Should giant held-back-a-year child be allowed to play rugby out of year group?

[Onthetrain75]

There is a child in my son’s year 7 who would technically be a year 8 but has been held back for academic reasons. He’s a sturdy big child, I would say around 5ft 6 and 10 stone.

He’s a keen rugby player and is playing down a year to be with his class mates. But I’ve heard rumblings from other schools that parents aren’t happy he is playing under 12s when he should be under 13. Mostly I think they are concerned about safety of the other kids though I think they probably would also prefer the scores if he didn’t play.

I don’t know whether to say anything to his mum about the bad feeling that I know this is causing. What do you think?

YANBU - let him play with his mates
YABU - given his size and age he should be playing under 13s.

If you are well aware of Regulation 15 you will know it applies to schools and clubs.

This boy is in a lower academic year there fore he can play with that year (after an assessment for safety has been done) which knowing rugby schools and clubs will have been done. They are so hot on safety.

But, Op you could certainly ask the rugby master if that assessment had been done if the boy is indeed a giant!!

Thanks for all your comments. I can see that there is a real mix of opinions as to whether I should say anything to his mum or not. I think I will stay out of it and let the opposing teams raise it as an issue if they feel that strongly. There have been a lot of injuries inflicted upon the other sides but as many have pointed out this may just be poor coaching rather than the relative size of the children involved. I know nothing about rugby so will keep quiet.

@TeenMinusTests

'Held back for academic reasons' is unusual in the state system, unless he is an August born and was permitted to defer back in Reception.

not always. I know a child who was educated in the States until he was 10, but when the family returned to the UK he was placed in Y5 not Y6 because that was the best fit academically.

OP if it impacts on your child then you can raise it with the school, but otherwise its none of your business.

TobysGreatAunt Mon 11-Oct-21 22:55:17
“If you are well aware of Regulation 15 you will know it applies to schools and clubs.”

Don’t spoil the gossip-fest with facts........

DH broke his neck playing in a rugby match he was too young to be in when he was a teen. This isn't the type of game to just shrug your shoulders and priorities hurt feelings.

Prioritise

I’m a kiwi and kids rugby is by weight then age rather than just age once it was tackle rugby.

That way it’s fun and encouraging for all.

When you register your child to play they weigh them to ensure they are in the right division.
It’s not enjoyable if you get hurt and to try to reduce the risk of concussive brain injury.

Kids still get knocks but it’s not a 35kg 10 year old getting smashed by a 65kg 10 year old. (There is often 3 or more weight divisions)

Higher play retention, more opportunities to learn skills and it’s more enjoyable for all.

Personally I don't think Rugby should be in PE as some PE teachers are useless at coaching it. Where as a decent rugby coach can mitigate and teach correctly. Too many poor tackles in school rugby. Let them play rounders or football something non contact, as you are only making them run about for 40minutes not coaching a sport

I totally agree. My son only played tag rugby which I was glad about as he was always small for his age and is only about 5 foot 7 now.

As for telling his mum, it's not her fault her son is larger than average for his age, is it? He would be bigger than average even if he were in Y8, too. I dare say she hasn't made any decisions regarding what age group he plays with. If parents are concerned, they should be raising it with the school or club.

I’d tell the people worried to talk to the school about it. I do agree that it is potentially a safety issue - those regulations do allow for playing a year down if the child is in that academic year at school, but it also has to be “individually assessed” (not always that easy!) and that’s what they should be asking about, if they have safety concerns. But they shouldn’t be grumbling and gossiping about the boy.

@Onthetrain75

Thanks for all your comments. I can see that there is a real mix of opinions as to whether I should say anything to his mum or not. I think I will stay out of it and let the opposing teams raise it as an issue if they feel that strongly. There have been a lot of injuries inflicted upon the other sides but as many have pointed out this may just be poor coaching rather than the relative size of the children involved. I know nothing about rugby so will keep quiet.

No there really wasn't - not one person said you should raise it with his mother!!

ooh good spot!!
"No there really wasn't - not one person said you should raise it with his mother!!"

yep, YANANAYTYA

I think he should play with his class tbh. We are talking about kids sports, not the Olympics. It might give his team a slight advantage, but I don't think that outweighs the need for this child not to feel ostracised.

Excluding him would be wrong. There are people well over six foot in our year 7 so it’s never a level playing field in the first place?

@Underamour

Excluding him would be wrong. There are people well over six foot in our year 7 so it’s never a level playing field in the first place?

I can only conclude from this thread that a lot of people don’t know what 6ft looks like.

A 12 year old boy on the 99.6th centile for height is 168cm, or 5ft 6. Outliers exist but they are rare. I am six foot exactly and have been teaching for 17 years, meeting over 200 new year 7s every year. I think I’ve met one year 7 boy in that time who was close to my height, and none who were taller than me. A few in year 8 and quite a few more again in year 9.

My son was that size in Y7, should he have not been allowed to play with his school friends?

@ThanksItHasPockets. Agreed. I’ve been reading with amusement all the posts about these 6ft plus 12yo children that everyone claims to have here. I’ve watched a lot of mini and youth rugby over the years and have never seen these giant children.

In Scotland the issue is worse as due to there is regularly 15 months difference between eldest and youngest boys which in their early teens can make a massive difference in size and height. My 5ft6 12yo son is very young for his year group so plays down a year when they need additional players (can’t play up a year as he’s too young). The physical difference between him and the year below is huge so we always tell him to be gentle with the younger boys and be mindful of his power. It’s not ideal for him or the younger smaller kids so it’s much better and fairer if he plays with his age group.

@Hoppinggreen well actually no, players should be separated into weight categories for safety reasons (see above). Also, no one in his year (or any other) should be forced to participate in a contact sport.

Oh and was speak to ds2 about this today (he's in rugby rotation at school at the minute). He's 13 and one of the bigger kids (only 5'10" though not 6'). According to him what a lot the smaller boys do when the bigger ones come in to tackle is drop the ball and run, which doesnt sound like much fun for them. Ds1 who is small for his age agrees this is what he used to do because he "likes his teeth".

It's age based, which in England means that it aligns with the school years (unless you've been held back a year/put up a year, both of which I believe are very unusual), as the date is the age on 1 September.

In Scotland, this can cause complications as not only is the school cut off date 1 March, people can defer starting school (common for Jan/Feb, not so common Nov/Dec, extremely rare Oct). So many kids starting secondary school/S1 are still only technically U12 (Causes more problems for the girls as after primary school they can no longer play mixed contact rugby)

You're allowed to play up one age group, but not down an age group.

This applies both to schools and clubs.

I used to registration for the local rugby club and I'd regularly get parents of visiting team complaining loudly on the touch line that certain kids were "too old" (ie "too big") and I'd have to assure them that said child was well within the age range as I knew their date of birth.

There was one time when we were playing a combine U13/U14 team and they were complaining bitterly about one big lad in our team - who was actually U13

I agree that the NZ system which also assessed height/size is probably safer - but that's not what the RFU/SRU/WRU do