AIBU to think the bar for men is low?

[CecilieRose]

Inspired by the post about 'decent men', this question has come to my mind.

I follow a woman on Instagram who did a shoutout post to her boyfriend last weekend for cancelling his plans so she could go to the doctor about the mastitis she was suffering from because of breastfeeding. She called him a 'hero'.

Like, honestly? This is where the bar is these days? A man is a hero for cancelling plans to watch sport in the pub to look after his OWN CHILD while his partner is at the doctor? What on earth was he thinking even going to the pub all day with a sick partner and six-week-old baby at home?

She was also raving about how great he was for 'helping' carry the baby out of the hospital when they were taking him home. She'd just given birth and had a long and awful labour - he's a 6'4 huge man! And there she was acting as if he's some god for carrying his own child in a car seat.

It makes me want to weep with how little so many women put up with. And not only put up with, but think is great, and boast about. I find it genuinely a bit pathetic and also wonder what on earth they've put up with in the past to think the absolute bare minimum is 'amazing'.

AIBU?

@goinggently

We have two laundry baskets... one for my clothes, one for his. It's just been that way since we moved in together. I do my washing, he does his own, though we might say "do you have any whites? etc". I think this is completely unremarkable, but when it's come up in conversation with friends they think it's extremely weird. Like I'm supposed to be doing all his washing or something just because we live together? Is it weird...??

I'd think it's unusual. But I wouldn't be expecting you to do his. I'd just expect washing to be done communally. My partner does most of ours. Are they actually saying you should do his washing? Or do they just think most couples do their washing together?

@Moonface123

But this begs the question then why is it most women seem incapable of living without a man in their lives ? A lot of women shouting from the rooftops regarding men's poor behaviour, yet at the same time enabling it by putting up with stuff they shouldnt. A lot of women desperate to leave relationships, yet an awful lot also whinging and moaning about being on their own, finding a man is their only answer, jumping straight out of the fat into the fire, and repeat. I live happily alone, l am not looking for anyone else, but l don't know many others in real life that have same mentality.

This. In stone tablets

I'll never forget the song and dance a good friend made when we went on a hen weekend and her husband was 'alone with three children' She was relentless about his achievement.

@Winecurestiredness

Millennial men have been babied. I say this as a Millennial myself....boys , when i was growing up got all the special treatment from female teachers, and instead the girls were picked on more. A dyslexic girl would be encouraged to try harder, but a dyslexic boy would get a big well done and extra attention if he read 1 page of a book. Now that i have two DSs im trying to be careful not to smother them or baby them....

It's what happens when men grow up without a strong father figure.

YANBU I just about spat when my ex SIL told my ex H ' ooh you do so much don't you?' I still don't know what it was she was referring to. She never said to me ' ooh you do so much don't you?' despite the fact that I do far more than he ever did.

But that was it. I could never renegotiate equal share of chores after that, as any attempt to was met with ' I do so much, even the impartial observer of my sister says so!' He already thought he was an A grade feminist as he washed up and hoovered occasionally.

It bloody gives me the boil when men expect praise, or praise themselves, for looking after their own house and child.

Yes,. the bar is low for men, but men don't see it. And neither do a lot of women.

@WizardOfAus

Attached is the “Laugh With Mummy” blogger’s response when people told her she needs a better husband who will treat her like an equal.

… Apparently we just need to “get a sense of humour” and put up with men treating women like shit.

What a pickme.

There's another one like this I used to follow on Instagram, because she posted amazing recipes and cooking videos. She made this post the other day making fun of people who message her to say her husband takes her for granted, doesn't pull his weight, etc. The thing is....they're right. He literally games all day long. She spends hours making him food and puts it down next to him so he doesn't have to stop gaming. They never seem to eat together. He never helps with the food. She posted the other day about he asked her to make salmon even though she hates it and it makes her feel sick since she was pregnant. How selfish and inconsiderate of him...unbelievable!

I truly don't get it. How can she not see how shit her husband is? How can she actually have the gall to make a video mocking people for thinking she's a skivvy when she literally is a skivvy? Does she think it's normal to slave in the kitchen for hours and not even get a thank you when she puts the plate down? He doesn't even look at her. Do these women just truly believe this is what relationships are supposed to be like? It's baffling. Even the relationships I considered 'bad' were far better than this.

I've always felt like the worse the relationship, the more they put lovey dovey photos and messages on social media, or boast about how good it is. As if they're trying to convince themselves, almost?

Yes, I've noticed this too.

But people are odd in general about posting. I know someone who is always going on about how great her husband is on sm. I know him, and I think he's probably a good husband though an insufferable twit. He pulls his weight and isn't cruel or mean, is a good dad. But they are both very self-congratulatory on sm all the time. They seem to believe it is encouraging to others somehow.

@WizardOfAus that post is ridiculous, there was a whole thread on here about it. It’s similar to the posts you sometimes see where a woman talks about how her other half, bless his little heart, tried to do something that was just beyond him (like cook a meal, or load the dishwasher or dress the children), and because he’s just such a silly man she had to swoop in. The posts generally end with “what’s he like!”
An incompetent twit, that’s what he’s like.

I agree OP and one consequence whilst not to be defended is that too many men think such awful behaviour is acceptable.

Doomscrolling that sounds infuriating!

I keep reading women in Facebook cleaning pages moaning about their useless husbands and they get so many replies along the lines of
"at least he's trying"
"count yourself lucky he even does small things to help, mine doesn't lift a finger"
"Aww, bless him. Don't get mad at him, praise him for making an effort"

It's so very depressing.

The bar for men is so low its a tavern in Hades!

