Low risk women/better birth facilities - unfair?

[Glassofshloer]

When DD was a baby we attended a breastfeeding appointment at my local stand-alone birth centre and WOW! To say it was gorgeous is an understatement - double bed, huge whirlpool bath thing, fairy lights and bouncy balls in every room. Looked like the Ritz compared to the tiny, dimly lit room on the CDU where I gave birth. Just a bed and some wall stickers of flowers

AIBU to think this is unfair on high risk/Consultant led women? And that we all deserve equal facilities, high risk or not? Fully prepared to be told IABU!

Also it’s easy to say all this with insight. But if you’d been left in a birthing center with fairy lights to bleed for hours until they sorted out transport to the nearest hospital, this would be a totally different threat.
I can see why you would be upset if you didnt get the nice birth you wanted; but if in the end you and baby are healthy i think the surroundings in which this miracle came to happen is not high up on the list.

@Glassofshloer the majority of those diagnosed with gestational diabetes (your example) end up getting induced or having a CS due to the size of the baby - this is how it has been with everyone I know personally who has been diagnosed anyway. You wouldn't be allowed on the MLU with either of those options. Those that aren't induced or have a CS need to have their blood sugar checked regularly throughout labour and delivery anyway, and then the baby's levels with be checked after birth. Those that give birth on the MLU are intended to be sent home a few hours after birth, they aren't really meant for mothers to stay on there for 12-24 hours + after their baby's are born which to me equals the reason as to why those with GD are not allowed to use it. The freestanding ones will likely be more flexible in regards to letting parents stay there longer as they are normally quieter however you would then require a hospital transfer if anything shows up in the results.
Regarding first time mums that require forceps or ventouse as soon as it is clear that labour is stalling they are moved immediately to the main delivery suite. Looking at the stats online there are more first time mums who don't need an assisted delivery than those that do. I didn't have an assisted delivery with DD and hopefully I won't need one this time, if I do and I am labouring on the MLU I know I will be moved.
I get it's frustrating but there are reasons why those with certain conditions are not allowed to use birthing centres, it's nothing personal.

@Monkeymilkshake

Also it’s easy to say all this with insight. But if you’d been left in a birthing center with fairy lights to bleed for hours until they sorted out transport to the nearest hospital, this would be a totally different threat. I can see why you would be upset if you didnt get the nice birth you wanted; but if in the end you and baby are healthy i think the surroundings in which this miracle came to happen is not high up on the list.

I don’t think you quite understand what I’m saying. I’m not objecting to being refused entry to an MLU, I’m saying I think it’s unfair that in an MLU you get better chance of using a pool, a bigger room and a double bed for the night, whereas in CDU you get a box room for a few hours followed by a night on a busy and stressful maternity ward full of crying babies. I just think ‘nice birth experiences’ shouldn’t be solely the domain of very low risk women - plenty of women on CDU could use a pool if only for part of their labour, as well as a double bed so they can relax overnight with their birth partner rather than be whisked off to a busy ward straight away.

But my thread isn’t about wanting to use an MLU @mummyh2016

See my previous post

Completely agree. Such salt in the wound of having an (already more challenging) higher risk pregnancy. I was consultant led due to anxiety-related high blood pressure readings... pretty sure the midwife led unit would have been much better for my blood pressure and I suspect I would have had far healthier births than I did in the labour ward. The system is extremely un-nuanced and flawed.

Low risk women get lied to and told that MW led units in the community, half an hour from hospital, are safe. I don't give a shit about fairy lights - if I'd have been in one of those community units I'd likely have a brain damaged daughter.

I agree we wouldn’t need mlu if labour wards had better rooms. I didn’t mind the medical equipment and I laboured in the bed as there was no where else to go. A bigger room would have been amazing.

I couldn't have given a fuck.

