmed. Privatising it would make things so much worse. We would morn the NHS if it went. We should fight for it.

The NHS is poorly managed with too much waste. Too many people trying to come up with yet another groundbreaking change which inevitably fails. Not enough staff being trained up. Then because we're short staffed, the doctors and nurses nurses burn out and leave. I could never imagine being anything other than a nurse but my god its exhausting working on minimum staff every day and the constant worry you've made a mistake or omission that could cause harm to a patient.

Throughout this pandemic I've seen a lack of personal responsibility. So many people quick to moan about a lack of GP appointments for example but won't wear a mask and broke lockdown rules. My friend is a GP and told me that loads of patients are turning up to the surgery with covid symptoms even though they tell you not to. Then the staff are off sick and it's even harder to get a GP appointment.

julieca · 01/11/2021 10:10

@chocolateorangeinhaler yes the current breakdown in care is making hospital waiting times longer. An elderly person who has a stroke, is taken to the hospital. They get treatment, but can no longer live alone and need to go into a care home. But some care homes have blocked new admissions because they cant get the staff. So people have to wait longer in hospital for a care home bed.
These are basic things. You destroy the care home system by privatising all the local authority care homes and paying them low amounts for places. You destroy cottage hospitals where people could convalesce. This has an impact on hospitals.
And mental health of the population is bad after the pandemic. The amount of people having psychotic breaks has increased. So people need to be hospitalised, sometimes for long periods of time.
Hospitals pick up all the failures elsewhere in our society whether mental health or social care.