AIBU or are teenage girls too afraid to go out at night? Afraid because of drink spiking and being injected.

[Metropolismoon]

Dd is in her first year at Reading Uni. 7 girls have recently been injected at the students union and she has a friend at another uni who had her drink spiked.

She is now afraid to go out at night and she and her friends have kitchen parties instead.

I think it’s really sad that they are having to stay home as it’s considered too unsafe to go out at night.

@HaudYerWheeshtYaWeeBellend

It’s not just teens, a colleague (mid 40’s)was needle spiked last weekend, doesn’t drink, 1hr later she was completely unconscious.

She’ll likely never set foot in a sociable public place again.

I don't know of a drug that could do that.

Were you there, or are you repeating it from others? Was there a toxicology report?

It is all well and good coming forward with anecdotal evidence but there are no facts attached to this.

• The "injection spiking" phenomenon which has exploded out of nowhere in the last fortnight is just another rehash of an urban legend as old as the hills.

There is a substantial thread in Feminism Chat with detailed posts about why spiking by injection simply isn't possible.*

What do you mean by it isn't possible? I'm a psychiatrist, I prescribe tranquillisers IM so there's definitely drugs available to do this. You don't have to hit a vein, a needle in the thigh or the bum cheek would easily do it and it can be injected through clothing. Benzodiazepines and antipsychotics would make you pretty drowsy and compliant, especially if you'd been drinking

Teaching our daughters they are in such constant danger they must not go out and that the world is full of gangs of men who hate women and want to harm them, sounds much more potentially damaging to young women than the reality of getting on with living your life with some inevitable element of risk.

Yes be aware, be careful, make good decisions, listen to your instincts as there are some bad men out there.

But live your life.

@Metropolismoon

It’s horrific. These men are sons , what is going wrong in their upbringing???

I didn’t know I had to provide the full facts

Yes I was there, yes there was a toxicology report and yes the police and other services are involved.

@AndSoFinally

* The "injection spiking" phenomenon which has exploded out of nowhere in the last fortnight is just another rehash of an urban legend as old as the hills.

There is a substantial thread in Feminism Chat with detailed posts about why spiking by injection simply isn't possible.*

What do you mean by it isn't possible? I'm a psychiatrist, I prescribe tranquillisers IM so there's definitely drugs available to do this. You don't have to hit a vein, a needle in the thigh or the bum cheek would easily do it and it can be injected through clothing. Benzodiazepines and antipsychotics would make you pretty drowsy and compliant, especially if you'd been drinking

You're right, that was poorly worded.

It's not possible on this scale simultaneously across the country with the rapid side effects reported.

The drugs you mention would make you drowsy and compliant. They would not make you instantly collapse, paralyse you, or make you start foaming at the mouth, however

Having been trained to do injections, intramuscularly injecting someone who is not expecting it and not cooperating would require a considerable amount of force. The victim is certainly not going to just quietly collapse.

See, I don't think it would. IM diazepam or Olanzapine is designed as "rapid tranquilisation" medication for highly aggressive and psychotic patients, let alone pissed women in nightclubs. They require about 5 seconds of restraint for me to inject them and it works very quickly, hence the name! OK, you couldn't restrain someone in a nightclub as such, but think of being stuck in the throng at the bar? It's not like you could really move away and if you were a bit tipsy I reckon by the time the needle registered they'd have the meds injected and be gone. All they'd need do is be ready to step in when you started feeling woozy

Dd is still going out but i agree its very worrying

@AndSoFinally

Having been trained to do injections, intramuscularly injecting someone who is not expecting it and not cooperating would require a considerable amount of force. The victim is certainly not going to just quietly collapse.

See, I don't think it would. IM diazepam or Olanzapine is designed as "rapid tranquilisation" medication for highly aggressive and psychotic patients, let alone pissed women in nightclubs. They require about 5 seconds of restraint for me to inject them and it works very quickly, hence the name! OK, you couldn't restrain someone in a nightclub as such, but think of being stuck in the throng at the bar? It's not like you could really move away and if you were a bit tipsy I reckon by the time the needle registered they'd have the meds injected and be gone. All they'd need do is be ready to step in when you started feeling woozy

Yeah I have given IM olanzapine and lorazepam too ,the medication usually starts taking affect after around 20 minutes ish ,it's not just that though if you were a rapist intent on spiking Someone injecting them in a noisy crowded club seems implausible ,if your stuck in a throng at a bar there's every chance you could inject the wrong person ,and maybe not female ,spiking a drink would be much easier and accurate .