@Glassofshloer but you're complaining that the facilities aren't the same. I've explained in another post why they aren't the same. Then you've posted saying some births that the NHS categorises as high risk aren't which implies to me that you think those should be allowed on an MLU, and I've advised the reason why your examples would not be allowed on an MLU I'm confused now!
It would be fantastic if every room on a delivery suite had all the equipment for a high risk birth as well as a double bed, mood lighting and a birth pool. Please see my earlier post regarding the lighting that was brought in at a hospital near me, it wouldn't be hard for patients to arrange that themselves if that's what they wanted. Unfortunately though if people expect a double bed and birthing pool in every room (can I add my MLU only have pools in 3 out of 5 rooms and don't actually have double beds) the rooms would need to be double the size. Which would then mean half the number of rooms - you already hear people complaining they are stuck on the labour ward when they are on the verge of pushing due to no beds, it would be horrendous if every hospital had half the number of beds they currently have.

Then you've posted saying some births that the NHS categorises as high risk aren't which implies to me that you think those should be allowed on an MLU, and I've advised the reason why your examples would not be allowed on an MLU

Sorry if I confused you, what I meant with my ‘GD / first time mum’ example was to show how things like birth pools can still be made good use of on the CDU as well as the MLU. If that makes sense. Plus if CDU women are in the room longer, they deserve nicer surroundings more IMO! Lol

@JoborPlay

I couldn't have given a fuck.

Me neither. Planning fairy lights and candles is a displacement activity. Better to get used to putting your own wishes at the bottom of the pile!

Also @mummyh2016 your post explains the criteria for the MLU, but not why the facilities need to be better?

Mummyh2016 - Wow! I hallucinated on the gas and air and thought a generic painting on the wall of my magnolia hospital box room was an actual wheat field, if the room had looked like that I'd probably have thought I was being abducted by aliens! :D

@Glassofshloer

Then you've posted saying some births that the NHS categorises as high risk aren't which implies to me that you think those should be allowed on an MLU, and I've advised the reason why your examples would not be allowed on an MLU

Sorry if I confused you, what I meant with my ‘GD / first time mum’ example was to show how things like birth pools can still be made good use of on the CDU as well as the MLU. If that makes sense. Plus if CDU women are in the room longer, they deserve nicer surroundings more IMO! Lol

They would only be on delivery for up to a couple of hours post birth before moving onto a ward so even if they had a double bed in there you wouldn't really benefit from it as let's be honest once you've had skin to skin and had a shower it's time to be moved. Is it more the private room you would prefer afterwards in that case rather than the big bed etc whilst you're giving birth? If it is then I get it - the only reason I went on an MLU was because I didn't want to go on a noisy ward afterwards. The trouble is though if they make every postnatal ward full of private rooms with no actual ward with bays in it will mean even less beds so hospitals would then have to accept less births. My hospital is already ridiculously busy as they closed a maternity unit at another hospital around 6 years ago, it just wouldn't work. At one point people in my area were being told to travel 20 miles to give birth despite there being 3 maternity units closer than that. I can't see any way they could make all private rooms a thing sadly.

I know what you’re saying op and completely agree. I had a 2.1litre pph after my first and had to be consultant led the second time. I felt very stressed in the medical environment because of what happened before.
Some mood lighting and candles would’ve been great.

Most of the women on the consultant led bit are either going through a rough time or have had a rough time before. I’d say it’s more important for these rooms to be as calming and look as non clinical as possible?

I'd love to give birth in a MLU. I was high risk and induced with DD due to IUGR. I was pinned down to a bed, wires everywhere for 8+ hours, unable to even move an inch as the monitors would lose her heartbeat.
Now I'm high risk with DD#2 as we're under the care of FMU. Even if we get signed off from them, I'm still high risk due to previous IUGR .
Bouncing on a ball or having a water birth in a lovely room is a distant dream for me.

Yes there is definitely an unfair gap, my trust has a lovely birth centre upstairs and delivery suite downstairs, which has been refurbished but it’s still very clinical. I always move the furniture round when I have a lady on delivery suite, make it look more welcoming, have lights turned off and lamp on, bring mat, bean bag and birthing ball in. Take unnecessary equipment such as drip stand out, can always bring in if needed.

