To find this behaviour utterly illogical?

[DrSeuss]

Surely if you ban your child from having anything to do with Harry Potter to the extent that they can’t attend a Hogwarts themed birthday party and don’t allow them to celebrate Halloween at all, all on the grounds that the Bible forbids magic and witchcraft, you can’t then allow the child free access to “The Wizard of Oz” or hold a Peter Pan themed party or one with an Elsa from Frozen in costume? The book of Deuteronomy does indeed forbid magic according to Google. I find it firstly nonsensical and also a nightmare to navigate as the parent of such a child’s friend. Newest one is that David Walliams books are OK except for “The Demon Dentist “. I have no issue with people believing whatever makes them happy and would describe myself as having a Christian faith ( not very observant but still familiar with all the teachings of the C of E). The parents are C of E too but of a very different type to either my family or the Anglican school where I work, both being pretty accepting of all shades of belief. It’s quite tricky when my daughter and theirs want to spend time together. Something such as a simple cinema visit becomes so complicated when a film which has a suitable certificate for primary age children must still be pre approved in case it contains a forbidden theme. This is made even harder when Disney magic is deemed fine but others may not be.
Ideally, I would like someone with greater theological knowledge than me or who also believes that portrayals of magic in popular culture are wrong to help me understand and maybe give me some guidelines. I did once try asking why Disney was fine but Harry Potter wasn’t but the mother didn’t really answer me, just said that’s how it is. I asked the child as gently as possible if she was aware of why she can watch the witches in Oz but she said quite frankly that she didn’t know.

I am frustrated by the woolliness of their arguments and the arbitrary nature of decisions but this girl is a good friend of my daughter’s and is a pleasant child so I persevere.

I really hope someone can advise me.

You don’t need to accept their beliefs at all, they certainly wouldn’t accept your view

I don't seem to have explained myself very well. A typical interaction involves me planning what seems to me an innocuous and therefore permissible trip eg a museum, only to discover that there's a hitch eg what film are the museum showing? Is it suitable?

I asked the girl very gently (see above, SEN teacher, used to all kinds of odd conversations about all kinds of difficult issues) why the Wizard of Oz and not other things. She said she didn't know. That is all.
On reflection, she was abnormally happy to be given sweets by another child in the car and immediately ate a large quantity and to be given cookies as part of her picnic then ice-cream later in the afternoon. All the kids liked the cookies and the ice-cream but only one thought they were really exciting. Obviously, they are treats but it was a special day out and all the kids were being indulged a little but only one thought it was that special. :(

I am Pagan and would find some attitudes towards my belief system offensive.
I'm not sure how I would navigate a friendship like this - I would try to accommodate out of tolerance I think, while being sure to let my dc know that my beliefs are not the same as theirs and I don't really like the negatives I'm being confronted with as I don't refuse to acknowledge Christian traditions.

You’re not being unreasonable, but I would just plan non-cinema related trips for this friend and if she couldn’t make the themed birthday party, I wouldn’t worry.

FWIW I’m a teacher and was once asked if I could teach a Christmas carol without the ghosts in it, to accommodate a student’s beliefs. Alas, no. However I was happy to ensure the student didn’t have to write about ghosts on the assessment or watch the film, in order to accommodate their beliefs and had a perfectly reasonable conversation with both parents and students about the fact that a belief in the supernatural was in no way necessary to understand the novel and it’s core messages which were very much in line with their religious values.

I grew up in a household like this girl's. The church (protestant sect no-one has heard of) was a close-knit group where certain things weren't accepted (like trick or treating, ghosts etc) and everyone went along with it. They would vaguely refer to the Witch of Endor in the Bible, and stuff about going towards the Light instead of evil, but it was the done thing, which sounds a lot like these people. So I think it's just a question of carrying on doing what you're doing - don't expect there to be a lot of logic to it.

It's funny, TV was banned in my family's church, but my uncle discovered that he could get the cricket on his DS's computer, so he didn't tell anyone ;)

Expecting you to teach A Christmas Carol without the ghosts is bonkers!

For the sake of the little girl I would put up with it. Who knows in time to come, she may need your support to remove herself from the situation she is in. Without a network out with her religion, she may feel stuck. It’s sad.

I don't see why you have to pandering to these bizarre nonsensical beliefs. Do want you and your child wants, and the other girls parents can like it ir lump it.

I do feel sorry for that child though.

@HikingforScenery

You don’t need to understand their way of thinking or find theological arguments to agree or disagree with their point of view.

Your child has all the time in the world ( apart from the time they spend with this girl) to watch Harry Potter and any other magic you want her to watch.

I do think it’s rather mean of you to ask the girl to explain the reasoning behind her parents decisions tbh. Why wizard of oz snd not Harry Potter? Ask her parents. Or better still, just accept their beliefs if you want your child to hang out with theirs. Or don’t let them hang out. It can’t be that hard

Did you actually read the OP's posts? It IS 'that hard' because they make up the 'rules' as they go & they defy logic, so you're constantly on the back foot having NO idea what is or isn't permitted.

OP

You have actually explained yourself very well.

We are non religious, but from mixed Christian faiths.

I am SO tolerant as is my husband.

We have NO interest in any religious doctrine.

We are very respectful of others.

However, I just don't entertain other doctrines being imposed on a playdate in MY house, other than food allergies.

End of.

So in this situation, it would be simply be, this is what is occurring in MY house, accept or decline.

End of.

No discussion, absolutely NO interest.

Truthfully I was too busy with 4 young children to entertain this and with the exception of very, very few, there really was NO issue.

I cant answer for them.

But I know a lot of religious circles in America had an issue with Harry Potter.

