to want advice from female breadwinners

[bumfeckbingo]

My DP has just totally bitten my head off and I'm struggling to not feel really shit.

Over the last few years I have been the one earning the majority of our income. DP has said this makes him feel bad and that he wants his current business venture to work out and mean we are more 50/50 on earning, like we used to be.

I make sure I divvy up the funds so we both have spending money etc. He isn't extravagant or anything but obviously things are tighter on one income rather than two. I really, really try not to make a big deal of this as I know he feels bad about the situation.

Just for balance a few years ago I lost the job I had at the time. He transferred money to my account, paid for things, gave me his card etc and never asked how much I had spent or on what. He never pressured me to hurry up and find work either, he just left me to it. I wasn't buying designer handbags or anything but I appreciated how he made an effort to preserve my sense of independence. Even though I was essentially dependent on him, it never felt like that. I would say I was un/under employed for around 8 months.

Fast forward to now and I am earning well and he isn't. I know he feels bad about it and I'm trying my best but sometimes like just now it feels like I'm getting punished for being the main earner when I go out of my way to not make a big deal of that.

Sorry if this doesn't read very well, I'm just so upset.

Does anyone have any experience of this and if so, what made it better? He seems so resentful of the situation which is hard because I am doing my best.

@MrsAvocet

I earned a lot more than my DH for my whole working life. Now I've retired the balance us a bit different. He always said it didn't bother him, but in reality I suspect he was saying what he knew he ought to feel, and not always what he did. Misogyny is so deeply ingrained in society. We are taught from a very early age that men are breadwinners and women are homemakers/earn less, and since women are of less value, so, obviously is any man who takes on "their " role. I know my DH does not, intellectually speaking, believe that, amd that he can logically see that our contributions to the relationship and our family are much more even than our payslips would say, but he has frequently been belittled about it so it must have an emotional impact. Friends and colleagues (women included) regularly teased him about being a "kept man", made comments about me wearing the trousers and so on, and his family, particularly his parents, have studiously ignored my career for over 30 years, telling people that yes, I have a little part time job with a six figure salary Not that things like this excuse the behaviour that the OP's husband is exhibiting but I think it does help to explain it. My DH is a very rational person - he knows that people's sly digs are actually misogynistic nonsense- but he can't always stop it getting under his skin. I find that it can help to remind him of all the stuff he does that I can't do, and that what we bring to the relationship can't be measured solely in £s.

^This

Is exactly what wore my DH down. I have always earned 3x to 2x what he earned because he’s in a public service low paid career field. My aunt would regularly warn him to “not spend all of Plans money”. We had neighbours refusing to speak to him and putting me because he wasn’t being “the provider”. Buying cars salespeople would say things like “you’re letting your wife spend your money like this?” (In front of me...). He had a tough time for awhile as he started to think he was not good enough of a husband and father because of the constant misogyny he was exposed to. Usually he was ok, but when he’s lost his job and been unemployed, it’s like all this comes back to haunt him and he has a crisis of self worth and self confidence.

I agree he needs to learn to vent these feelings without using OP as a punching bag. But just agreeing with @MrsAvocet that there is an extra societal stigma he struggling against being in the position of not being the breadwinner.

*pitying not putting

I have been where you are and where he is.
What we tend to do, irrespective of who earns what, is add our total pot of money together.
Take out all the necessities. In our case, mortgage, bills, food, ISA savings, family holiday fund, school fees. Split balance in two as each of our individual spending pot.

I am more frugal than he is so within my spend pot, I actually save a good bit or put it towards weekends away with my friends etc. But the point is, I am not accountable to him nor him to me and never of us have to ask the other for money. No one feels emasculated.

The bottom line is he needs to rationalise which compromise he's willing to make.

He can't have unlimited sympathy and support whilst railing against it being unfair.

I was the non-earner, so I can empathise but you have to value both your contribution & it's not all about income generation. But he needs to see that or generate enough income where he feels comfortable.

Bittom line is that you are not responsible for his mental health.

Too many bottom lines there...

Not sure what to suggest as you really can't change things for him, this is something he has to come to terms with himself.

Did you argue about money when he bit your head off, or is he just grumpy?

I'm the bigger earner in our household now. My dh used to earn lots but has chosen to take a less stressful job, which also means less money. I pay all the bills, mortgage etc, he pays for food and if we go out, take aways, pub lunch etc. I think this works for us as he is 'seen' to pay for stuff when we are out, whereas the mortgage and bills far outweigh his expenditure. We both end up with similar 'spends' at the end of each month, me probably more so.

Get a joint account, so he isn't having to wait to be given money.