@mummyh2016 yes and use of a pool/generally nicer surroundings. I know this isn’t the case for every MLU and every room in them but overall they’re much nicer than CDU.

And I agree about the funding, I’m just talking about it in a pie-in-the-sky, nice-to-have kind of way.

YADNBU!! I attempted first labour on the midwife-led unit in the hospital, it was very nice and then I needed more help so off to labour ward. Both subsequent births also labour ward due to risk of same complications, it was very much a clinical environment. I had to have my anti-D injection at the standalone birth centre (for what reason I don't know) and by God it was like a luxury hotel, I could have cried knowing that would never be my experience. Plenty of midwives sitting round twiddling their thumbs there too.
Good question as to why those facilities clearly have more funding than the labour wards.....

@sayanythingelse

I'd love to give birth in a MLU. I was high risk and induced with DD due to IUGR. I was pinned down to a bed, wires everywhere for 8+ hours, unable to even move an inch as the monitors would lose her heartbeat. Now I'm high risk with DD#2 as we're under the care of FMU. Even if we get signed off from them, I'm still high risk due to previous IUGR . Bouncing on a ball or having a water birth in a lovely room is a distant dream for me.

I understand how you feel, I have a pre-existing condition which means I will always need inducing at max 39 weeks, so unlikely to go into spontaneous labour - and even if I did, it would be CDU for me!

I have a fantasy that my next birth will be induced by gel only enabling me to use the pool, but I’ll probably be a good girl and go for lying on the bed/wires/epidural again…

@Mummyme87

Yes there is definitely an unfair gap, my trust has a lovely birth centre upstairs and delivery suite downstairs, which has been refurbished but it’s still very clinical. I always move the furniture round when I have a lady on delivery suite, make it look more welcoming, have lights turned off and lamp on, bring mat, bean bag and birthing ball in. Take unnecessary equipment such as drip stand out, can always bring in if needed.

I take it you’re a midwife @Mummyme87 and you sound a lovely one!

Honestly as a women who’s birthed in midwife led, homebirthed and birthed in the pool at the hospital.

I couldn’t of given a shiney shite about the lighting and radio etc that I was offered in the pool room. In fact when the midwife asked me if I would like them on I told her if she wanted them on to feel free but I didn’t care.

I’m not sure who these lights and what not are for. We go in push out a baby and go home do we really need mood like and sage flowing everywhere

@Alleycat02

YADNBU!! I attempted first labour on the midwife-led unit in the hospital, it was very nice and then I needed more help so off to labour ward. Both subsequent births also labour ward due to risk of same complications, it was very much a clinical environment. I had to have my anti-D injection at the standalone birth centre (for what reason I don't know) and by God it was like a luxury hotel, I could have cried knowing that would never be my experience. Plenty of midwives sitting round twiddling their thumbs there too. Good question as to why those facilities clearly have more funding than the labour wards.....

They don't have more funding, if anything they have less funding due to less staff. It likely looks like they have more funding as everything normally tends to look newer on an MLU, this is only because birthing centres are a relatively new concept so they haven't been open that long. When I gave birth the midwife who delivered my baby was a community midwife - they had all had messages begging them to work on the MLU on their day off as they had no staff. I was the first birth she had done in X amount of months so understandably she was put on there rather than on the main delivery suite.

[quote Glassofshloer]**@mummyh2016* yes and use of a pool/generally nicer surroundings. I know this isn’t the case for every MLU and every* room in them but overall they’re much nicer than CDU.

And I agree about the funding, I’m just talking about it in a pie-in-the-sky, nice-to-have kind of way.[/quote]
Have you checked to see if you can pay for a private room postnatal? I hope you get a birth that you feel comfortable with afterwards, maybe ask your midwife if you can take your own lighting in to make you feel more at ease. Good luck