To hate the term 'Cool girl'

[EmotionalSupportBear]

Especially the way its used on here, like its some kind of offence to not be a controlling twatbag of a wife/girlfriend?

I'm currently single.. but yes, i let my ExH have female friends, and i let him dress however he liked, and i let him go out whenever he wanted.

Its not being a 'cool girl' its not been done for 'good wife brownie points' [boak] its about believing that your partner loves you and wants to be with you, and trusting that.

If they're going to stray, they will stray, and no amount of trying to prevent them from living their life alongside yours will prevent that. (ftr i left mine because he WAS an abusive twatbag)

No-one is virtue signalling. Can we please just stop insulting and degrading other women with this 'cool wife' shit.

I wish women who have boundaries and refuse to be doormats were not called ‘controlling’.

Controlling is telling someone they can’t do something.
Having boundaries is telling someone they can’t do something and expect to stay in a happy relationship with you. There is a difference.

I wish women who have boundaries and refuse to be doormats were not called ‘controlling’.

Having boundaries is not controlling. A number of threads on here become insane very rapidly with advice that husbands/boyfriends should not have female friends, should not socialise independently, should answer messages immediately and should be routinely secretly checked on.

That is controlling and it's those MNers that call anyone who suggests healthy advice about having an honest conversation a cool girl.

@donquixotedelamancha

If I'm a cool girl then my husband is a cool boy too.

No, it doesn't work that way. A man being jealous of your friends or checking up on you is an abusive dick- your husband is normal but you are letting the side down if you don't have a tracker on his phone.

Awk silly me!! Suppose I'm going to have to forbid him from playing football tonight too!

@OlympicProcrastinator

I wish women who have boundaries and refuse to be doormats were not called ‘controlling’.

Controlling is telling someone they can’t do something.
Having boundaries is telling someone they can’t do something and expect to stay in a happy relationship with you. There is a difference.

Bingo.

But isn't it interesting that it's the OP, the one objecting to the 'cool girls' label, that's a) using insulting and derogatory language against other women, and b), using the language of control, in assuming they are 'letting' their partners do such-and-such?

The idea that you're allowing someone do a particular thing seems to imply you're not altogether comfortable with it; not least that whatever behaviour your Dear Heart is indulging in, it's somehow within your jurisdiction. If that isn't controlling, I don't know what is.

Women who assert healthy boundaries about what they are willing and unwilling to accept are not the ones indulging in the control freakery here.

And this is also misogyny talking, as signalled loudly and clearly by the derogatory language used against other women. 'Internalized misogyny' are two words these types also hate. They're very apt.

donquixotedelamancha, I once got called controlling (amongst insecure and juvenile I believe) because I agreed with an OP that I wouldn’t be best pleased if my DH told his ex she looked stunning in her dress at a ‘do’ they were all on.

Now to me, controlling would be the examples you gave above. Agreed. However, I am entitled to decide for myself what I am happy with in a relationship and the sort of man I wish to date. That’s not me being a controlling twat. I think a lot of women get called ‘cool girl’ because they have almost no boundaries and behave like complete walkovers, calling other women who have limits ‘controlling’ as they go. Works both ways.

Suppose I'm going to have to forbid him from playing football tonight too!

Better still, let him go but follow him, you can't be too careful.

I am entitled to decide for myself what I am happy with in a relationship and the sort of man I wish to date.

Of course. I think it's fine to find it a bit weird that (for example) some women don't mind men having private dances at strip clubs. Each to there own but that seems nuts to me.

But there are some properly mental threads on here where OP's get terrible advice suggesting it's normal to behave abusively. I think that's what OP is describing.

A “cool girl” is not a woman that trusts her man.

A “cool girl” is a a woman, so lacking in esteem and sense of her own value that she will allow a man to control and denigrate her as he wishes so that she never suffers the ignominy of being thought of as a “nag” or some other such misogynistic slur.

But there are some properly mental threads on here where OP's get terrible advice suggesting it's normal to behave abusively. I think that's what OP is describing.

In fairness, it's probably sample bias that these are the only threads where I've been called a cool girl- because i wouldn't chip in suggesting caution where someone is just exercising boundaries.

Nonetheless it's certainly a thing.

When I read Gone Girl I thought Cool Girl summed up a way of behaving perfectly and still think it does (have been one myself when younger)

The term seems a bit dated now. But Cool Wife/Girl I understand what it implies

@donquixotedelamancha

I am entitled to decide for myself what I am happy with in a relationship and the sort of man I wish to date.

Of course. I think it's fine to find it a bit weird that (for example) some women don't mind men having private dances at strip clubs. Each to there own but that seems nuts to me.

But there are some properly mental threads on here where OP's get terrible advice suggesting it's normal to behave abusively. I think that's what OP is describing.

Saying it’s “weird” or “nuts”, though, is where people’s hackles are raised and discussion becomes pointless, because those are just value judgements based on your own personal feelings.

I think it’s fine to say “I can’t understand any woman being fine with that because I have serious issues with the sex industry and also I know I’m prone to jealousy and couldn’t stand the thought of my OH looking at another woman in a sexual way.” Because that then opens dialogue where other women can say “having considered and thought it through, I don’t share those same reservations about the sex industry; and it’s really interesting to me to hear some women talk about sexual jealousy when it comes to their partner because I honestly just don’t experience that as an emotion.”

And we all learn so much more about each other’s perspectives and viewpoints, and have the opportunity to explore them, than we do by throwing around “cool girl” or “nuts” as insults.

I think it’s fine to say “I can’t understand any woman being fine with that because I have serious issues with the sex industry and also I know I’m prone to jealousy and couldn’t stand the thought of my OH looking at another woman in a sexual way.

