AIBU or are teenage girls too afraid to go out at night? Afraid because of drink spiking and being injected.

[Metropolismoon]

Dd is in her first year at Reading Uni. 7 girls have recently been injected at the students union and she has a friend at another uni who had her drink spiked.

She is now afraid to go out at night and she and her friends have kitchen parties instead.

I think it’s really sad that they are having to stay home as it’s considered too unsafe to go out at night.

As the worried mother of a teenage daughter, I'm so sorry to those of you whose daughters have been attacked.

Both my girls are in Glasgow and are being very, very careful about where they go - planning for bars instead of clubs, those you don't usually have to queue for and in particular those that guys don't tend to go to.
Which, as the mother of a son makes me very, very sad indeed that this is necessary.

@RampantIvy it's not about what I believe, it's extremely unfeasible from a medical perspective.

There is no way you could inject enough of a drug into someone to make them collapse very shortly afterwards unless you had one hell of a big needle, you had a very amenable (and immobile) victim, or you were doing the injection intravenously (all of the victims so far have claimed it was intramuscular).

Many of the claims involve "injection sites" such as the hand, which is a really bad area to inject anyone with anything because it's painful and ineffective.

Many of the "injection site" photos I've seen on social media either show fuck all or something that's obviously not an injection site, for example a spot. I've seen one photo that does look like an injection site, but given it's from an anonymous social media account it could very well be from a genuine injection e.g. a vaccination - it's not like it's hard to get photos of injection sites at the moment between Covid and flu jabs!

So far there have been no arrests (for offences involving needles - men have been arrested for spiking and drug possession generally) and no positive toxicology reports, despite the fact that apparently this is happening to hundreds of people, if social media is to be believed. And of the kinds of drugs known to science which would work by injection and which would fit the symptoms described, you'd expect to see something.

In short, it's very implausible from a medical perspective that there is a widespread effort nationwide to inject women with drugs, and the only evidence I've seen is claims on social media. I can believe that men are jabbing women with pins for a laugh, but the injection element simply does not add up for me.

www.google.com/amp/s/www.vice.com/amp/en/article/wxdenq/heres-what-we-know-about-reports-of-women-being-spiked-with-needles-in-uk-clubs

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/women-who-feared-they-had-been-spiked-with-needles-given-all-clear-7lk28j5hf

We know that drink spiking is common. The needle adds another element of horror to the stories. When you combine Freshers week and the level of consciousness in the public mind about injection thanks to the covid, I'm not surprised such a story has taken off, but it's nothing new - there have been urban legends circling about needles and injections for decades.

And I'd rather not see young women cowed and made to stay at home by nothing more than an urban myth.

I told my daughter the girls should go out and the boys stay in. Apparently the boys aren’t going to want to go out if all the girls are staying in anyway.

@Lockheart

Drink spiking is unfortunately all too common.

The "injection spiking" phenomenon which has exploded out of nowhere in the last fortnight is just another rehash of an urban legend as old as the hills.

There is a substantial thread in Feminism Chat with detailed posts about why spiking by injection simply isn't possible.

It is much more likely a fear campaign.

I did wonder this. It's a bit like the urban myth that went round 20 years ago about girls being spiked with a date rape drug that also made them infertile.

I've worked with IV drug users- contrary to tv drama its actually not simple to inject anyone intravenously - and virtually impossible into places like the back of the hand- without them cooperating.

Something like Ketamine can be injected into muscle such as the buttocks or thigh- but would be very difficult to do unnoticed and it would show in blood tests

Drink spiking by adding extra shots etc has always been common and people should be cautious of that. But medically injection spiking is extremely unlikely to be possible- I'd like to know if there has been any corroborated case.

The thing is even if a drug isn’t being injected via a syringe just the act of sticking a syringe in someone in order to cause panic and terror is absolutely awful in itself. Imagine the wait to find out if you’ve been infected with HIV etc?

@Bagelsandbrie

The thing is even if a drug isn’t being injected via a syringe just the act of sticking a syringe in someone in order to cause panic and terror is absolutely awful in itself. Imagine the wait to find out if you’ve been infected with HIV etc?

Yes this would be awful if true. It would be more believable if isolated to one area. The fact that it is suddenly reported all over the country as once would mean organised gangs are stabbing women.

@Bagelsandbrie

The thing is even if a drug isn’t being injected via a syringe just the act of sticking a syringe in someone in order to cause panic and terror is absolutely awful in itself. Imagine the wait to find out if you’ve been infected with HIV etc?

Indeed, injecting someone with a substance to incapacitate them is improbable (the thread in Feminism had plenty of input from experts on that score) but someone getting their kicks from sticking pins into women to terrify them is perfectly plausible.

If you are a sexual predator wanting an unconscious victim, the 'traditional' method of slipping something in their drink is both easier to accomplish, and far more reliable. Why would a predator go to the trouble of trying to stick a needle in the right place in a crowded nightclub when they have simpler methods at their disposal?

Having been trained to do injections, intramuscularly injecting someone who is not expecting it and not cooperating would require a considerable amount of force. The victim is certainly not going to just quietly collapse.