It could be due to the fact the witches and wizards ate presented as the heroes. It's set in a world parallel to ours. Lots of people cosplay as them. Some people wish they could live in the magical world of Harry Potter. Theres a whole community around it. People cosplay and try to immerse themselves in this world, some wish more than anything it was real and some do take it a bit far.
Witches and wizards are presented as a positive and something to aspire to.

Whereas on the wizard of Oz, the whole world is different,.It isn't set in a world like ours but a fictional world and the both witches are evil and killed. They aren't really presented as inspirational- instead they're made to look really ugly, and a terrible death.

I think being observant of others beliefs is important and tolerant.
I'm fine with people believing what they want. I will learn what religious observations I need to be aware of for a guest to my home and do my best to accommodate and not question.
I do find the intolerance of my beliefs sad though and it offends me when there's piss taking or I'm seen as somehow dangerous.

I guess it makes a change from banning Harry Potter because JKR is sO tRAnSPhoBiC omg

There’s a good witch in Wizard of oz - Glinda

The only difference between religious belief and a diagnosable mental health condition is context. My daughter doesn't get to believe what she wants. AND she gets to be patronised by people with equally nonsensical beliefs claiming they can magic away HER beliefs with prayer.

No. You cannot just believe what you want in society. You can only believe what is prescribed to be acceptable.

Sp basically.
Harry Potter. Witches and wizards can be a force of good as well as evil. Lots of inspirational witches. Set in a world similar to our modern day world. Spells. Potions and curses- Souls being broken and put into talimans- deemed not suitable

Wizard of Oz- two evil witches, one who doesnt even do anything evil on film. Evil figures- both have horrible death- ok to watch.

Peter Pan- no witches. Fairy magic- seems whimsical- ok to watch

Frozen- no witches, though spirit elements in the second movie - again felt to be mythical- deemed ok to watch

Every person born into or practicing in the Christian tradition I've ever met has no issue with Harry Potter, or Halloween. It's make believe and isn't going to turn kids to the occult! The ones who become worked up about it are in the extreme.

Is Narnia banned ? It has a bad witch in it but is a Christian allegory, ask them about that op

Is Narnia banned ? It has a bad witch in it but is a Christian allegory

Like Narnia, Harry Potter is an obvious Christian allegory written with that intent by a practicing Christian. Banning HP because it's 'not Christian' is utterly silly.

I imagine it's because Harry Potter is set in modern-day Britain, with the idea that witches and wizards live among us.

In the Wizard of Oz, witches only exist in Oz. Frozen is a cartoon. Thus they're more unrealistic and might not be considered a danger in term of likelihood to encourage belief in the existence of magic. Maybe they feel that Harry Potter is too likely to encourage such a belief.

It's hard if your daughter likes the other girl and wants to be friends.
It's daft too- I can bet money that most people who object to Harry Potter on "religious" grounds haven't read the books, watched the films or can explain why they have banned them.

I think we'll happily give up witches and Harry Potter as soon as their god stops giving children cancer.

That and the bibles love of incest. Adam & his transgender clone Eve's children would have had to be incestuous or else the world wouldn't really have worked out, then there was the whole Ark & flood thing (bit shitty of god to go drown everyone like that yet somehow he gets a pass on it) where only Noah, his wife, his 3 sons & his sons wives went on the boat/survived which must have meant some first cousin relationships (at best). That Bibles full of some pretty fucked up stuff, yet its fairys, witches and harry potter who get the bad rap.

@Changechangychange that family sounds more than weird. They are really lining their children up to be unprepared for the real world - but cults tend to like doing that as it stops kids leaving as they grow up.

That child is going to one of 2 ways - follow deep along the parents path or rebel hard a teen (pregnant goth at 16).
I had a classmate who came from a heavily religious family (wee free style) no fun or anything on a sunday, not even homework, which did not go down well with a certain teacher back in the day. She tore a strip off him when he used that as his excuse for not having done it, and made it clear that that wasn't going to wash out in the real world & that he'd better start thinking for himself soon.
Unfortunately he followed down the family rabbit hole & he's now a bit of a christian fundamentalist - more emphasis on the mental than the fun and only his narrow branch of christianity is the right one. I only keep an eye on his facebook out of morbid curiosity & to regularly report posts for homophobia, sexism, racism, misogyny - and the umpteen other kinds of -isms or -obias he comes out with in the name of his religion. I will not be the slightest bit surprised if i one day see him on the news being arrested for something cult based.

In the Wizard of Oz, witches only exist in Oz. Frozen is a cartoon. Thus they're more unrealistic and might not be considered a danger in term of likelihood to encourage belief in the existence of magic. Maybe they feel that Harry Potter is too likely to encourage such a belief.

That’s not it. They already believe in it. They’re worried that something like Harry Potter will encourage children to dabble in dangerous devil worship and witchcraft.

When I was growing up it was specifically witches or anything deemed 'demonic' that was an issue. So fairies and magic ok, witches and magic not ok. Weirdly Sabrina the teenage witch was banned but Harry Potter was fine. Ha! Also my mum used to skip the page with the witch in each peach pear plum. She even did this with my daughter !! No rhyme nor reason to be honest.

would describe myself as having a Christian faith ( not very observant but still familiar with all the teachings of the C of E).

You’re no different to her though. You can’t say you have a Christian faith and in the next breath say you’re not observant.

I have made accommodations for friends' beliefs on many occasions, for example, serving vegetarian food hen Muslims are invited

How bloody magnanimous

Of course you wouldn’t serve meat to Muslims unless it was halal. Do you really expect a medal for this? If you invite people into your home it’s a given that you need to accommodate them.