@AndSoFinally

Having been trained to do injections, intramuscularly injecting someone who is not expecting it and not cooperating would require a considerable amount of force. The victim is certainly not going to just quietly collapse.

See, I don't think it would. IM diazepam or Olanzapine is designed as "rapid tranquilisation" medication for highly aggressive and psychotic patients, let alone pissed women in nightclubs. They require about 5 seconds of restraint for me to inject them and it works very quickly, hence the name! OK, you couldn't restrain someone in a nightclub as such, but think of being stuck in the throng at the bar? It's not like you could really move away and if you were a bit tipsy I reckon by the time the needle registered they'd have the meds injected and be gone. All they'd need do is be ready to step in when you started feeling woozy

This is exactly what I was thinking would be possible. Thank you for confirming.

I do think it's possible that this could happen in this way but so also think some young lad will think it's hilarious to stick young women with a pin and see the chaos it causes. Unfortunately that pin could be used on several people in the same night and so those victims would need to be tested for HIV and Hepatitis.

@HaudYerWheeshtYaWeeBellend

I didn’t know I had to provide the full facts

Yes I was there, yes there was a toxicology report and yes the police and other services are involved.

If you had said that firsts time round it makes your evidence more plausible, but I still stand by my question, I don't know of a drug that would do that.

My two are early twenties, never go to clubs and rarely to pubs. They got sick of men and creepy behaviour quite early on. Their love lives have suffered as a result but they're happy and I can see why they've made this choice to be honest.

@Hoardasurass

Any chance you could post a link to that nail varnish / site?

I know spiking is a problem but I'm cynical that it's a problem that has suddenly exploded.

I wonder if this is more a result of young people not going clubbing for over a year. They don't know their limits and are assuming they've been spiked when actually they've just drank too much.

And these injection stories are just ridiculous. Why and how would you sneak a hypodermic needle into a club and jab someone with it? You'd be much more likely to be caught, charged with carrying a weapon, could potentially hurt yourself and would have to somehow discreetly prepare the needle. A lot riskier than just spiking someone.

I haven’t given any evidence as you say, nor do I have to or was requested by the OP!!!!

I was responding to the OP and advising it’s not just teens that are scared to go out!

[quote colouringindoors]@Hoardasurass

Any chance you could post a link to that nail varnish / site?[/quote]
According to Snopesit was never developed
www.snopes.com/fact-check/undercover-colors/

Males are also at risk of this happening to them, there was a male student studying at Manchester who was found guilty at Crown Court to filming himself raping over 200 young men through spiking their drinks.

*Teaching our daughters they are in such constant danger they must not go out and that the world is full of gangs of men who hate women and want to harm them, sounds much more potentially damaging to young women than the reality of getting on with living your life with some inevitable element of risk.

Yes be aware, be careful, make good decisions, listen to your instincts as there are some bad men out there.

But live your life.*

^^this

My 19 year old DD was spiked in a nightclub in Aberdeen, we only found out she was in hospital as her friends (who she had lost on the night out) had tracked her on an app they have. She still goes out but is a lot more careful now and they don't buy drinks in the club, they drink before they go out. It's absolutely disgusting that it has come to this.

I'm Reading University alumni and I'm almost certain that those in charge will do fuck all to keep young women on their campus safe. Unfortunately I know that from experience.

It's no better in town, it's agressive and scary and there is a horrible misogyny present too with the massage parlours and brothels on the Oxford Road and the lapdancing club in the town centre.

Awful place, haven't ever been back.

@CovidCorvid

Dd was raped by someone on her course at a party as a first year student. That was two years ago, she hasn’t been to a party or a club since.

Jesus, that's awful. Can't even imagine what that must be like for you as a mother.

Yes l agree with Marvellousmadness,

Be careful regarding the poisoned media, negative headlines sell much better than positive ones.

@moonface123 while there are cases of male rape and males should also be aware of their drinks, I think that it is clear that males are not often the intended victim. As a % of spiking and sexual assault, it is not our sons we need to worry about. It is male violence and sexual assault on our daughters that needs to be prevented first and foremost

@x2boys
My DD was needled through her clothing in her bum

*And these injection stories are just ridiculous. Why and how would you sneak a hypodermic needle into a club and jab someone with it? You'd be much more likely to be caught, charged with carrying a weapon, could potentially hurt yourself and would have to somehow discreetly prepare the needle. A lot riskier than just spiking someone.

I do think they are. Really difficult to inject someone without their knowledge. They’d have to be co-operating or being forcibly restrained or else you would need some sort of very sophisticated delivery mechanism hidden inside something else, which is James Bond territory.