@CovidCorvid I’m so sorry.

I think it’s a sad state of affairs that this is on the increase again.
I remember this starting in London in early 2000’s and it was rife. The rule back then was to never let anyone buy you a drink, drink a drink that is easier to keep covered (a bottle), never leave the drink unattended and stick in a pack (so no sloping off with some random person you just met). Two friends had their drinks spiked; one was immediately taken to a&e and spent the night vomiting. The other we stopped being taken out of the club by some bloke semi conscious.

The injecting is terrifying. And whilst I believe it’s hard to administer a drug fully via that method, I still think the fact that people are walking around with needles waiting to stick it in someone is utterly terrifying! I mean security searches won’t pick up someone serious trying to get a needle into a club! Personally I don’t blame these girls and would be doing the exact same.

Stunned that this is why society has come to though.

I must admit I am very sceptical.

What are the people who are doing this getting out of it?

I just think its all too easy to have too much to drink and then put it down to being spiked and not admit to having too much.

I can understand spiking more on an one to one basis where you could then take the person somewhere to have sex with them but in a busy night club??

Something doesn't add up to me

@RampantIvy
I blame easy access to online porn for this kind of behaviour.

Why? Rape was more common before online porn....and many types of rape were perfectly legal then too. I see no evidence for correlation or causation between porn and rape.

My dd and her friends aren’t going out this weekend. One of her friends was needled last weekend on a night out.

@MakeMineALarge1 good lord. Are we really back to minimising violence against women?

They must be making it up. They had too much to drink and are lying.

Are you serious?

And people get out of it what perpetrators have gotten out of it for years. Control. Power. Abuse.

When I was at uni in the 90s we had drink spiking. Also drug spiking. We also had an issue with gangs lurking in the uni car parks and kidnapping, raping, dumping women after night classes as they went to their cars. We had “shut in” all women parties and did take back the night marches. But now I have teen DDs, it’s dawned on me that nothing much has changed.

[quote sassbott]@MakeMineALarge1 good lord. Are we really back to minimising violence against women?

They must be making it up. They had too much to drink and are lying.

Are you serious?[/quote]
I am not minimising violence, I am asking a question.

I have been out and had far too much to drink and not been aware of certain events, I wasn't spiked, I'd simply had too much to drink! I could quite easily have said I was spiked but I didn't I took responsibility for my own actions.

I just think we have to be more realistic in our discussions, where are all these drugs being obtained from? Where are the needles and syringes being disposed of after?

IF you are giving a drug into a muscle it takes ages to become effective and you aren't telling me these drugs are being given into a vein

What is the ultimate aim of the people?

@Waahingwashingwashing

My dd and her friends aren’t going out this weekend. One of her friends was needled last weekend on a night out.

There has been a report of this at my local uni in the past week too. I'm interetsted given the posts above about how this isn't actually something that can happen @Waahingwashingwashing do you know the details of what happened to the friend?

Was she restrained while being injected? Was she wearing short sleeves or a short skirt or did they manage to remove her clothes first? Were tests able to identify the drugs, thought (maybe wrongly) that they disappeared from the blood pretty quickly

I have friends with uni daughters and from speaking to them I'm not sure they appreciate how careful they need to be.

@Waahingwashingwashing oh no how awful, what happened?

@MakeMineALarge1

I must admit I am very sceptical.

What are the people who are doing this getting out of it?

I just think its all too easy to have too much to drink and then put it down to being spiked and not admit to having too much.

I can understand spiking more on an one to one basis where you could then take the person somewhere to have sex with them but in a busy night club??

Something doesn't add up to me

@MakeMineALarge1 what a disgusting thing to say. First of all, it's called rape, not sex.

You're very ignorant to think that countless women are just making it up rather than saying "woops, I had a bit too much to drink last night." When I was spiked, I hadn't yet finished my second drink when i started fitting and an ambulance was called for me.

But go ahead, blame the victims.

I am not saying it doesn't happen - its far easier to spike a drink then inject someone

Yes this would be awful if true. It would be more believable if isolated to one area. The fact that it is suddenly reported all over the country as once would mean organised gangs are stabbing women

I think there would easily be organised gangs stabbing women. Why do you think this is so unlikely? There are plenty of moronic men out there who hate women.

[quote sassbott]**@MakeMineALarge1 good lord. Are we really back to minimising violence against women?

They must be making it up. They had too much to drink and are lying.

Are you serious?[/quote]
@MakeMineALarge1

Might have worded her post poorly and I don’t agree with her implying that women are knowingly lying about being spiked.

However, I read a news report stating that several young women who honestly thought they had been spiked went to A&E and were tested and no drugs were found in their systems so the doctors concluded they were mistaken and had not actually been spiked by drink or needle.

So while spiking definitely does happen and the victims should not be blamed in any way, the level of fear is so high that some women do mistakenly believe they have been spiked when they have not.

This then, to me, means that we cannot use social media posts or self-reporting of spiking as a reliable source of information as to how often spiking actually occurs. Because humans can be mistaken.

This is terrible.
What’s the answer? Passports/I.D and searches before entry? More security…
The world is getting a horrible place to live lately.