I am the main earner in our family, and was the sole earner for a few years. All money is family money to which we have equal access. I couldn't work if dp hadn't had the dc so he is as entitled to the pay as I am.

@PegasusReturns

I don’t know what the answer is I’m afraid. In my own relationship I am aware of some tension due to the disparity in earning, aggravated by the fact that I don’t let my DH have unlimited access to my money.

The family money you mean…

Get a joint account, so he isn't having to wait to be given money

I disagree that this is the answer here.

OPs DH has chosen to run his own business, which takes his time and energy but at least from the OPs comments doesn’t seem entirely viable. In which case it’s basically a hobby and is detracting from him being able to pull his weight in other ways.

OP do you have children? What’s the split on the domestics?

The family money you mean…

@BillMasen no I don’t. Why should it be family money?

@sassbott can I just ask about this bit?

“ I asked him to do more around the house (to lift the burden off me since I was working such long hours) and you would have thought I had insulted him. He too was working long hours trying to get his new business off the ground, the difference being mine was paying the bills, his wasn’t. ”

That reads like you both worked long hours but you wanted him to take more of the burden at home because you were earning more? Is that right, or were you asking him to even things up at home?

@PegasusReturns

The family money you mean…

@BillMasen no I don’t. Why should it be family money?

I thought on here that the higher earner should fully share everything. I wonder if you’ll get the same response a man saying that would.

@BillMasen it was both.

He was working, but it wasn’t bringing in any income. I however had ramped up to a very full on job that was paying the bills and still had the bulk of domestic chores on my plate. Which was completely unacceptable. I wanted him to step up and take on equal in the home vs outside the home.

It would result in him biting my head off (similar to what the OP has described) re how hard he was working. To which my response was ‘and I’m not?

When he was earning more, and I bought in less I did 90-95% of the household chores/ domestic work. And had pre school children running around on the days I didn’t work. Out of respect for the fact that his job paid for the bills, my contribution was pulling my weight as much as I could domestically.

I expected the exact same once our positions were reversed.

[quote sassbott]@BillMasen it was both.

He was working, but it wasn’t bringing in any income. I however had ramped up to a very full on job that was paying the bills and still had the bulk of domestic chores on my plate. Which was completely unacceptable. I wanted him to step up and take on equal in the home vs outside the home.

It would result in him biting my head off (similar to what the OP has described) re how hard he was working. To which my response was ‘and I’m not?

When he was earning more, and I bought in less I did 90-95% of the household chores/ domestic work. And had pre school children running around on the days I didn’t work. Out of respect for the fact that his job paid for the bills, my contribution was pulling my weight as much as I could domestically.

I expected the exact same once our positions were reversed.[/quote]
That’s fair. I see a lot that a high earner using that to justify expecting the other partner to do more at home isn’t on. Expecting both to take on equal share is fair

@BillMasen if someone gives up work or takes a significant step back to look after young DC then it makes sense for money to be shared. In those circumstances I agree it’s family money because it’s en party is losing an income to take on other responsibilities.

I don’t think it need always apply. And I’m especially don’t think it need apply where one party has decided to take a drop in income just because that’s what they want to do

I think this is a tough one and not necessarily gendered. Because he used to earn more and could contribute fully and now, if I've understood correctly, he can't always pay his half of the bills. This big change in situation would be tough for anyone, and he's prob feeling massively disappointed that things aren't going his way. I don't think anyone really wants to not pull their weight financially. I know I'd struggle going from a high earner to a much lower earner. However that definitely doesn't give him the right to snap at you or take it out on you at all. And I'd be having a proper discussion with him over that.

My relationship is different, we've been together ten years, and I've always earned a lot more than him. At one point I earned more than double, but he has always wanted to pay half of our living costs. We don't share our money, but I do treat to more meals, house items, food shopping and holidays. He's never been cross with me for earning more, but then he's always been able to put in his half of the bills. I think if he couldn't, he'd probably feel a bit demeaned and frustrated with himself. As would I if I couldn't.

@DeborahAnnabel What you've written really resonates with me. I was never accountable to him and within the confines of what money actually comes in, he isn't to me. I think that's really important to both of us.

@Stompythedinosaur He has always been very against a joint account and I've honestly not seen the point until reading these comments. Maybe that would be an idea.

I’m a high earner and my DH is not, he has a perfectly good job with a decent salary but he is not a high earner and most likely never will be. He’s just not that type of person and I fully accept and love him for it. Without going into it what makes him not a career person also make him a really good partner for me.