@LobsterNapkin

I've always felt like the worse the relationship, the more they put lovey dovey photos and messages on social media, or boast about how good it is. As if they're trying to convince themselves, almost?

Yes, I've noticed this too.

But people are odd in general about posting. I know someone who is always going on about how great her husband is on sm. I know him, and I think he's probably a good husband though an insufferable twit. He pulls his weight and isn't cruel or mean, is a good dad. But they are both very self-congratulatory on sm all the time. They seem to believe it is encouraging to others somehow.

It's absolutely cringe how narcissistic some people are. Someone on my Twitter timeline tweeted praise he'd been emailed from someone at a conference he was at. Is it just me or is that a bit pathetic? I was brought up to be modest and not sing my own praises. If I got an email like that it would make me happy, I might tell my mum or my partner but I certainly wouldn't tweet it to hundreds of followers to brag about how amazing I am!

• I don't think that Mumsnet helps the situation.

The men that some women post about are so dreadful that I think some women are grateful for any crumbs at all.*

You are not kidding 🤣

@BreadPita

It's sort of relative, isn't it? I always think back to that OkCupid study that showed that most women think that most men are below average in attractiveness. Statistically, it makes no sense, but I think we alla understand where it was coming from. In terms of children, relatively few men compared to women seem to actively want to parent so of course the ones that do get more adulation than a woman doing the exact same thing.

At the same time though a lot of the time it's the deadbeat bad boy who is deemed attractive and then lo and behold turns out to be a waster.

@Neonplant I get this, though I've learned the hard way before with cashmere being shrunk in the washing machine etc!

@RightOnTheEdge

The bar for men is so low it's a tavern in Hades!

I love this and I'm stealing it!

I remember people gushing at work about this guy we worked with... 'oh and he makes muffins with his kids!!' as if he was some god.

His wife just did everything else

At the same time though a lot of the time it's the deadbeat bad boy who is deemed attractive and then lo and behold turns out to be a waster.

^^

This.

There was a thread on here recently, qualities you look for in a man. Tall, tattooed and a big dick were the top 3

Ex DP thinks he is the best dad in the world. He has them 4 nights a month, pays minimum amount of child maintenance required by law and often misses a payment or comes up with an excuse as to why he can't have the dc. But because he doesn't beat them, abuse them, or abandon them entirely he thinks he's dad of the year.

There was a thread on here recently, qualities you look for in a man. Tall, tattooed and a big dick were the top 3

Christ that’s depressing. My first three wouldn’t include physical attributes or looks at all.

I was watching Cinema Therapy on YouTube earlier while my son was napping and one of the guys on there said something like: “If you never learn to swim on your own you’ll cling to whatever slimy piece of driftwood that floats by” and it resonated with me so much.

I really had no idea how someone goes about starting their adult life independently and didn’t want to be on my own and I think that’s why I tried so hard to make my relationship work. 11 years I stuck with a guy who honestly had a few red flags at the start. Now that I’m a single mum I’m really discovering how to live alone and I love it. I think a lot of people don’t take the time to learn to be alone, like we see single women as sad or lonely. I’m actually loving it now, and if I ever do date again, I will have much higher standards because I don’t NEED to be with someone.

The bar is quite low for men. My ex sees his son once a week (if he doesn’t cancel), gives me £30 a month and never takes our son out, just plonks him in front of the TV. But he’s a “good dad”.

My ex was pretty hands on with the kids and did as much as me around the house, he rarely did any of the life admin stuff like dentists appointments but otherwise he was an actual partner.

My mum and my auntie's thought the sun shone out of him and continually went on about what a great dad he was. No one ever told me I was a great mum despite me doing as much if not more than him. It was expected of me but not him.

I completely agree. What a "wonderful father" someone is for "babysitting" their own offspring or deigning to wash their own clothes/cook/basically behave as an adult. It is supremely shit that the average standards men are measured against are so, so low.
Are adult men not as capable as adult women ffs?!

It's so infuriating! One of my friends always moans to me about how useless her husband is and "aren't men idiots" etc etc and just seems to assume that is the standard for men. When I say that my DH bought our DS's shoes, or did the food shopping, picked out a kids birthday present or cleaned the house she looks at me as if I've just grown an extra head. The saying "you've trained him well" drives me up the wall - no, I haven't trained my husband, he's not a dog. I just didn't settle for someone who is incapable of going to Next and picking out some new clothes for our son like her husband, who apparently finds it all overwhelming. 🙄
My dad is the absolute worst for it though. My mum died when I was a child so my dad had to raise both me and my sibling alone for several years. So he's perfectly capable of cooking meals, washing clothes, cleaning etc. But he's remarried and as much as I love my stepmum she does absolutely everything for him while he feigns ignorance and potters around doing his hobbies and getting praise for all the stuff he has time to do. He couldn't find a jumper in his wardrobe once and had to call her up to help him look for it when it was right in front of him the entire time. Baffles me how my stepmum just accepts this helplessness - not a chance my husband would get away with that shit, but then I like to think I haven't settled for someone who would do that.

Try being a lone dad, people either think you’re some sort of super hero or too incompetent to manage on your own.

“How do you look after him on your own?” Erm, I’m his dad it’s literally that simple. Probably the ones who are raising sons to be incompetent and daughters to be staff, then they’re surprised that their son can’t find a decent partner and their daughters accept shite like its normal.

You get it with professionals as well, I’ve been at consultant appointments and been told “we’ll wait for mum” when I’m sat there waiting to be updated about my sons health. You’d think intelligent people wouldn’t be quite so stupid.

A mum at a toddler group once asked who cooked dinner and was genuinely impressed when I said me, what did she think we did, have staff or live on takeout?!