How patronising can you get?

I'm not prone to bloody jealousy in the least. I DO have an issue with the type of man who would willingly objectify a woman - any woman - in this way. Aside from everything else, and all the million-and-one things that are wrong with this, it would also start to make me question how he viewed me. I couldn't feel the same way about such a man again.

And no, I can't understand any woman being fine with that. But that's me, and those are my boundaries. But quit with the petty jibes about sexual jealousy. It's childish.

Saying it’s “weird” or “nuts”, though, is .... just value judgements based on your own personal feelings.

Yes. I thought I made it clear that was exactly the case.

And we all learn so much more about each other’s perspectives and viewpoints, and have the opportunity to explore them, than we do by throwing around “cool girl” or “nuts” as insults.

It's AIBU, I don't really care about being tactless and (my point was) that I think 'cool girl' is fine if it's just a rude way of saying 'I don't agree about reasonable boundary X.'

Where I see it being used a lot is to denigrate women who just don't think it's OK to coercively control male partners. That is what, I think, OP is objecting too.

why are people being weird about the term 'let my Ex'

how would you phrase it better? i can't think of any language where you can convey that your partner was allowed/let/permitted to do whatever they liked without it sounding that way.

There was no permission implied in that, he didn't require my permission, because i didn't expect him to ask, just to let me know where he was going out of courtesy... unlike myself who DID have to 'ask' permission, and was frequently told no because he didn't want to babysit his own kids.

I am finding it amusing that some are getting offended at my 'derogatory' language about controlling wives/spouses. I have quite clearly said, if you aren't being controlling, it doesn't apply to you.

If any of you ARE taking offence, perhaps you ought to be looking a little closer at your behaviour in regards to your spouse/partner, and where the line is between respecting boundaries, and controlling their behaviour/lifestyle.

@MarieIVanArkleStinks

I think it’s fine to say “I can’t understand any woman being fine with that because I have serious issues with the sex industry and also I know I’m prone to jealousy and couldn’t stand the thought of my OH looking at another woman in a sexual way.

How patronising can you get?

I'm not prone to bloody jealousy in the least. I DO have an issue with the type of man who would willingly objectify a woman - any woman - in this way. Aside from everything else, and all the million-and-one things that are wrong with this, it would also start to make me question how he viewed me. I couldn't feel the same way about such a man again.

And no, I can't understand any woman being fine with that. But that's me, and those are my boundaries. But quit with the petty jibes about sexual jealousy. It's childish.

But not wanting anything to do with men who would objectify women is just your viewpoint. For some women it wouldn’t be because they particularly care about women being objectified or sex workers, but because they would be jealous of their OH finding another woman sexually attractive. Which is the whole point of this thread: not all women have think alike or have the same motivations.

My post wasn’t directed at you, it was a broader point about women not having a hive mind. I apologise if I came across as trying to insult you personally. I wasn’t responding to something posted by you so wouldn’t have assumed you’d take it personally.

Jeez this thread is depressing, women using this term to shut other women down and claiming that they’re doing it for the good of women.

What a load of shite. Used on here, more often than not, it’s used to close down anyone who doesn’t get worked up about controlling their partner’s behaviour. It belittles women and makes an assumption that if a woman has a different view from the dominant view on a thread it’s because they can’t think for themselves. Which is ironic really.

@donquixotedelamancha

Suppose I'm going to have to forbid him from playing football tonight too!

Better still, let him go but follow him, you can't be too careful.

Very good point

@PegasusReturns

A “cool girl” is not a woman that trusts her man.

A “cool girl” is a a woman, so lacking in esteem and sense of her own value that she will allow a man to control and denigrate her as he wishes so that she never suffers the ignominy of being thought of as a “nag” or some other such misogynistic slur.

I don't think you're getting any of this from the OED. But usually when the expression is used on Mumsnet it's applied to someone who is a cool wife in the first sense to mean that really she must be a cool wife in the second sense but she's in denial, too ashamed to say so or too oppressed by the patriarchy to see it!

Depending on what the 'thing' is, I think I'm sometimes cool and sometimes a controlling twatbag.

I am finding it amusing that some are getting offended at my 'derogatory' language about controlling wives/spouses. I have quite clearly said, if you aren't being controlling, it doesn't apply to you.

Is it possible you are projecting your inclination to take things personally?Could that be the reason why the term cool girl is so upsetting for you? Some of us are single by choice and take issue with your use of insulting language to describe women who may think differently to you.

@MurielSpriggs that’s not how I’ve seen it used. Although judging from this thread people do use it both ways.

Personally I like the GG description, it was apt and I suppose the sort of women who are ok with their men snorting coke off a strippers arse or being otherwise sexually incontinent whilst also failing to ever get up with the baby/indulging in seven hour cycling hobby sessions/watching porn whilst minding the toddler are too oppressed to see the reality of their situation and therefore blind to it.

If any of you ARE taking offence, perhaps you ought to be looking a little closer at your behaviour in regards to your spouse/partner, and where the line is between respecting boundaries, and controlling their behaviour/lifestyle.

Not really. I have never had any need or desire to control my husband's behaviour, so I know your description doesn'tapply to me. That doesn't mean I think it's ok to be offensive about women whose boundaries and expectations in a relationship may be different from yours. Controlling behaviour is unacceptable. However, it may well be that what you might consider 'controlling' would be considered as having high standards, solid self-esteem and good boundaries by many or most women.

I'm not a cool girl and proud to have strong boundaries. My dp has not so strong boundaries but it has caused him not end of grief( his ex cheated with a "friend"etc). I like to keep my fortress strong and if that makes me an uptight bitch then so be it!