The fact that we are both happy with his job and pay and not frustrated does make it a lot easier. But it has still been a big adjustment for him as he was always the main earner in previous relationships, and I am conscious of not making him feel emasculated as like it or not we do live in a world where men expect themselves to be providers.

We split expenses proportional to income by doing all of our spending on a joint credit card that is paid off before the end of the month and this and rent/bills being paid from my account. And he gives my a lump sum every month.

This means that his money is actually his and not mine, he’s not having to ask me for money or be given it to him by me. It also means that he is contributing and providing for everything, just at an equal proportion rather then amount.

He also does a lot of stuff which doesn’t earn money but saves it: fixing things, finding free/second hand furniture and restoring it, making things for me, keeping on top of the best deals, going to the market for vegetables, giving me lifts and so on.

I make a conscious effort to not buy something and ask him to fine or make it for me instead, or ask him for a lift or to pick up vegetables instead of getting an Uber or going to the nearest expensive convince shop myself as I know a his makes him happy and that he is providing beyond his salary.

I know this isn’t the exact same situation as you describe. I would just suggest focusing on what you as a couple need, what you want, and both trying to be satisfied with having what you need and working together towards what you want with acceptance of the limits of both of your earning potentials.

And also focusing on what he what he provides beyond his earnings. A lot of men get fixated with ‘I don’t earn enough therefore I have nothing to offer my partner’ but they do if it be emotional comfort, sex, conversation, company or so on, but need to hear a woman say ‘I need you’ or ‘I need this’ to know that

I'm the main earner and whilst DH does have a job it's variable and small earning but fits around the kids.

We have a joint account and he can spend what he likes (with in reason obviously) the same for me.
I've found the only time he got a bit stressed is when his DMum & Sis suggested I should be giving him an allowance (not sure how having an allowance is better than access to everything) it stuck in his head for a while but at the same time one of his oldest "friends" kept winding him up about not working. The same friend that hides income from his wife 🙄

I would pull your DP about his behaviour and to stop being ridiculous. We have had lots of talks about money and it seems to have worked for us.

Although sometimes he dies slip back into old habits. I am waiting for an inheritance to come through and he kept talking about it being my money after pulling him up a few times he's now stopped. It's our money I wouldn't dream of not sharing my good fortune with my partner.

@Sickoffamilydrama You have a point there really, I think my dp sees money I earn as my money at the moment. I don't but having been on the other side of the situation I realise how he feels. He clearly does not like using my card at all so me leaving it out and him being able to use it is probably a hiding to nothing. He just had to use it now and I could actually see how upset it made him. So something to think about there.

The way people make fun of men who don't out earn women is so ridiculous. Misogyny really does work both ways in that regard.

Before Covid I was out with my dp literally a stone's throw from our home. A group of people were going elsewhere, I was exhausted so said no thanks. My dp said he was going home with me. Absolutely would have been no issue if he wanted to go obviously. All of the men absolutely took the piss, "pussy whipped" and all that. The thing with misogyny is it doesn't get to you because of one comment, it wears you down over time.

As I said upthread no one would know who earned the money we spend but there is this focus on it being normal for a man and a woman in a relationship to behave in certain ways. I just want us to live our lives.

@A1b2c3d4e5f6g7 I do think when he could no longer pay half of the bills it affected him badly. However it would not be fair to have all of his income go into bills when I would have had funds spare each month.

We did previously have your kind of setup though, half all bills each and then the higher earner pays more for going out/trips etc.

When I was basically unemployed for almost a year I gravitated to doing all the home based stuff. Really, in a way I think this suited him. He earned and I cooked, cleaned and house faffed while making a bit of money here and there. He would never admit it, but that setup suited him. Eventually an opportunity came up and I went for it, and it's worked out.

@FictionalCharacter we are under each other's feet a bit too much actually. He feels a bit insecure I think, like I would just leave him and he'd be sunk. I don't know what to say to that other than I won't.

I think this is a him problem, not a you problem. As you've just pointed out it stems from insecurity.

Both my husband and I have been breadwinners at different times, way before we were married.

What has always worked for us is:

• joint account, but only for shared monthly outgoing (rent or mortgage, home insurance, food shop) Put in enough each month to cover the regular costs and slightly round up. After a few months whatever is left over is your 'fun' money, or it's joint savings for something big you want to buy together.
• who ever is earning more does the treats, e.g. buys takeaway, buys the cinema tickets.. whatever that is
• whoever is earning more has usually had to work more/longer hours, so the other person picks up more household tasks

There's an understanding that these things ebb and flow throughout your life together. You're a team at all times, sometimes you pick up the slack, sometimes you need additional support.